Anybody want to buy a nice 310?

Checkout_my_Six said:
was that a......Bonanza back there?.....whatda want for that? :D
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MotoFlier said:
I would appreciate you taking the time to do that write-up. I'm very actively shopping for Aztec/310's. The Aztec seems to be the best fit for my budget and mission.
Ted (iflytwins) has been an absolutely invaluable resource through every step of this for me and I'm extremely grateful for all the time he has taken helping me:yes:.
yes I did use this post as an excuse to tell everyone how awesome Ted is:rofl:
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I am in heavy multi-tasking mode this week, but I will definitely do that by the weekend latest.

See my post responding to one of Ted's. I am a BIG fan of the Aztec from my own experience as a first twin. One of the difficulties is finding one that has not been parked for a long time - there are a lot of them out there that have long periods of not being flown and I would be very careful about that. The systems, such as the hydraulic flaps and gear, can be expensive to repair if they have been neglected. Of course we could probably say the same thing about any airplane I suppose.

I found a well maintained late model 'F' with no missing logs that had never had a period in its history where it sat for any length of time, and after putting on nearly 300 more hours it has been a reasonably reliable steed.
 
GRG55 said:
Ted, I live east of the Continental Divide, but my wife and I both grew up on the west coast and we have a lot of family out there. The Aztec is a solid, reasonably well equipped IFR platform, but is naturally aspirated and the one shortfall that has me thinking of upgrading is single engine service ceiling over the rocks. Going west I always fly it light and pick my days and routing so I always have an out well above minimums. But I am now considering stepping up to a turbocharged twin. Pressurized would be nice, and the Finance Minister would prefer it when she is a passenger with me, but I am wary of the added cost of maintaining the pressure hull. :yikes: I note that you've been happy staying with unpressurized twins. I am probably going to shortly fire up the spreadsheet again to do some analysis in preparation for a possible decision later this year, and appreciate any advice and the future opportunity to ask questions.
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A good part of the reason why I've been happy with naturally aspirated piston twins is because about 99% of my flying is east of Denver. I've have managed to successfully make trips across the Rockies, even in the heat of summer or in the midst of some rather odd winter weather. I've also said that if I was going to make regular trips in that part of the country, especially on a schedule, I'd be looking for turbos and likely pressurization.

Keep in mind that turbos give you improved altitude and single engine performance, pressurization gives you comfort and some extra safety due to lower hypoxia concerns. You can fly at altitudes you normally fly a pressurized aircraft on O2, but nobody likes it.

Turbos increase cost in the form of higher engine overhaul costs, higher fuel burn, and then there are more items to break and that do break. From a practical perspective, the increased fuel burn is typically most of what you'll notice, and it's not necessarily that bad if you run LOP and pick your altitudes properly. You'll probably need to replace exhaust components if you own the plane long enough, and those can get spendy. A T310R is expected to be in the range of $450/hr "all-in".

Pressurization increases costs further. Most of it comes down to leaks in the pressure vessel that need to be repaired somehow. Door seals become important to maintaining maximum pressurization differential. Windows become structural items. Windshields are spendy (~$25k each), but they don't cost anything until they break. Most likely you'll be chasing things like door seals, pressurization tubes into the pressure vessel, etc. Plus anytime you do something that goes through the pressure vessel requires a DER since it's a structural item.

A 340 is typically considered a ~$550/hr "all-in" plane (insurance, MX, hangar, fuel, etc.) if flown around 100 hours per year, and will get you 190-220 kts depending on how you fly it and the specific plane you have. Most people I talk to seem to do 200-205 in the low flight levels. Useful loads on the 340 can be a bit low, which drive some people to 414s or 421s. Those also have more space but take more runway and cost more to operate, plus require larger hangars.

Of course, as with any plane, it depends on how you own it and fly it. Most 340 pilots are ROP fliers, but the LOP ones see a significant fuel savings. Some put $100k panels in, and some are happy with steam gauges. There's a wide variety out there.

So, here's my plan. You buy a 340, and sell MotoFlier your Aztec. Done. ;)
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Only if he puts me in charge of aviation... :D
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I can see it now.

It'd take about 90 days and united would be flying abound boeings with a big ol "Experimental" painted on the nacelle and a 30 ft flame from the newly installed burners farting out the back.
 
James_Dean said:
I can see it now.

It'd take about 90 days and united would be flying abound boeings with a big ol "Experimental" painted on the nacelle and a 30 ft flame from the newly installed burners farting out the back.
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We'd also bring back straight turbojets. More noise! More smoke!

AF1 would be replaced with a G-II bought off Controller for $250k.

14 CFR Part 134 1/2 would be real, not just a joke.

And the Part 23 re-write allowing owner experimental would go into effect.

