1st Class Medical with 2 Alcohol incidents

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Austin Ferreira

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Hello everyone!
I’m currently in the process of trying to obtain my first class medical certificate and I need some help/advice. I have a DUI (.14) followed by a “wet & reckless” (.08) the incidents occurred 7 months apart. I was arrested on (11/12/16) for the second incident, and convicted on (5/2/17). I have had no legal trouble since then as I have been completely clean and sober since 12/16/16, although I don’t have any formal proof of this. I do have proof of completion for an 18 month alcohol recovery program ordered by the court. I was also ordered to wear a “SCRAM” unit (alcohol detecting anklet) for 90 days which I also have proof of successful completion. I realize I’ve put myself considerably behind the 8 ball and I’m willing to jump through all the hoops that the FAA requires, to my understanding that is going to be a costly HIMS/Psych evaluation. I’m totally fine with that, heck I’d pee in a cup everyday for the next 20 years if I have to. I was never dependent on alcohol, and had absolutely no problem giving it up cold turkey. I honestly don’t even like the feeling of being buzzed, drunk, or out of my normal mind state. I won’t even take the pain killers after the dentist because I’d rather just deal with the pain than feel out of it and nauseous. I can honestly say that I have no doubts about my state of mind and I’m completely confident that I’m fit to fly. However I also understand that the FAA doesn’t care what I think, because I’ve demonstrated poor decision making.

My question is, what can I do to go above and beyond, and prove that I’m doing everything humanly possibly to make this happen? I really don’t feel like AA is necessary or would benefit me in any way other than satisfying the FAA, but I’ve seen several forums where people suggest this, so it is something I’m willing to do if it will help me down the road. My paperwork (Statements, Court docs, Police reports, BAC, etc.) have all been submitted to the FAA so I’m already expecting the HIMS evaluation and saving money to pay for it. What else should I be doing to prove that I’m absolutely committed, laser focused and sober? I want to fly more than I’ve ever wanted anything in life and I’m ready to do whatever it takes to prove that. I don’t care if it takes 30 years, I’m going to fly, or I’ll die trying. I know 1st class medicals have been issued under worse circumstances than mine, so it is possible. Whether I can get a job or not down the line is the next question. if any of you more experienced pilots have any advice for a young aspiring aviator who wants to right the wrongs of his past, please speak up! I will do quite literally anything to make this happen.

Thanks for your time and happy flying!!
Austin Ferreira
 
What you can do is go to AA, log it twice a week (and get a sponsor), or go to a Certified Alcohol And Drug counselor weekly for an education. The crux of your evaluation will be with a HIMS psychiatrist, and you are "early" in the course- e.g. your post merely dismisses out of hand that "I was never dependent on alcohol"...."FAA sez who?". The whole purpose of the education is to groc the difference between asserted abstinence and of recovery. THEY ARE TWO SEPARATE Things, and if you cannot understand and articulate the difference you will be ruled "dependent-dry" and sent to formal rehab. .

No the answer you expected but you did say, "what can I do to go above and beyond" and I have just said how to show continued recovery activities.

In the meantime your AME should be running a HIMS -std private program to substantiate your assertion of sobriety. Which is just an assertion at this time, without random ETGs.

"I know 1st class medicals have been issued under worse circumstances than mine". How do you know this? Do you know the details of his understanding, of his evaluation?

**
I don't mean to rain on your parade, but this is how FAA views it.
 
Brad Z said:
I'd leave that commentary out of any personal statements you send the FAA. That's what they're trying to avoid.
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i understand why you’d want to avoid saying that to the FAA. I certainly did not say that in my statement. I was just trying to make it clear that I’m ready to do whatever it takes, and I’m not going to give up. Appreciate your time and your comment. Thank you!
 
bbchien said:
What you can do is go to AA, log it twice a week (and get a sponsor), or go to a Certified Alcohol And Drug counselor weekly for an education. The crux of your evaluation will be with a HIMS psychiatrist, and you are "early" in the course- e.g. your post merely dismisses out of hand that "I was never dependent on alcohol"...."FAA sez who?". The whole purpose of the education is to groc the difference between asserted abstinence and of recovery. THEY ARE TWO SEPARATE Things, and if you cannot understand and articulate the difference you will be ruled "dependent-dry" and sent to formal rehab. .

No the answer you expected but you did say, "what can I do to go above and beyond" and I have just said how to show continued recovery activities.

In the meantime your AME should be running a HIMS -std private program to substantiate your assertion of sobriety. Which is just an assertion at this time, without random ETGs.

"I know 1st class medicals have been issued under worse circumstances than mine". How do you know this? Do you know the details of his understanding, of (his evaluation?

**
I don't mean to rain on your parade, but this is how FAA views it.
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g


Thanks for your comment, your insight is appreciated.

