Are Airline Pilots Overpaid?

I know that my airline defiantly feels that I'm overpaid. That's why they want to cut my pay and benefits. In exchange, they will feel that they are clearly superior managers and the company will pay them a premium. Of course, this process is being overseen by the bankruptcy court in Delaware, so it must be Kosher.
 
So how many corporate pilots haul 350 passengers around in aircraft grossing 500,000 lb? And I'm pretty sure any that do fly something that big get paid at least as well as those flying for air carriers (and probably have nowhere near as many passengers when they do). OTOH, I think if you compare pilots flying 50-75,000 lb aircraft, the corporate pilots get paid a lot better than those flying the same size airframes for regional carriers.

In any event, they get paid what they do based on supply and demand, and that is the American way, right?
 
Let me throw this question out there - is a strong middle class important ? Within the last 100 years in which decade(s) would you say we had the strongest middle class ? What was our international standing like during those times and what was our GDP ?
 
RotorAndWing said:
So? :dunno:



Depends upon what industry you're in.


Why do people want to try to compare their jobs to that of an airline pilot? :dunno:
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Wasnt trying to...the other poster was just whining about not being paid for time away from home...
 
JeffDG said:
Wasnt trying to...the other poster was just whining about not being paid for time away from home...
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No try a little reading comprehension next time. The original poster was comparing how little I work for a huge hourly rate. I pointed out that his understanding of airline pay was incorrect.

If I was whining it would be about how I should be making more money for what I do.

Gone from home 270 hours this month, I'll let you do the math. Hopefully it is better than your reading comprehension.
 
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IndyBrian said:
No try a little reading comprehension next time. The original poster was comparing how little I work for a huge hourly rate. I pointed out that his understanding of airline pay was incorrect.

If I was whining it would be about how I should be making more money for what I do.

Gone from home 270 hours this month, I'll let you do the math. Hopefully it is better than your eating comprehension.
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Wow...11+ days a month on the road...nobody should have to deal with that...I mean other than lots of people who travel 3+ weeks every month. I know several people who check in at home every other month for a couple days. They're not paid for their time away from home, they're paid for their time working, regardless of where they are.

Oh, and just a note...it's those guys who are away from their home base a helluva lot more than you are that pay for you.
 
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JeffDG said:
Oh, and just a note...it's those guys who are away from their home base a helluva lot more than you are that pay for you.
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Boy, no kidding. I've spent at least two nights a week on the road in every career I've had for the last 30 years. And, on my last stint, I was gone all week, every week. Left home on Sunday evening, returned home on Friday evening. Did this every week for 8 years.

I took four weeks a year off, not one or two per month. But I owned my business so I had to be there.
 
Art VanDelay said:
Let me throw this question out there - is a strong middle class important ? Within the last 100 years in which decade(s) would you say we had the strongest middle class ? What was our international standing like during those times and what was our GDP ?
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Aristotle studied the histories of over 300 city states and concluded from those histories:

Thus it is manifest that the best political community is formed by citizens of the middle class, and that those states are likely to be well-administered, in which the middle class is large, and stronger if possible than both the other classes [poor and rich], or at any rate than either singly; for the addition of the middle class turns the scale, and prevents either of the extremes from being dominant. Great then is the good fortune of the state in which the citizens have a moderate and sufficient property; for where some possess much, and others nothing, there may arise an extreme democracy, or a pure oligarchy; or a tyranny may grow out of either extreme--either out of the most rampant democracy, or out of an oligarchy; but it is not likely to arise out of the middle constitutions and those akin to them. I will explain the reason of this hereafter, when I speak of the revolutions of states. The mean condition of states is clearly best, for no other is free from faction; and where the middle class is large, there are least likely to be factions and dissensions. For a similar reason large states are less liable to faction than small ones, because in them the middle class is large; whereas in small states it is easy to divide all the citizens into two classes who are either rich or poor, and to leave nothing in the middle. And democracies are safer and more permanent than oligarchies, because they have a middle class which is more numerous and has a greater share in the government; for when there is no middle class, and the poor greatly exceed in number, troubles arise, and the state soon comes to an end.
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Depends. Do they know what airport to land at or the difference between 3800' and 7000' I would be willing to pay more for the latter.:rofl:

