Anyone want to tow and build time?

Nsconductor

Nsconductor

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Nsconductor
I thought I would throw this out there for anyone that might be interested in really adorable flight time - The Soaring Club of Houston is looking for tow pilots.

Basic requirements are 200 total time, 25 hours in taildraggers, 3 hours in taildraggers in the last 30 days, high performance endorsement, obviously a tail wheel endorsement, and take an evaluation in the clubs Taylorcraft.

Details of "Tow Pilot Only Members"

Initiation Fee is $180

MONTHLY DUES - Monthly membership dues are $7.50/month - billed $90 once a year.

If you want to fly/train in gliders then you will need to pay the $40/month membership dues.

SSA MEMBERSHIP - You will need pay your annual fee for membership in the SSA, Soaring Society of America. You have to be a SSA member in order to qualify for our insurance. Currently, this is $69/year.

If anyone is interested let me know and I'll put you in touch with the appropriate folks.

The club flys 3 PA-25 Pawnees as tow planes. 235HP.
 
just something to consider - like I do with the gliding club down here - I'm happy to help them out when they're short a tow pilot and I don't ask for anything in return except a cup of coffee, but I couldn't care less about "building time" and I'm sure as heck not going to pay you for the fun of riding a pawnee around in the hot sun.

If you get short handed, I'd bet you get some experienced people willing to help if you welcomed them instead of charging them
 
JHW said:
just something to consider - like I do with the gliding club down here - I'm happy to help them out when they're short a tow pilot and I don't ask for anything in return except a cup of coffee, but I couldn't care less about "building time" and I'm sure as heck not going to pay you for the fun of riding a pawnee around in the hot sun.

If you get short handed, I'd bet you get some experienced people willing to help if you welcomed them instead of charging them
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That.

When I used to tow we were exempt of everything except joining the SSA, we also got a little hookup if we wanted to fly gliders.
 
Besides, all my time is adorable. I look at it and say "Aww... I remember that flight."

I'm with the gen pop on this one. If you want or need help don't expect me to pay to help you.
 
Wouldn't this time be looked at negatively by prospective hiring people in the future?

Pay for Time is a no-no.
 
Nsconductor said:
I thought I would throw this out there for anyone that might be interested in really adorable flight time - The Soaring Club of Houston is looking for tow pilots.

Basic requirements are 200 total time, 25 hours in taildraggers, 3 hours in taildraggers in the last 30 days, high performance endorsement, obviously a tail wheel endorsement, and take an evaluation in the clubs Taylorcraft.

Details of "Tow Pilot Only Members"

Initiation Fee is $180

MONTHLY DUES - Monthly membership dues are $7.50/month - billed $90 once a year.

If you want to fly/train in gliders then you will need to pay the $40/month membership dues.

SSA MEMBERSHIP - You will need pay your annual fee for membership in the SSA, Soaring Society of America. You have to be a SSA member in order to qualify for our insurance. Currently, this is $69/year.

If anyone is interested let me know and I'll put you in touch with the appropriate folks.

The club flys 3 PA-25 Pawnees as tow planes. 235HP.
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I just erased the nastygram I had typed after I reread your original posting. I assume this is a volunteer/fun thing and not an employment opportunity? Please confirm that. I'm not a commercial pilot, thus have no skin in this game, but if this is an employment opportunity, I've got a strong opinion on this.
 
if your "strong opinion" is some nonsense about a PPL getting compensation yada yada, you can save it. Towing gliders is a special situation. If you don't know what you're talking about, then don't talk.
 
Soldier64 said:
I'm with the gen pop on this one. If you want or need help don't expect me to pay to help you.
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Yup. Not only would I expect to not have to pay to volunteer my time, I might even expect a cold beer in the clubhouse after spending a hot day towing folks into the air. :cheers:
 
As a low time PPL looking to build time, I would only be interested if I wanted to fly gliders and got a discount on joining the club. This being a cost to fly the airplane with an additional cost to fly gliders, I'd be out. But I'm sure there are a few people who will take you up on the offer. I doubt they would stick around very long but what do I know.
 
JoseCuervo said:
Wouldn't this time be looked at negatively by prospective hiring people in the future?

Pay for Time is a no-no.
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No, kinda a diffrent thing then PTF and whatnot.

Most of these places will give you credits per tow if you want to fly a glider, many glider pilots who are also powered pilots will tow to help their clubs out too. No paying, normally you also get BBQ and beer at the end of the day, outside from this posting I've never heard of a glider club asking tow pilots to pay anything outside of the cheap SSA membership.


No one has ever had anything negative to say about my towing time, I actually got a good job based on some of the contacts I made while towing.


Side note, many glider clubs including the one I towed for, are non profits.
 
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I tow for just such an arrangement. Paid half membership fees and dues (plus SSA membership), get a 1$ credit per tow.