I was not trying to dismiss or minimize these incidents in any way, nor was I trying to act like i didn’t have a problem with alcohol. It’s apparent that I did have a problem and the proof is in the DUI’s. All I was trying to convey, is that I was never “dependent” in the sense that I never HAD to have alcohol, the only time I would drink was sociably with friends. When it was time to quit, I did so with little effort, and didn’t look back, because alcohol was never a big part of my life. Again, not trying to dismiss my mistakes. I own them and take full responsibility, but I can truthfully say that it was extremely easy to give up alcohol and keep it that way. There’s not an ounce of me today that wants to drink. I have much bigger goals and dreams now and I’m determined to reach success. I have several other go-to outlets to keep myself occupied that don’t involve drinking, including classical piano, guitar, performance engine builds, video and photo and plenty more. I’ve been in several situations where I had the opportunity to drink, but was never tempted in the slightest. I can be around it without a problem. I believe I’ve learned my lessons and I’ve taken significant action to ensure that it stays that way. I have become a much better person through these mistakes. Clearly the FAA doesn’t and shouldn’t care about my own self evaluation, which Is why I am also willing to take any additional action so I CAN substantiate my claim of sobriety. I just wasn’t sure of the best way to do that, so here I am.

I don’t know the details of anybody else’s evaluations, but I know of people with multiple offenses with higher BAC’s who hold a first class, so it was more of a “light at the end of the tunnel” way of thinking. Obviously everybody’s circumstances are different but it gives me hope that it is possible with enough hard work and determination.

Don’t apologize for “raining on my parade”! That was the purpose of this post, to see if I was within the realm of possibility. I appreciate your time and thank you for your help. I hope to see you in the skies someday!
 
Austin F said:
Next meeting is tomorrow at 8 pm. You can bet your bottom dollar that I will be in attendance.
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I don’t know if you “need” AA or not. I do know that as you move through this FAA Medical process, there are going to be a lot of people who are going to be looking closely at you, and many or most of them don’t care a bit whether or not you ever sit in a cockpit again. Attending AA is a component of the message you’re trying to send them. Might be a waste of your time, but it's possible that it will be helpful.
 
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This whole ball of wax is in the hoops the FAA wants to see. If I found myself in your situation, I would be in contact with a local HIMS AME for a consult on how to get the process started. AA is one path, but there is much more to do before getting there.

the FAA is government and they are concerned with what is provable. There is a process and standards to follow. A local HIMS AME is the person to lay it out for you.
 
The FAA sees dependence as even just "indifference to not drinking." You don't need to be to the DT-withdrawal stage, just the fact that you'd just as soon throw a few back than not.
 
flyingron said:
The FAA sees dependence as even just "indifference to not drinking." You don't need to be to the DT-withdrawal stage, just the fact that you'd just as soon throw a few back than not.
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I agree. But does the FAA not recognize that people ARE able to turn their lives around? I’m 4 years sober in 9 days, I’m willing to submit to any and every test they require, I will go to AA, I will get evaluated, random alcohol/drug tests. You name it I’m there. It was a simple decision for me to stop drinking after seeing the destruction it was starting to cause in my life. I’ve actually even helped several of my friends, and my sister, who was a serious alcoholic, make a 180. She now has several welding certifications, a good job, and gave up the drink. I’ve gone the opposite way with things. Think Bill W.

I spoke with my AME a few days ago and she was confident that a few things might play in my favor, however I see this as wishful thinking and I’m not going to count on it

1. I was fairly young when this all happened (22)
2. I wasn’t pursuing a career in aviation
3. my BAC’s weren’t alarmingly high (yes too high nonetheless)
4. My willingness to submit to whatever tests or evaluations they want.

I guess she would know better than I would, but I don’t see these things really doing much for me.
 
bflynn said:
This whole ball of wax is in the hoops the FAA wants to see. If I found myself in your situation, I would be in contact with a local HIMS AME for a consult on how to get the process started. AA is one path, but there is much more to do before getting there.

the FAA is government and they are concerned with what is provable. There is a process and standards to follow. A local HIMS AME is the person to lay it out for you.
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Thanks for your advice, I will definitely get in contact with my local HIMS AME and see what I can do to get the ball rolling. I totally understand the liability involved and the necessity to prove that my claims are more than just that. I’m going to attend AA on top of whatever the HIMS recommends, to show another level of commitment. I take all of this very seriously, and I will do everything in my power to show that I will be a safe, responsible, effective, and efficient pilot.
 
MacFly said:
I don’t know if you “need” AA or not. I do know that as you move through this FAA Medical process, there are going to be a lot of people who are going to be looking closely at you, and many or most of them don’t care a bit whether or not you ever sit in a cockpit again. Attending AA is a component of the message you’re trying to send them. Might be a waste of your time, but it's possible that it will be helpful.
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if it gets me closer to that certificate, I wouldn’t view it as a waste of time at all. Just something that’s gotta be done as a result of my actions. Ive taken responsibility and I accept that this process is going to be a lot longer and more difficult because of it.