Don't get me started on teachers pay and benefits I live in an overtaxed state in a very rural area and our cost per student is about $18,000. How is that even possible when colleges are churning out teachers left and right (the sciences being the exception)? You can send a kid to boarding school in some places for that kind of money.
 
timwinters said:
Boy, no kidding. I've spent at least two nights a week on the road in every career I've had for the last 30 years. And, on my last stint, I was gone all week, every week. Left home on Sunday evening, returned home on Friday evening. Did this every week for 8 years.

I took four weeks a year off, not one or two per month. But I owned my business so I had to be there.
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I didn't want to wade into these waters, but you're right that's how it goes for a lot of people. Have a calendar based fiscal and say goodbye to the holidays also. Ever wake up not knowing what country/city you're in?:)
 
JeffDG said:
Oh, and just a note...it's those guys who are away from their home base a helluva lot more than you are that pay for you.
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Is that a sentence? I see your writhing skills are as good as your reading comprehension.
 
To rephrase the question: "Was Sully overpaid?"

Ron Levy said:
In any event, they get paid what they do based on supply and demand, and that is the American way, right?
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These days the concept of supply and demand and it's connection to pay is not well correlated. For the airlines, the RLA and unions distort the connection.... for the general economy, minimum wage, mandated health care, unions (where applicable), "living wage" laws, "prevailing wage" laws in certain contracts, and certain labor agreements distort the connection. Supply and demand affects employment levels, which in theory should translate to pay, but there are constraints driven by laws and collective bargaining.
 
IndyBrian said:
Is that a sentence? I see your writhing skills are as good as your reading comprehension.
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My reading or my eating comprehension? If you want to get on someone's writing skills, you might want to look at your own.

Seriously...stop whining about being away from home. It's neither unusual, nor is anyone else compensated for it.
 
JeffDG said:
Seriously...stop whining about being away from home. It's neither unusual, nor is anyone else compensated for it.
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Spell check is not always your friend, but I fixed it before you quoted it, so no one else has any idea what the hell you are talking about. That is probably an issue you deal with daily, so no harm no foul I guess.

Again, my third grade educated friend, where have I whined about my time away from home?

Let me say it to you really slow for you once more. The original post had no idea how airline pilots are paid, I pointed out his error.

I quite enjoy being home two or more weeks in a row at home and not using vacation. Sure being gone from home sucks a bit at times, but I see my kids way more than my corporate friends that work 12 hour days.

Now don't you have one of those Internet for Dummies books to finish?
 
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IndyBrian said:
Spell check is not always your friend, but I fixed it before you quoted it, so no one else has any idea what the hell you are talking about.
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Chronology is your friend. My quote most certainly does have it. People who know how to write don't rely on spell-check.

IndyBrian said:
Again, my third grade educated friend, where have I whined about my time away from home?
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Let's go to the record shall we? (Oh, you can go edit this now and claim you never said it too...)
IndyBrian said:
Yes pay for the month may be based on 70 hours, but the time away form base is a much larger number. When you use the time away from base, i.e. gone from home, your "real job" terms comes out to less than minimum wage for a regional first officer.
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Sounds a helluva lot like whining to me.

IndyBrian said:
Let me say it to you really slow for you once more. The original post had no idea how airline pilots are paid, I pointed out his error.
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And added on some irrelevant whining about how you weren't paid for being away from home. I simply pointed out that nobody gets paid on that basis.

It's a good thing you work in an strict-seniority industry. Your level of reasoning wouldn't get you very far outside of it.
 
Ever notice the people that ***** and moan about airline pilots are not connected to the industry?

