Amended route, then as filed

D

DanielH

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Daniel
I am an IFR rated pilot and have been flying IFR regularly for the last several years. All of my flights though have been in and out of relatively uncomplicated airspace, mostly class D and C.

When listening to liveatc.net or clearance delivery I often hear the controller give (usually to jets) an amended route that commonly sounds like "Cleared to XYZ via ABC DEF then as filed". My question is, where do you pick up the filed route?
 
The last fix of the amended route will be part of the filed flight plan. It's resumed there.
 
It's as simple as that

Tex
 
I loved my first instrument flight.
Filed a perfectly reasonable route.
Called for clearance and was given another.
Got in the air, radar contact, new route, ready to copy?
Sure? Hey wait, this is what I filed for originally.

Every time I go from HKY to CJR, long about ROA I get a "We have a new route for you, advise when ready to copy."
I tell them I'm ready and they say "5327K is cleared direct to Culpeper." Great, I needed to copy that one down?
 
I write down everything, including altitudes up and down. Partly so I don't forget-- did he say "descend 4000" or "descend 5000"? I'm busy doing other things, it's nice to glance down at the reminder.
 
flyingron said:
I loved my first instrument flight.
Filed a perfectly reasonable route.
Called for clearance and was given another.
Got in the air, radar contact, new route, ready to copy?
Sure? Hey wait, this is what I filed for originally.

Every time I go from HKY to CJR, long about ROA I get a "We have a new route for you, advise when ready to copy."
I tell them I'm ready and they say "5327K is cleared direct to Culpeper." Great, I needed to copy that one down?
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One of the ATC guys will probably correct me, but what this happens is, the originally cleared route comes from a Center computer based on "global" considerations. They don't consider actual current conditions in TRACON or local sector airspace Once under way, more local TRACON and sectors amend based on what is going on in real time.

My tiniest example was leaving Ocracoke Island in he NC Outer Banks. My expected route clearance circumvented the restricted areas. But once I was in contact with Cherry Point, they cleared me straight through and direct.

Of course, it can work both ways. A shortcut or a more circuitous routing.
 
Suffice it to say that amended routes can occur for just about any reason, flow restrictions, weather, local traffic (within one facility's airspace), preferred routings...anything.

For example...take any original filed route....let's say KDFW GARL6 TXK MEM J42 ORW.ORW7 KBOS. For some reason the plane gets vectored after leaving the northeast gate so that he is now off the departure due to flow restriction 800 miles away. Then a flight progress strip prints out on the aircraft with a TMU reroute that says...
+CRAMM BNA+, if it is a preferred routing (pre-programmed into the system and widely used) or simply...
CRAMM BNA J42 ORW.ORW7 KBOS. In either case the "J42 ORW.ORW7 KBOS" part is common to both routes so the amended clearance would read...

"Kingair 34C, cleared to Boston Logan Airport direct CRAMM Nashville then as filed" or
"Kingair 34C, cleared to Boston Logan Airport direct CRAMM Nashville, rest of route unchanged" or, more likely
"Kingair 34C, Proceed direct CRAMM Nashville, as filed", sort of short cut phraseology.

The point being that the "then as filed" or "rest of route unchanged" would begin at the point where the amended route picks back up at a common point with the original filed route (if it does, otherwise it would essentially be a completely new route). A computer generated reroute will join the two parts, but if the controller takes you off a routing for some reason on his own then it will be up to him to eventually give you a clearance that will result in you joining up with the filed route somewhere ahead.

If the SID connects to the filed route then the clearance from Ground will read...

"Kingair 34C, cleared to Boston Logan Airport Garland 6 departure Texarkana, as filed" and sometimes though not entirely correct...

"Kingair 34C, cleared to Boston Garland 6 Texarkana as filed".

If the flight strip has "FRC" printed on the bottom then the controller must read the entire clearance as it is printed as a full route clearance.

Of course, generally the airlines will get their clearances via ACARS with their pre-departure clearance. But this is how it works with clearance that are read manually.

tex
 
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When are they gonna text message small aircraft with this stuff lol
 
DanielH said:
I am an IFR rated pilot and have been flying IFR regularly for the last several years. All of my flights though have been in and out of relatively uncomplicated airspace, mostly class D and C.

When listening to liveatc.net or clearance delivery I often hear the controller give (usually to jets) an amended route that commonly sounds like "Cleared to XYZ via ABC DEF then as filed". My question is, where do you pick up the filed route?
Click to expand...
Exactly where they said to. DEF. DEF, then as filed means exactly what it says, there's no disguised meaning. Now if DEF is not on the filed route ya got some questions to ask. Ain't supposed to happen, but every now and then they boo-boo and do it.
 
flyingron said:
Every time I go from HKY to CJR, long about ROA I get a "We have a new route for you, advise when ready to copy."
I tell them I'm ready and they say "5327K is cleared direct to Culpeper." Great, I needed to copy that one down?
Click to expand...

I don't know about you, but no matter where I'm going, I somehow always get re-routed to Barrett's Mountain. I kid you not, one time I filed direct from GMU back to 8A6 (SE side of CLT just under the bravo) "091, I have an amended route for you, advise when ready to copy...SPA to BZM...". Me: huh? ATC: 091, ignore that, just fly heading 060. Me: Thank you.
 