All in my first 30 days. :D
 
This is one of the most informative threads I have followed on POA.

Thanks to those that are taking the time to contribute.
 
brian];1988229 said:
Yea, sounds like Ted is a twin pusher ... talked to him at Gastons last year and restarted thoughts of getting a twin ...
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MotoFlier said:
Ted (iflytwins) has been an absolutely invaluable resource through every step of this for me and I'm extremely grateful for all the time he has taken helping me:yes:.
yes I did use this post as an excuse to tell everyone how awesome Ted is:rofl:
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We don't consider him so much a pusher, as an enabler... :)
 
James_Dean said:
I work for my wife and five kids. :yes: For second job, as Ted said, I'm a 39 year old chicken farmer.;)

I'm part owner of and work as the COO for a group of companies that produce eggs for retail and industrial purposes. Collectively we are the second or third largest such company in the US and produce about 10% of the national egg supply.

While I have certainly shoveled **** and carried pails of feed in my career, I don't personally do much of that any more. My main task these days is to find great people, give them a vision, and get the hell out of the way.

We are a business run by a group of families and certainly didn't start out this big. We've kind of specialized in finding troubled and inefficient operations and turning them around.

We have operations in several states and customers across the nation which is what was/is driving my travel schedule. I did several years on the airlines earning status one painful segment at a time. Many years doing over 150 segments and it was killing me. About two years ago it dawned on me that I did in fact have a pilots certificate and perhaps it was time to put it to better use. If I was going to get myself from place to place on demand I figured I needed a FIKI twin with a pretty good set of situational awareness tools and some good training. Ted talked me into a 310 16 months and 300+ hours ago. It has been awesome.
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Great story, I love it, the american dream is still alive if you go for it and have some brains.
 
denverpilot said:
We don't consider him so much a pusher, as an enabler... :)
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But I'm a very pleasant one, at least according to Andrew Stanley. Oh, wait, that's what I tell him when I'm trying to get him to buy a Cheyenne. :D

James_Dean said:
Talk about thread hijack. You just sold two planes....and neither are mine. ;)
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Yours wouldn't fit their mission/budget. Give me a little while, I'll sell yours, too. ;)
 
James_Dean said:
I made an offer on a conquest today. :goofy::yes::rofl:

Haven't decided what I'm going to do with my 310 yet, but if anyone is interested send me a pm for specs.

I will post updates on the new ride as things go down.


Eggman
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Are there any other pics available online?
 
Ted DuPuis said:
But I'm a very pleasant one, at least according to Andrew Stanley. Oh, wait, that's what I tell him when I'm trying to get him to buy a Cheyenne. :D



Yours wouldn't fit their mission/budget. Give me a little while, I'll sell yours, too. ;)
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Give me a year or two - I might buy it!!

Seriously good info on this thread. Just wish I was ready ... (Finish IR and want some hours in actual before adding a second motor.) Hate to say it - hope you sell it before I'm ready ..
 
Offer accepted and the ball is rolling. 285 kts at FL270 on 70 GPH. Nom Nom Nom....

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James_Dean said:
Offer accepted and the ball is rolling. 285 kts at FL270 on 70 GPH. Nom Nom Nom....
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That's really quite good. The Commander 690 was 270 on 75 @ FL270. Only a hair below MU2 efficiency.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
That's really quite good. The Commander 690 was 270 on 75 @ FL270. Only a hair below MU2 efficiency.
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We will see if the reality meets the marketing hype. My expectations are for a bit less, although Blackhawk claims 290kts at FL240 on 73 gph and 278 at FL270 on 69 gph so within the relm of possibility. The conquest I does have only a 5.0 cabin diff so taking it up to FL270 or FL280 will still require 02. A little lower is probably more realistic for most ops.
 
James_Dean said:
We will see if the reality meets the marketing hype. My expectations are for a bit less, although Blackhawk claims 290kts at FL240 on 73 gph and 278 at FL270 on 69 gph so within the relm of possibility. The conquest I does have only a 5.0 cabin diff so taking it up to FL270 or FL280 will still require 02. A little lower is probably more realistic for most ops.
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260 will give you about a 10k cabin, if you have a tight cabin with no leaks.
 
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Mods, please change the name of this thread to "Would you like to drool over my new Conquest?"
 
In all fairness, I don't have it yet. There is that whole prebuy inspection thingy to get through.
 
Somedudeintn said:
Mods, please change the name of this thread to "Would you like to drool over my new Conquest?"
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Negative. That will be a future thread after he takes delivery.
 
James_Dean said:
In all fairness, I don't have it yet. There is that whole prebuy inspection thingy to get through.
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Yeah, James can't count his......nah....can't do it. :wink2:

I hope the inspection goes well and things roll your way, you've been through a lot!
 
Stunning bird. I love it, good luck!
 
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