Again, thank you for your time, your advice is much appreciated!!
 
The fact that there are two incidents is going to automatically provide you with a diagnosis of Dependence from the FAA under DSM-IV, no questions asked. Actually, there will be a lot of questions asked, but this will be the end result. The current medical community no longer uses this standard....... no matter.

The attitude you convey in your writing is that of "I was never dependent in the first place. I'm done. I no longer need to worry about this, but I'll DO whatever I need to do to get a 1st Class Medical."

The potential problem I see is that the FAA will diagnose you with dependence. Your opinion is that you were never dependent. If they perceive this as how you view yourself, there could be some issues. Now at the end of the day, continued documented sobriety may win out and you get your medical nonetheless....... I don't know.

The attitude the FAA will want perceive in you is that of "I had a problem. That problem is prone to come back, and I am aware of this. I'll continue to be proactive and not grow complacent in my attitude towards the danger that alcohol represents to me."

Edit...... I heartily recommend you remove your last name from earlier posts at the very least.
 
Austin F said:
I agree. But does the FAA not recognize that people ARE able to turn their lives around? I’m 4 years sober in 9 days, I’m willing to submit to any and every test they require, I will go to AA, I will get evaluated, random alcohol/drug tests. .
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The problem is proving it.

Since the pilot's license and the medical are privileges granted by the FAA, they determine what is required to prove that you are qualified.

For a pilot's license, the specifications are pretty clear and laid out in the regs. For medical issues, there is guidance and internal manuals that can (and usually are) made available to the public. But in the end, grant of a medical - outside of demonstrating that you meet the standards in the routine checklist that an AME uses (or the equivalent for basic med) - requires proving that you comply with the additional requirements in the judgement of the examiner/reviewer in the FAA medical office. It means jumping through the hoops specified because the FAA can only see what's documented on paper in front of them. That requires more than taking your word for it.

From the perspective of the FAA medical office, if they deviate from the existing internal standards or authorize something new they need to justify it, document it, and assure that it will still be "safe" for the "public". And if something happens as a result of that deviation/new authorization, they put the agency at risk of having Congressman Blowhard, the NTSB, the Secretary of Transportation, the White House, and ultimately the voters come down on them. And that's addition to any legal action that results from a crash or incident. So any "error" will tend to be on the "safe" side (in other words, denial). Administrative law puts the burden on YOU, not the FAA.

Dr. Bruce said it best in another thread: the military guys "get it" because they know do what's asked, check the boxes, and not argue. He gave you advice upthread - Take that advice.

Ultimately, it's up to you to prove that you're sober and safe - and you've already got two incidents that indicate you might not be.
 
KeepWatch said:
The fact that there are two incidents is going to automatically provide you with a diagnosis of Dependence from the FAA under DSM-IV, no questions asked. Actually, there will be a lot of questions asked, but this will be the end result. The current medical community no longer uses this standard....... no matter.

The attitude you convey in your writing is that of "I was never dependent in the first place. I'm done. I no longer need to worry about this, but I'll DO whatever I need to do to get a 1st Class Medical."

The potential problem I see is that the FAA will diagnose you with dependence. Your opinion is that you were never dependent. If they perceive this as how you view yourself, there could be some issues. Now at the end of the day, continued documented sobriety may win out and you get your medical nonetheless....... I don't know.

The attitude the FAA will want perceive in you is that of "I had a problem. That problem is prone to come back, and I am aware of this. I'll continue to be proactive and not grow complacent in my attitude towards the danger that alcohol represents to me."

Edit...... I heartily recommend you remove your last name from earlier posts at the very least.
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I was never trying to convey that I didn’t have a problem with alcohol. I stated several times that I did. I just dealt with the problem swiftly, and it hasn’t been an issue since, so yes I will give myself credit. I also have several other outlets to go to instead of drinking. There are many things that are much more important to me than drinking, that keep me from doing so. I’m very aware that the problem could come back and I haven’t grown complacent in the slightest in the fact that I’m sober. However I’ve gone through major setbacks, breakups, and hard times in the past 4 years where it would’ve been easy to have a drink, but I was able to stay strong and stay sober and I do take pride in that. I will give myself credit for turning my life around and doing the right thing. I’m sorry if i’m coming off as if there was never a problem, there most certainly was, and I’ve tried to acknowledge that fact in every comment I’ve posted on here.

when I say I’ll do anything to get my first class medical, that means continued sobriety, proactive action to keep it that way, as well as proof for the FAA that I have been sober and have every intention of remaining sober. Not, “I got my medical I can go get drunk now”. No. Not the case at all. Like I’ve said before, I take the safety of everyone in the skies very seriously. I take my sobriety very seriously. I want to be an outstanding pilot and I will PROVE that I can handle the responsibility.