Honestly after 4 months (and buying another plane) it's losing it's luster a little bit, but I'm about to solo a glider so we'll see.
 
But pilots are our own worst enemies. Some low time commercial pilot will jump for a job like this to build....what kind of flight time?
 
I almost have no words to describe this 'deal'.

Rancid.
Putrid.
Noxious.
Horrid.
Deceitful.

I gave it a try. I towed banners and gliders for free for a while - back in the day. I wasn't paid, which is ok for a PPL, and I got free training and it was cool for a short time but the bloom was off the rose pretty fast. At first, the club was grateful, and they were nice, and it was all hearts and flowers. I got a call one Sat morning at about 9am after a night of drinking and fooling around asking me why I wasn't at the field ready to tow a glider at 8am? Wrong phone call buddy.
 
James331 said:
No, kinda a diffrent thing then PTF and whatnot.



Most of these places will give you credits per tow if you want to fly a glider, many glider pilots who are also powered pilots will tow to help their clubs out too. No paying, normally you also get BBQ and beer at the end of the day, outside from this posting I've never heard of a glider club asking tow pilots to pay anything outside of the cheap SSA membership.





No one has ever had anything negative to say about my towing time, I actually got a good job based on some of the contacts I made while towing.





Side note, many glider clubs including the one I towed for, are non profits.
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Reminds me of the old joke about the about the woman who said she would sleep with a guy for a $1million.

The guy countered with "now we are just negotiating ".....

Pay for Time is ok if it is less than $Xx ....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
JoseCuervo said:
Reminds me of the old joke about the about the woman who said she would sleep with a guy for a $1million.

The guy countered with "now we are just negotiating ".....

Pay for Time is ok if it is less than $Xx ....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Pay to fly is never OK.

Helping out some small non profit glider club is different, we had a tip jar, always paid for my gas and a drink and burger, plus I could have gotten my glider add on for free... still kicking myself for not jumping on that before I moved :mad2:

So end of the day, I got a free dinner and hung out with some friends, nothing out of pocket on my end, would have been a way better deal if I took them up on their glider offer. Still hardly PTF
No one was making a profit off my labor, they charged next to nothing and all that money went into fuel and mx, even had a couple APs who traded their time.
 
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At our club it was mostly glider pilots with SELs already who did the towing. It was all on a volunteer basis and self scheduled. You have to be a club member to be covered by insurance and what not but its not expensive compared to most things in aviation, you got to hang out with likeminded people, and got to fly when you wanted for damn near free.
 
Our club pays $5 a tow, no initiation, no dues, must be a member of SSA. If tow pilot wants to fly gliders, regular membership costs are assessed. Several tow pilots just apply their tow fees to pay for their glider flying. Some donate their fees to the club and just tow to help out the club.
 
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I'd love to, but don't meet the requirements. I may pass this along to somebody else, though.
 
I'd love to tow for my local glider club. But, I was told I had to have 100hrs of tailwheel time. I have 58.
 
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Witmo said:
Our club pays $5 a tow, no initiation, no dues, must be a member of SSA. If tow pilot wants to fly gliders, regular membership costs are assessed. Several tow pilots just apply their tow fees to pay for their glider flying. Some donate their fees to the club and just tow to help out the club.
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I towed with Witmo and that was a great outfit. That was actually a fun gig. Nice fill in when I wasn't busy with students, too.
 
JHW said:
just something to consider - like I do with the gliding club down here - I'm happy to help them out when they're short a tow pilot and I don't ask for anything in return except a cup of coffee, but I couldn't care less about "building time" and I'm sure as heck not going to pay you for the fun of riding a pawnee around in the hot sun.

If you get short handed, I'd bet you get some experienced people willing to help if you welcomed them instead of charging them
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:yeahthat:

The club I volunteer for pays the SSA membership for non-club-member tow pilots. If it cost me a dime I wouldn't do it. My contribution to the club is my time.
 
Didn't mean to stir up a crappy conversation. Just telling you guys what our club does. We are one of the most successful clubs in the country. We have some great tow pilots, but could always use more. A bunch of great guys to hang out with, a first class operation. My advice is if you don't like our arrangement, don't opt to participate. A hell of an opportunity to learn to,fly gliders as well. We do not charge for instruction to club members. We do pay for tows. If anyone is interested, there is a great article about our club in last months Soaring magazine.

We own 7 gliders, 3 Pawnees, and a Taylorcraft. We own the airfield and hangars. We have a great clubhouse, a very active cross country program, several FAI champion Pilots, and several world record holders. We are a club, not a profit making organization by any means. And if you think this is PTF, our definitions are way different..

I am not on the board or an officer of the club. Just passing on information.
 
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Oh man, sure are some dicks on here. This appears to me to be a case of a soaring club that is currently experiencing a shortage in its membership of powered pilots willing to be tow pilots . The club rules appear to require that the tow pilots must be members and must pay membership fees and dues as do the sailplane pilot members. This is not unusual and is in fact how most clubs operate.

