2022 flying plan dilemma

Mahneuvers

Mahneuvers

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Mahneuvers
My plan for 2022 was to get checked out in a SR22. I have some longer cross countries I want to do and a 172 would make it painful. (As an aside, I was cruising around Lake Murray the other day and I swear there was a bass boat pulling away from me! I know those things can be super fast, but, come on.) Longer term I’d like to enter a SR22 partnership, but, w/ prices what they are and how hard it is to find good partners, I might be waiting a long time.

I just renewed my insurance upping it to meet the SR22 rental requirements and in ~two more flights I’ll have the minimum time the FBO requires. Since I’m now so close, I looked at their website and, low and behold, they no longer have a SR22 at the airport on my side of town :-( They have a SR20 but it’s G3 with Continental IO-360 which I understand is woefully under-powered. I also read here some insurance companies don’t count SR20 time when writing SR22 policies so any time I build might not help me if/when I start flying 22s.

There was a guy a year ago looking for non-equity partners in a really nice Comanche. That didn’t pan out b/c his insurance required 300 hours (I’m at 245 now). I’m at a cross roads. Do I start flying the SR20, do I continue building time in the 172, or both? The SR20 is 4X the hourly rental cost of my club’s 172 so if I go the SR20 route I expect I will not fly as much. If I go the both route, since I only fly ~70 hours/year, I worry I’m exchanging high proficiency in one air frame for less proficiency split across two. Yes, I know I’m over thinking this, but would appreciate perspectives I might not be considering.
 
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chicks will dig the cirrus just for the stupid butterfly doors alone, so I'd fly that one. since you're gonna spend all your money on flying regardless, might as well do it at decent speeds. plus, probably no one ever will ask you how much 172 time you have.
 
If you have a choice between a 172 in your club or a much more expensive SR20/22 at some place like EQY, I’d stick with the 172. But if you can find a good deal on a 182, I’d do that.
 
What’s a better $ per nm?

Also, SR20s aren’t bad.. just need extra runway…
 
What kind of flying do you plan to do? My ‘cut’ line for something faster than a 172 is 3.5hrs/350NM legs since that about as ling and far as I can usually fly a 172 without having to stop. Since that is what I *mostly* fly, I’m partners in a 172, but a 182/equivalent would be preferable.
 
eman1200 said:
chicks will dig the cirrus just for the stupid butterfly doors alone, so I'd fly that one. since you're gonna spend all your money on flying regardless, might as well do it at decent speeds. plus, probably no one ever will ask you how much 172 time you have.
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How much 172 time do you have?
 
kaiser said:
What’s a better $ per nm?…
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The SR20 is 400% more expensive for a 45% increase in airspeed so not a particularly great trade off just by that measure. AC, avionics and not something 50 years old makes it a little more compelling.
 
TCABM said:
What kind of flying do you plan to do? My ‘cut’ line for something faster than a 172 is 3.5hrs/350NM...182/equivalent would be preferable
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There's a flight I'd like to do 2-3/year that is 395NM. Based on responses so far, I've started looking for a 182.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
There's a flight I'd like to do 2-3/year that is 395NM. Based on responses so far, I've started looking for a 182.
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182 is nice, but it ain't fast.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
There's a flight I'd like to do 2-3/year that is 395NM. Based on responses so far, I've started looking for a 182.
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Edge case. How many other flights that don’t make that cut do you make in a year?
 
Salty said:
myflightbook.com does all that for you. ;)
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I know. Spreadsheets are so old school, but, I'm kind of a spreadsheet nut. In the late 80s, I had online bill pay before there was such a thing. At the time, there was only touch-tone bill payment where you called an 800 # and then pressed a bunch of digits to instruct the bank who to pay, how much and when. I wrote an Excel macro to go through a spreadsheet of transactions identifying bills that hadn't been paid. The macro then took control of the modem and sent all of the necessary touch tones to call the bank and otherwise press all the digits I would have otherwise had to press. It never paid for itself in time savings by a long shot...but it was pretty cool :)

Maybe it's user error, but I wish Garmin Pilot did a better job with the logbook feature. It gives me rough figures but requires a lot of editing to be completely accurate.
 
TCABM said:
Edge case. How many other flights that don’t make that cut do you make in a year?
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Maybe 1-2 @317NM...so not many...5 longer flights max/year.
 
