ATT Cracks down on tethering.... (and buys TMo)

Since tethering increases the potential bandwidth usage above and beyond what you'd use with just the phone, I think AT&T is justified in charging more for a tethering plan.

Everything takes more bandwidth these days, and there's this general sense of entitlement to it. Bandwidth is very expensive to provide and companies that invest in the infrastructure to offer it have to get revenue for it or they will go out of business.
 
Trapper John said:
Ugh. I absolutely can't stand Sprint, so I guess that leaves Verizon?
Click to expand...

Celluar depends on where you live, of course, and around here you couldn't pay me to use Verizon. FWIW around here, never had any call or data issues with Sprint. Customer service? Meh, they all suck, but ATT the least around here.

Still ****es me off the US doesn't have a single cell standard. GSM or CDMA (I don't care) just pick one!
 
JesseD said:
Still ****es me off the US doesn't have a single cell standard. GSM or CDMA (I don't care) just pick one!
Click to expand...
That is what the free market does.

BTW with Verizon going to LTE, ATT/TMo using LTE and even Sprint going towards LTE things are coalescing around a single standard or at least a set that are interoperable.

I say that because even in GSM lands they are multi-standard with GSM for voice and a variety of HSPA standards for high speed packet access data. But at least there is interoperbility between them as they are designed as a family of technology. LTE and then LTE-Advanced will be the same way and you are far more likely to get multi-mode chip sets for the phones that will support all of the technologies without you really being able to tell what the radio is talking when it comes to a radio protocol.
 
At my house in the boonies both AT&T and Verizon were both quite sketchy. Verizon put up a cell tower nearby so I was waiting for the service to get better. After about 6 months it seems like they have turned it on so Verizon is much better than AT&T in that location.

At my mom's condo in SFO they were also both pretty bad but AT&T has improved their service over the past year while Verizon has not. I'm looking at my Verizon USB wireless indicator now and it only has one bar (sometimes it has none but it still works) where my AT&T iPhone has 3 bars and sometimes 4.

I'm thinking of getting a new iPhone when the new model comes out this summer because I have a 3G right now. I would like to ditch the Verizon USB wireless account because it's pretty expensive. I still have about 6 months left on the contract, though. I don't know whether to go to Verizon for the new iPhone or stick with AT&T. I guess it will depend on whether AT&T improves their service at my house in the next few months to match Verizon. It also depends on whether Verizon's service in SFO improves as well.
 
wsuffa said:
AND they're buying TMo. Guess I'll have to rethink my blackberry service as I expect them to dump the international unlimted email plan immediately.... and raise prices.
Click to expand...
Saw that earlier today. Say "look out below" to T stock on Monday! :hairraise:
 
ScottM said:
That is what the free market does.

BTW with Verizon going to LTE, ATT/TMo using LTE and even Sprint going towards LTE things are coalescing around a single standard or at least a set that are interoperable.

I say that because even in GSM lands they are multi-standard with GSM for voice and a variety of HSPA standards for high speed packet access data. But at least there is interoperbility between them as they are designed as a family of technology. LTE and then LTE-Advanced will be the same way and you are far more likely to get multi-mode chip sets for the phones that will support all of the technologies without you really being able to tell what the radio is talking when it comes to a radio protocol.
Click to expand...

Scott, how do you think integration will go between AT&T and T-Mobile systems? Back when I gave a darn (on T-Mobile and trying to decide on an interesting phone), I recall they had non-overlapping frequencies in the US. I think it was 850 for AT&T and 900 for T-Mob? So, I had to buy the right tri-band model to use with either carrier, or get a quad-band and be covered for everybody.

Or will this not matter with the LTE conversion?
 
rpadula said:
Scott, how do you think integration will go between AT&T and T-Mobile systems? Back when I gave a darn (on T-Mobile and trying to decide on an interesting phone), I recall they had non-overlapping frequencies in the US. I think it was 850 for AT&T and 900 for T-Mob? So, I had to buy the right tri-band model to use with either carrier, or get a quad-band and be covered for everybody.