So after these very modest fees and dues, you get to fly pretty much for free as much as you are probably want to. You get to build your tailwheel time and HP time, if those are something you'd like to build.

This is not taking money away from a commercial pilot nor is it pay to fly in the sense that most pilots typically use that term.

The OP was posting an opportunity... an OPPORTUNITY... that he thought someone on this site could possibly take advantage of. Simple.
 
Thanks Skydog. That was the intent. And I couldn't agree more with your leading comment.
 
I think I'm interested unlike these cheap bastages ... I pay my way and don't expect **** from anybody. And could really care less about time. I'm retired and a professional married playboy. :D

I own a skywagon but we won't be towing with it since it's an Oshkosh award winner ...<had to throw that in there>. I meet all the qualifications and have about ten hours in a sailplane. I was soloing in gliders and this close to getting my sailplane endorsement when we moved away from the glider field in Arizona. I loved soaring and want to get back into it.

We're a short hop from Montgomery here at 11R. But it's ****ing HOT outside dude man. Can we start in a month or two? Got A/C in the Pawnee? ;)
 
docmirror said:
I towed banners and gliders for free for a while - back in the day. I wasn't paid, which is ok for a PPL, and I got free training and it was cool for a short time but the bloom was off the rose pretty fast.
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How does this jive with 14 CFR 61.113?
 
BellyUpFish said:
How does this jive with 14 CFR 61.113?
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Not a FAR expert by any means - and I may not fully understand the question, but 61.113g talks about towing gliders.

Not sure about the banner part.

(g) A private pilot who meets the requirements of §61.69 may act as a pilot in command of an aircraft towing a glider or unpowered ultralight vehicle.
 
Nsconductor said:
Didn't mean to stir up a crappy conversation. Just telling you guys what our club does. We are one of the most successful clubs in the country. We have some great tow pilots, but could always use more. A bunch of great guys to hang out with, a first class operation. My advice is if you don't like our arrangement, don't opt to participate. A hell of an opportunity to learn to,fly gliders as well. We do not charge for instruction to club members. We do pay for tows. If anyone is interested, there is a great article about our club in last months Soaring magazine.

We own 7 gliders, 3 Pawnees, and a Taylorcraft. We own the airfield and hangars. We have a great clubhouse, a very active cross country program, several FAI champion Pilots, and several world record holders. We are a club, not a profit making organization by any means. And if you think this is PTF, our definitions are way different..

I am not on the board or an officer of the club. Just passing on information.
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Not so much different from most clubs.
Discount on dues or discount for flying gliders. Most clubs have the SSA Group insurance policy which requires club membership and SSA membership for coverage. Most clubs cannot afford to pay for tow pilots and keep the cost of flying reasonable.

You want to see expensive, look at commercial tow operations.
 
Nsconductor said:
Not a FAR expert by any means - and I may not fully understand the question, but 61.113g talks about towing gliders.

Not sure about the banner part.

(g) A private pilot who meets the requirements of §61.69 may act as a pilot in command of an aircraft towing a glider or unpowered ultralight vehicle.
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If you mean me, I never charged for banner tows. Just a fun afternoon flight over the San Diego beach at low altitude with a good pair of field glasses. I asked at the local ofc, and they wanted to know who's plane it was. As long as I was flying my plane, no harm, no foul. But - this was back when pilots were pilots and not whiny hygiene products quoting regs.
 
Henning said:
Specific cut outs for glider towing and skydiving.
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He said he was going banners and received free training, it appears in return for said banner towing.

Would that equate to compensation?
 
docmirror said:
But - this was back when pilots were pilots and not whiny hygiene products quoting regs.
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Almost as bad as pilots suggesting calling insurance companies over issues that don't exist, eh?
 
BellyUpFish said:
He said he was going banners and received free training, it appears in return for said banner towing.

Would that equate to compensation?
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I had to get a banner tow waiver from the FAA in 1991 and needed a CPL at that time, but I was being paid.
 
Henning said:
I had to get a banner tow waiver from the FAA in 1991 and needed a CPL at that time, but I was being paid.
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Compensation isn't always monetary, though, correct?

Would receipt of free instruction equate as compensation?
 
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BellyUpFish said:
Compensation isn't always monetary, though, correct?

Would receipt of free instruction would equate as compensation?
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Yeah, but there are exceptions written in a lot of these rules, I just never looked into it on banner tow.
 
Nsconductor said:
Thanks Skydog. That was the intent. And I couldn't agree more with your leading comment.
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No problem. If I were close by, I'd dust the cobwebs off of my tailwheel endorsement and swing by your operation. I'd gladly pay the dollars that you mentioned. Good luck!
 
So say there is someone that would want to do this and is based pretty close by. Would someone with the soaring club be willing to train on the tail wheel endorsement?
 
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