Four times the rate of a 172 for a SR20? o_O Ouch! I was going to suggest the SR20 for more speed and cabin room until I saw that. Yeesh.

I feel your pain though. Early in my flying we did a weekend in Charleston. There were 50 knot headwinds on the way home. :eek: Yeah, we were in a 172, with a 160 hp engine. :( I remember looking down and seeing the traffic on the interstate going faster than we were. :oops: That began my hunt for more speed. ;)

Build up your hours. Keep plugging away at it. Keep looking for speed options. The 182 or the Comanche are good options. More speed and high performance, and complex with the Comanche.

Do you have your instrument rating? You're looking at SR22 and Comanche planes, so you probably have it. If not, that's a great thing to have for traveling. Plus it could help you build a bunch of more hours. A 172 works perfectly fine for that.
 
wayne said:
Four times the rate of a 172 for a SR20? o_O Ouch! ...
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The difference is more of a statement about how great the club I'm in is. To get the best rate, I have to volunteer etc. Stuff I'd be willing to do anyways to support the club.

I have my instrument rating. I was toying w/ the idea of getting my commercial but now that I'm basic med I'd have to incur the hassle of a class 2. I know that shouldn't make a difference but when I don't really have a need for commercial in the first place it does factor into it.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
Maybe 1-2 @317NM...so not many...5 longer flights max/year.
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I *think* you’re in the CO area. I would get involved with CPA and a local EAA chapter, and building my network to find a partnership in something that’s along the spectrum, not at the ends.

And you don’t need an FAA class II medical to get the CSEL certificate.
 
TCABM said:
I *think* you’re in the CO area...
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I'm in north CarOlina :)

I'm unfamiliar with EAA. I'll check it out as there are some chapters not too far.

...and thanks for the Class II correction. That might make a difference in my thinking.
 
idahoflier said:
Sounds like you're going to spend a lot of $ to save yourself maybe 2 hrs round trip or 4-6 hrs a year? If it was me I would stick with the C172...
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I'm starting to think that way.

Here are some other aspects of my thinking which I haven't previously mentioned. Some of these trips will be related to visiting a rental property for maintenance purposes. I can offset the property rental income with plane rental expense. That makes the rental cost difference a little more palatable. Also, my club plane is currently not WAAS equipped nor does it have an autopilot. I've yet to fly a "hard IFR" flight and knowing I have an autopilot on deck if I get the leans or something gives me a sense of comfort. I've expressed similar thoughts in the past here and have been told I should not fly IFR until I'm ready to do it by hand, so, no need to go down that alley again.
 
EdFred said:
That's pretty cool it will auotmatically convert paper logs to digital. How does that work?
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It will import from excel files, which he already has. Nobody said it will automatically convert paper logs to digital, so why would you think that?
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
Finally! All those hours keying my logbook into a spreadsheet to create a pivot table finally pays off: 154.2
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If he spent hours keying them into Excel, the presupposition is that it was a transfer from paper to electronic.
Salty said:
myflightbook.com does all that for you. ;)
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I read "all that" as a statement that myflightbook will scan it to electronic since the statement "all that" was used. If it was only in regards to showing 172 time, then I would have expected a statement of "myflightbook will list flights by type." So...
EdFred said:
That's pretty cool it will auotmatically convert paper logs to digital. How does that work?
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Salty said:
It will import from excel files, which he already has. Nobody said it will automatically convert paper logs to digital, so why would you think that?
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Because you said "all that." All meaning it also included the converting of to digital to paper. There is software out there that will do that (convert from paper to electronic) now, which is why I asked. The pulling up of specific flights/hours by type/weather/rules/solo/pic/training/etc is a yawner. My self made database had been doing that for years before myflightbook (and I assume the other ones everyone uses) existed. The paper => electronic would be a game changer.
 
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EdFred said:
If he spent hours keying them into Excel, the presupposition is that it was a transfer from paper to electronic.

I read "all that" as a statement that myflightbook will scan it to electronic since the statement "all that" was used. If it was only in regards to showing 172 time, then I would have expected a statement of "myflightbook will list flights by type." So...