Or will this not matter with the LTE conversion?
Click to expand...
Well I think the big reason that the acquisition happened is because it meant that ATT got access to new spectrum. Once this all gets approved bringing the networks together won't be too hard. It will be having devices that support all the profiles for those bands. I think you will continue to see some products better suited for T-Mobile bands and some for ATT for a while. What ATT needs to do is decide and then communicate to vendors what they are going to be doing in each band. But if anyone can do it ATT can. They are so far the only major nationwide carrier that did a digital technology change. ATT originally was in the PCS bands with UWC136 TDMA and then decided to go GSM. They not only had to manage the base station replacements but also all the subscriber units. I think in the case of a TMO and ATT it may actually be easier as a lot of the network behind the base stations are identical.
 
ScottM said:
Well I think the big reason that the acquisition happened is because it meant that ATT got access to new spectrum. Once this all gets approved bringing the networks together won't be too hard. It will be having devices that support all the profiles for those bands. I think you will continue to see some products better suited for T-Mobile bands and some for ATT for a while. What ATT needs to do is decide and then communicate to vendors what they are going to be doing in each band. But if anyone can do it ATT can. They are so far the only major nationwide carrier that did a digital technology change. ATT originally was in the PCS bands with UWC136 TDMA and then decided to go GSM. They not only had to manage the base station replacements but also all the subscriber units. I think in the case of a TMO and ATT it may actually be easier as a lot of the network behind the base stations are identical.
Click to expand...

And, in fact, some of the sites are currently provisioned to allow roaming between the carriers. For the GSM/GPRS/EDGE it may be as easy as reprogramming the PRLs and the network names (depending on details). 3G/4G will be more difficult due to frequency assignments.

I lived through the Cingular acquisition of ATT (that eventually became ATT)... it was a royal PITA and led to me moving to VZ. Sprint has also made transitions - the original Sprint Spectrum was a GSM carrier, it moved to CDMA & has been absorbing the iDEN network of Nextel.
 
Last edited:
T-MO is already charging for tethering ... I got a replacement blechberry and foolishly upgraded the bb desktop - somewhere in there, tethering stopped working. A call to T-MO support says "oh yeah, you have to pay for that now" ...
 
Pretty much exactly as expected. Expect one more merger until we're down to three telcos. Judge Green busted 'em up in the 80s, and natural monopolies like telecom always reconverge. Surprised it took this long and a global recession to drive it.
 
I have an iPhone4 and the iPad 2 3G is on it's way in the next week so I've been looking at the plans. I have unlimited data now for $25/mo on the iPhone. I can add tethering and get reduced to a 4 GB plan for $15 and use my Personal Hotspot for the iPad or I can turn on a 2 GB /mo plan on the iPad for $15 and leave my iPhone4 as is. This is all AT&T. I'll probably just turn on the iPad 2GB plan so I'm not running down the battery on both at the same time. I checked my usage on the iPhone and the most I've ever used is less than 250 MB/mo.

On the subject of network bandwidth being worth something... AT&T is getting their gig in on Verizon where I am. We live in a spotty coverage area for AT&T mobile so they gave me a free MicroCell that puts up a 3G network cell in my home. There's also no cost to use it so it's completely free to install and use and now I have 5 bars in my house and all the iPhones use it to make calls - all backhauled on Verizon FiOS :) The phone calls are so little bandwidth I doubt Verizon will notice it much but they're giving these MicroCell boxes away free to anyone that walks in and asks for it.
 
Huh. I could've sworn I posted a reply to you this morning. Guess I forgot to hit the Post button...

ScottM said:
Well I think the big reason that the acquisition happened is because it meant that ATT got access to new spectrum.
Click to expand...
Thanks, that makes sense. I thought it might have had a bit to do with adding capacity in the denser urban areas where people are griping about iPhones being sucky. But a friend today told me he thought Verizon scarfed up a big portion of spectrum during the last auction in 2008.