I was filed to GYY once (coming from the SE). I got a "Proceed direct KELSI." I thought about this for a second. "Hey, KELSI is like 70 miles past my destination." Oops. It's bad enough you can't pass through Chicagoland without going via KELSI, but to be sent there when landing short of the terminal area...
 
TRocket said:
I don't know about you, but no matter where I'm going, I somehow always get re-routed to Barrett's Mountain. I kid you not, one time I filed direct from GMU back to 8A6 (SE side of CLT just under the bravo) "091, I have an amended route for you, advise when ready to copy...SPA to BZM...". Me: huh? ATC: 091, ignore that, just fly heading 060. Me: Thank you.
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I think your experience is the same as most. BZM seems to be a northern focus point for keeping traffic clear of Charlotte approach and departure routes, with perhaps some consideration for Spartanburg area traffic as well. In your flight, it kind of gets you heading out of the way until CLT Approach figures out how to fit you in.
 
In the NYC area when flying near JFK, no matter what your initial clearance is you will eventually be sent directly to TRANZ.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
TRocket said:
I don't know about you, but no matter where I'm going, I somehow always get re-routed to Barrett's Mountain. I kid you not, one time I filed direct from GMU back to 8A6 (SE side of CLT just under the bravo) "091, I have an amended route for you, advise when ready to copy...SPA to BZM...". Me: huh? ATC: 091, ignore that, just fly heading 060. Me: Thank you.
Click to expand...

If CLT is landing north then your original path is cutting right through the FILPZ2, PARQR2, etc,etc, STARs so for future might want to see what direction CLT is landing and look at the STARs. That may help get you routed better.
 
jaybee said:
If CLT is landing north then your original path is cutting right through the FILPZ2, PARQR2, etc,etc, STARs so for future might want to see what direction CLT is landing and look at the STARs. That may help get you routed better.
Click to expand...

CLT refuses to handle IFR bugsmashers, to the point where not only will they rarely let you through the bravo, but where the surrounding tracons have to keep outside of their airspace...

To the west it is SPA, northwest is GENOD and BZM... then GSO, SDZ and CTF

(Though lately on the east side, they do PEKNN-LILLS-CTF)

Just frustrating when I want to go from GSO to GRD, I have to go the long way around, or over at 17K...
 
jaybee said:
If CLT is landing north then your original path is cutting right through the FILPZ2, PARQR2, etc,etc, STARs so for future might want to see what direction CLT is landing and look at the STARs. That may help get you routed better.
Click to expand...
And if CLT is landing south, how many STARs (and SIDS) are you cutting through? Unless/Until CLT starts routing right over the top, I suspect you are pretty much going to be moved out of the way, north or south.
 
Tflhndn said:
CLT refuses to handle IFR bugsmashers, to the point where not only will they rarely let you through the bravo...
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This is very true, however, I was pretty surprised though last week, VFR to EXX with FF, didn't even ask for it and got "cleared into the Bravo if you hit it"...I about fell over.

midlifeflyer said:
And if CLT is landing south, how many STARs (and SIDS) are you cutting through? Unless/Until CLT starts routing right over the top, I suspect you are pretty much going to be moved out of the way, north or south.
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Should be clear of them on that route and usually don't have any trouble. And they will route you right over the top, have gotten that a few times heading west to AVL, (I know several others that have as well), if they get you to 5000 they will send you right over mid field at CLT
 
Ironically, I have found it easier to get a Bravo clearance (VFR) than to even get close enough to talk to CLT (IFR)
 
bnt83 said:
When are they gonna text message small aircraft with this stuff lol
Click to expand...

kgruber said:
Text directly into autopilot.
Click to expand...

We're living in the future, guys. You can get your expected route from ForeFlight (or even FlightAware) and load that directly into your navigator via FliteStream. It's not a substitute for calling clearance delivery like CPDLC is, but it's pretty slick. Probably the biggest "gotcha" is that you won't see SIDs that don't have fixes (e.g. stuff that gives you an initial heading and tell you to expect vectors on course), and of course you still need someone to give you altitudes, frequency, and squawk. Still, it's awfully nice not to have to figure out how to spell some intersection you've never heard of without asking a harried controller to give it to you phonetically, and it saves a lot of knob twisting.
 
starglider said:
We're living in the future, guys. You can get your expected route from ForeFlight (or even FlightAware)
Click to expand...
Not necessarily all are going to connect with a panel navigator, but we're seeing more and more use of "expected" clearances. I think FltPlan.com has been doing it the longest, but in addition to ForeFlight, I know Aerovie (iOS) and AvNav EFB (Android) have that functionally as well. Probably a few others.

Not perfect and in some areas might not even be particularly helpful, but definitely a nice feature.
 
When I fly from Houston to Dallas (LBX or HOU to GPM) the expected route I get from ForeFlight is usually pretty close to what I end up with. The change is usually just vectors to some point past IAH then as filed.

When I fly back I always get something else from GPM. Regardless of what I file or ForeFlight shows (usually Joe Pool) I get vectors to somewhere near Waco then direct CLL and as filed. DFW's traffic passes almost directly over GPM so I'm guessing they take me west to keep me away from the DFW flights. It usually doesn't add more than 5 minutes to the as-filed flight time and the controllers are great to work with so I just plan on it now. I have the route they always give me stored as a route in the 430 now and usually have it loaded before I pick up my clearance.

Gary
 
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