Reminds me of the threads where someone ask about a career as an airline pilot and all the people jump in and start telling him "don't do it, you'll starve to death" or "you could spend all that money for pilot training and go to college and get a real job".......then they tell you how much their job sucks. :rolleyes2:


:rofl:
 
Greg Bockelman said:
The day that happens is the day I never set foot in an airliner again.
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Amen. And I ride airlines a lot (UA MM and 1K). But, eliminate live pilots up front and I'm finished.

N801BH said:
Hmmmm....

All you need is a BA from two years in a community college and present yourself to a school district...

Out here the starting pay is 54,200 + signing bonus+great medical insurance+ great retirement+ housing allowance+ sick pay+ vacation +summers off = 8 month work year....

All ya got to do is lay low till tenure kicks in and coast for the remaining 21 years and retire in your early 50's for a 6 digit income, for the REST of your life....

In my life, I do not know of ANY teacher who left the golden goose nest to change jobs... and I mean NEVER....

Back to the subject.... Captains on the majors are well paid and earn their keep. The regional pilots are getting the royal shaft... Starting pay on a RJ right seat is something like 16 grand a year.. You can make that flippin burgers at Mc Donalds...
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I think you'll find the requirements a bit higher elsewhere. My wife had a BS and had to go back to school to get a teaching credential in California. She still needs the combination in Washington state. And I guarantee that her retirement (at age 62) won't be a 6 digit income. No way, no how. 8 months work per year? Where can she get a deal like that? They get paid for 180 teaching days. But, don't forget that just about every evening during the school year she is tied to the house grading papers and doing other paperwork. Sorry, but teachers are not over paid and under worked. Not based on what I see married to one. Then, imagine being cooped up with 30 6th graders. No thanks! I saw them one day, was appalled at their behavior and then was told that they were being good for me. I'll stick with being an engineer, thank you.
 
RotorAndWing said:
Ever notice the people that ***** and moan about airline pilots are not connected to the industry?
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Ever notice the people who think the airline/aviation industry is different/unique in some way from all other industries, are the least willing to entertain the mere thought that their trials and tribulations might be no different than anyone else's.

Claiming "OH MY GOD, I HAVE TO BE ON THE ROAD FOR DAYS AT A TIME AND ONLY GET PAID WHILE I'M IN THE AIR" is soooo much different than the salesman who spends weeks on the road, and doesn't get paid at all if he doesn't close the sale.
 
I think anyone who has the time to dream up a list and write an article on who is getting paid too much ought to go out and find a real job.
 
JeffDG said:
Ever notice the people who think the airline/aviation industry is different/unique in some way from all other industries, are the least willing to entertain the mere thought that their trials and tribulations might be no different than anyone else's.

Claiming "OH MY GOD, I HAVE TO BE ON THE ROAD FOR DAYS AT A TIME AND ONLY GET PAID WHILE I'M IN THE AIR" is soooo much different than the salesman who spends weeks on the road, and doesn't get paid at all if he doesn't close the sale.
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You are the only tool that is saying this, I certainly am not, and I am in the airline industry.

You sound like a bitter salesman.
 
Free markets my assay. Pull government oversight and airliners will be run as cheaply as anyone can manage. If it ain't broke don't fix it, and the pilots will be lucky if they can afford ramen. And that'll keep going until someone crashes, at which point the airline will go belly up and leave its creditors dangling. Until the government steps in, which is what it did.

I for one am glad there are lots of regulations concerning airliners and those who fly them. They make mighty good bombs. And even so pay at the regionals sounds appalling. I doubt there will be too many Sully's out there in in a few years.
 
FOlks, it's NOT OK to attack others here. Let's have a discussion of the topic, not a discussion of other posters.

Thanks.
 
IndyBrian said:
You are the only tool that is saying this, I certainly am not, and I am in the airline industry.
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I quote you again:
IndyBrian said:
Yes pay for the month may be based on 70 hours, but the time away form base is a much larger number. When you use the time away from base, i.e. gone from home, your "real job" terms comes out to less than minimum wage for a regional first officer.
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You sound like a bitter Regional F/O
 
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