ScottM said:
But if anyone can do it ATT can. They are so far the only major nationwide carrier that did a digital technology change. ATT originally was in the PCS bands with UWC136 TDMA and then decided to go GSM. They not only had to manage the base station replacements but also all the subscriber units. I think in the case of a TMO and ATT it may actually be easier as a lot of the network behind the base stations are identical.
Click to expand...
Ah yes, I remember that -- the switch from the "Blue" to the "Orange" :D
 
rpadula said:
Thanks, that makes sense. I thought it might have had a bit to do with adding capacity in the denser urban areas where people are griping about iPhones being sucky. But a friend today told me he thought Verizon scarfed up a big portion of spectrum during the last auction in 2008.
Click to expand...
That is really the samething. More spectrum means less user denisty users/Hz initially so one can increase the users to go back to the same density. Spectrum=capacity IOW.

Verizon did get some choice spectrum in the last auction. They too are deploying LTE in it. ATT was left holding the bag. Sprint already had a huge amount of spectrum to grow.
 
ScottM said:
That is really the samething. More spectrum means less user denisty users/Hz initially so one can increase the users to go back to the same density. Spectrum=capacity IOW.
Click to expand...

Doh! You are correct.

Just spotted an announcement for the Nokia Astound - compatible with the big to-be-comglomerated AT&T/T-Mob network:

http://www.nokiausa.com/find-products/phones/nokia-c7-00/specifications
Operating Frequency
  • GSM/EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
  • WCDMA 850/900/1700/2100
  • Automatic switching between WCDMA and GSM bands
  • Flight mode
Penta-band? :D
 
rpadula said:
Penta-band? :D
Click to expand...
:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

With WCDMA GSM/EDGE/GPRS the subscriber device numbers are so high you are seeing multimode/multiband chip sets come out. That means cheaper per unit costs and stuff gets made. The handset market is brutal when it comes to costs. Years ago when I actually was in the handset business if we could save $.25/unit we would put 4 to 5 guys on a 6 month long project to tackle that cost reduction. Anything over $.05 was pretty fair game. I imagine it is even more brutal now that, thanks to cheap Asian imports, ASPs have come down further while complexity has increased.
 
Is it not possible to tether, without the provider's knowledge? Seems like all such things get hacked easily and quickly these days.
 
ScottM said:
That is really the samething. More spectrum means less user denisty users/Hz initially so one can increase the users to go back to the same density. Spectrum=capacity IOW.

Verizon did get some choice spectrum in the last auction. They too are deploying LTE in it. ATT was left holding the bag. Sprint already had a huge amount of spectrum to grow.
Click to expand...

SPRINT got some of their initial spectrum from NexTel, who lead a great coup by acting like they had no RF engineers. NexTel snagged 800 MHz spectrum from the business band by buying out the users and throwing away their radios, and then since there had never been "full channel" utilization of those channels in the past, they hammered Public Safety Two-Way systems that were close-spaced to them in the 800 spectrum with interference.

To "fix" the problem, re-banding began... and it continues to this day. All because someone colored outside the lines.

You'd expect less from Southern Pacific [Railroad] Internal Network and Telephone? Railroaded... that's pretty much how it went down.

From talking to former site techs, Sprint has horrible internal culture, and treats their site techs like dogs, and everything is bottom dollar, cut-rate for equipment. They were lucky to have trucks that ran.

All the folks I knew, who knew anything about the microwave backbone gear, quit en-masse when management started the big "financial restructuring" after the mergers a few years ago, and offered "early out" package deals.

If they've truly recovered to the same talent level as before by now, I'd be impressed. That world is small, and most microwave techs and site techs avoid working for them until it's their only hope of a job.

They probably paid contractors to install much of their "4G" network, and have no idea how to troubleshoot it or fix it. Probably the reason they started ramping up their roaming agreements with Verizon heavily a few years ago. Why build sites you can't maintain.

Next merger: VZ and Sprint. It's comin'... all it takes is a coup of the Board against the current upper management.
 
denverpilot said:
SPRINT got some of their initial spectrum from NexTel, who lead a great coup by acting like they had no RF engineers. NexTel snagged 800 MHz spectrum from the business band by buying out the users and throwing away their radios, and then since there had never been "full channel" utilization of those channels in the past, they hammered Public Safety Two-Way systems that were close-spaced to them in the 800 spectrum with interference.