Because you said "all that." All meaning it also included the converting of to digital to paper. There is software out there that will do that (convert from paper to electronic) now, which is why I asked. The pulling up of specific flights/hours by type/weather/rules/solo/pic/training/etc is a yawner. My self made database had been doing that for years before myflightbook (and I assume the other ones everyone uses) existed. The paper => electronic would be a game changer.
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It doesn’t get you laid either. Sorry I wasn’t specific enough.
 
Do you want to be a pilot or do you want to be a Cirrus pilot? I keed, but really I think you should do whatever gets you the most time. If being able to take long cross-country trips is going to get you in the air more, do that. But if the cost is going to mean you fly less overall, don't do that.
 
I think, to summarize this thread, and echo what has been said in other threads, "Buy something that covers 90% of your missions, and rent for the other 10%." In your case, I think a 182 would be a good choice, don't know how their prices compare to SR20/22's, because they are in high demand. Then, for the few long-distance trips, just endure.

The ultimate answer, though, is to buy a BO. ;)
 
Since you are not anticipating a ton of longer flights, I would stick with a 172, or if you could swing it, a 182. If you figure the block-to-block time for 5 or 6 365 nm flights and compare a SR22 to a 172 using performance numbers from the POH, your overall time savings will likely not be huge but the extra cost sounds like it would be pretty significant. And if you would be flying less, the extra speed in a SR22, especially flying IFR, would make staying ahead of the airplane more difficult. It might be safer for you and your wife staying with a little bit slower airplane.

Last thing, take your wife out to the airport and see which airplane she likes better. The cool factor might not outweigh having to climb up on the wing to get in. She might like the high wing better. If you were doing a lot of long distance travelling, then the SR22 would be a real asset. For travelling like most of us do (if you sift out the BS), probably not.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
My plan for 2022 was to get checked out in a SR22. I have some longer cross countries I want to do and a 172 would make it painful. (As an aside, I was cruising around Lake Murray the other day and I swear there was a bass boat pulling away from me! I know those things can be super fast, but, come on.) Longer term I’d like to enter a SR22 partnership, but, w/ prices what they are and how hard it is to find good partners, I might be waiting a long time.

I just renewed my insurance upping it to meet the SR22 rental requirements and in ~two more flights I’ll have the minimum time the FBO requires. Since I’m now so close, I looked at their website and, low and behold, they no longer have a SR22 at the airport on my side of town :-( They have a SR20 but it’s G3 with Continental IO-360 which I understand is woefully under-powered. I also read here some insurance companies don’t count SR20 time when writing SR22 policies so any time I build might not help me if/when I start flying 22s.

There was a guy a year ago looking for non-equity partners in a really nice Comanche. That didn’t pan out b/c his insurance required 300 hours (I’m at 245 now). I’m at a cross roads. Do I start flying the SR20, do I continue building time in the 172, or both? The SR20 is 4X the hourly rental cost of my club’s 172 so if I go the SR20 route I expect I will not fly as much. If I go the both route, since I only fly ~70 hours/year, I worry I’m exchanging high proficiency in one air frame for less proficiency split across two. Yes, I know I’m over thinking this, but would appreciate perspectives I might not be considering.
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The 20 is not woefully underpowered, especially compared to a 172, lol. It is a great airplane, 150 knots true, not bad range for two, great step for a low time pilot. It is not a 22, but still a great little airplane.
 
PaulS said:
The 20 is not woefully underpowered, especially compared to a 172, lol. It is a great airplane, 150 knots true, not bad range for two, great step for a low time pilot. It is not a 22, but still a great little airplane.
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That sounds high to me. 150 mph maybe.
 
Salty said:
Sr20 with an io-390?
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Yup. That's what the new ones come with, 215 hp. They are no slouch, they get disparaged over on the copa sight, mostly by the clueless. They are sweet airplanes. I have about 200 hours in both combined.
 
PaulS said:
Yup. That's what the new ones come with, 215 hp. They are no slouch, they get disparaged over on the copa sight, mostly by the clueless. They are sweet airplanes. I have about 200 hours in both combined.
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I didn't enjoy my couple hours in one. I didn't see those kinds of speeds either, but I wasn't going cross country.
 
Salty said:
I didn't enjoy my couple hours in one. I didn't see those kinds of speeds either, but I wasn't going cross country.
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75 % between 4 and 8, I see 150kts true all the time. I have about 10 hours in the Lycoming version this year. Climb gets anemic on hot days, mainly to keep it cool, but still not a slouch.
 
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