To "fix" the problem, re-banding began... and it continues to this day. All because someone colored outside the lines.

You'd expect less from Southern Pacific [Railroad] Internal Network and Telephone? Railroaded... that's pretty much how it went down.

From talking to former site techs, Sprint has horrible internal culture, and treats their site techs like dogs, and everything is bottom dollar, cut-rate for equipment. They were lucky to have trucks that ran.

All the folks I knew, who knew anything about the microwave backbone gear, quit en-masse when management started the big "financial restructuring" after the mergers a few years ago, and offered "early out" package deals.

If they've truly recovered to the same talent level as before by now, I'd be impressed. That world is small, and most microwave techs and site techs avoid working for them until it's their only hope of a job.

They probably paid contractors to install much of their "4G" network, and have no idea how to troubleshoot it or fix it. Probably the reason they started ramping up their roaming agreements with Verizon heavily a few years ago. Why build sites you can't maintain.

Next merger: VZ and Sprint. It's comin'... all it takes is a coup of the Board against the current upper management.
Click to expand...
Sprint also had a bunch of 2.5GHz spectrum that they acquired pre-Nextel. Their current 4G play is WiMAX. Sprint initially started to deploy WiMAX and even went commercial in a few spots. But then they made a major investment in Clearwire and transferred the 4G WiMAX network to them. Clearwire under the name of Clear now runs their 4G network and Sprint is basically a MVNO for 4G. But the rumor mill is rife with LTE talk for Sprint and their project leapfrog.

There were rumors of a TMO/Sprint acquisition but those were obviously wrong. I read a pretty interesting article the other day calling Sprint the company in 3rd place in a two person race. YIKES!

The big problem Sprint has is a plurality of technology. CDMA, iDen, WiMAX, LTE, etc. They got a lot of stuff that just does not go together. They will need to start to coalesce on a tech, but then big question is what would make them different than a VZ or ATT? Three of the same is not a good for the market thing. If there is a VZ/Sprint deal what do you think would be the driver? Market licenses? Spectrum?
 
Jimmy Fallon sez: "AT&T is buying T-Mobile for $39 billion. It was a tough call for AT&T, but then again—EVERY call is a tough call for AT&T."

And, from fark.com: "AT&T is getting married to T-Mobile. There will be no reception afterwards." :rofl:
 
The Verizon USB stick has been awful this visit to SFO. I'm sending this from my AT&T iPhone. I wonder if that is because a lot of people switched over to Verizon iPhones.
 
ScottM said:
Well I think the big reason that the acquisition happened is because it meant that ATT got access to new spectrum. Once this all gets approved bringing the networks together won't be too hard. It will be having devices that support all the profiles for those bands. I think you will continue to see some products better suited for T-Mobile bands and some for ATT for a while. What ATT needs to do is decide and then communicate to vendors what they are going to be doing in each band. But if anyone can do it ATT can. They are so far the only major nationwide carrier that did a digital technology change. ATT originally was in the PCS bands with UWC136 TDMA and then decided to go GSM. They not only had to manage the base station replacements but also all the subscriber units. I think in the case of a TMO and ATT it may actually be easier as a lot of the network behind the base stations are identical.
Click to expand...

My big concern is the "Internet Calling" feature for when I'm away from the home network, like overseas. T-Mo used to not even charge it against your plan, but now it uses minutes. Still though, that is the one feature that has kept me with T-Mo for the last what, 5 years or so. Actually I've been an on/off customer for closer to 12 years because customer service is good. It's been solid since the UMA/Internet Calling... whatever they call it now. If they give up that, I'll be really ****ed...:incazzato:
 
Everskyward said:
The Verizon USB stick has been awful this visit to SFO. I'm sending this from my AT&T iPhone. I wonder if that is because a lot of people switched over to Verizon iPhones.
Click to expand...

SFO has always been flaky on VZ for me. LAX is terrible on Sprint.
 
In Vegas, my AT&T data card said, "3G," and strong signal, but pretty much did not work.

The verizon card worked pretty well.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top