Unfortunately I did not make an account before I posted this thread so I cannot edit the name. You’re right, not the brightest idea in hindsight.. I’ve requested the moderators to edit or take this thread down. thanks for your time.
 
Expunged records? So, if possible, and after 5 years of AA meetings, etc., he goes before a judge and gets the record expunged, what happens?

Legally it didn't happen. There is no record available. But I would think the FAA wouldn't care about that legal definition, would still want to know "have you ever in your life" been arrested, etc. Has expunging then getting a medical ever happened? Would this ever be a good idea? On one hand, it could giving a sober person a fresh start; on the other hand, it could let let a sober alcoholic untrained on how to keep sober fly a plane full of people.

BTW - what is it about flying you want to do? Hobby? Profession? I'm curious why you are working to get a 1st class at this time. Were you already a pilot?
 
WDD said:
Expunged records? So, if possible, and after 5 years of AA meetings, etc., he goes before a judge and gets the record expunged, what happens?

Legally it didn't happen. There is no record available. But I would think the FAA wouldn't care about that legal definition, would still want to know "have you ever in your life" been arrested, etc. Has expunging then getting a medical ever happened? Would this ever be a good idea? On one hand, it could giving a sober person a fresh start; on the other hand, it could let let a sober alcoholic untrained on how to keep sober fly a plane full of people.

BTW - what is it about flying you want to do? Hobby? Profession?
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Well after reading most of these comments I’m starting to wonder if I even have a chance for either
 
WDD said:
Expunged records? So, if possible, and after 5 years of AA meetings, etc., he goes before a judge and gets the record expunged, what happens?

Legally it didn't happen. There is no record available. But I would think the FAA wouldn't care about that legal definition, would still want to know "have you ever in your life" been arrested, etc. Has expunging then getting a medical ever happened? Would this ever be a good idea? On one hand, it could giving a sober person a fresh start; on the other hand, it could let let a sober alcoholic untrained on how to keep sober fly a plane full of people.

BTW - what is it about flying you want to do? Hobby? Profession? Did you used to have a 3rd class? I'm curious why you are working to get a 1st class at this time. Were you already a pilot?
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no, I’ve never held a medical certificate. Ultimately I’d love for aviation to be my profession, but when it comes down to it, I just want to fly. I know I’d be a great pilot regardless of any of this. Not about money at all. Just a huge passion of mine.
 
Professional pilot sounds like a very hard road

But after you get your life settled out - fantastic that you’re doing AA! - you could do sport license - fly light sport aircraft maybe. Doesn’t require a medical, you fly on a drivers license
 
WDD said:
Expunged records? So, if possible, and after 5 years of AA meetings, etc., he goes before a judge and gets the record expunged, what happens?

Legally it didn't happen. There is no record available. But I would think the FAA wouldn't care about that legal definition, would still want to know "have you ever in your life" been arrested, etc. Has expunging then getting a medical ever happened? Would this ever be a good idea? On one hand, it could giving a sober person a fresh start; on the other hand, it could let let a sober alcoholic untrained on how to keep sober fly a plane full of people.

BTW - what is it about flying you want to do? Hobby? Profession?
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I don't think the FAA cares about expunged records. The question they ask is "have you ever...". You have to answer, and you can't lie.
 
Austin F said:
I agree. But does the FAA not recognize that people ARE able to turn their lives around? I’m 4 years sober in 9 days, I’m willing to submit to any and every test they require, I will go to AA, I will get evaluated, random alcohol/drug tests. You name it I’m there. It was a simple decision for me to stop drinking after seeing the destruction it was starting to cause in my life. I’ve actually even helped several of my friends, and my sister, who was a serious alcoholic, make a 180. She now has several welding certifications, a good job, and gave up the drink. I’ve gone the opposite way with things. Think Bill W.

I spoke with my AME a few days ago and she was confident that a few things might play in my favor, however I see this as wishful thinking and I’m not going to count on it

1. I was fairly young when this all happened (22)
2. I wasn’t pursuing a career in aviation
3. my BAC’s weren’t alarmingly high (yes too high nonetheless)
4. My willingness to submit to whatever tests or evaluations they want.

I guess she would know better than I would, but I don’t see these things really doing much for me.
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Yes they do recognize when an individual has turned their life around, but there are many many hoops. The hops are there to make as certain as possible that the "square filers" don't get through. The crucial item is, "What's between your ears", not just what's in your mouth. Its' tough to determine accurately and it's an exhaustive process.

Check out if your AME is on the "HIMS" AME list. If not, seek a different advisor The 120 odd HIMS AMEs are trained in the FAA view of your situation. A garden variety AME, Even Senior, is generally not.
 
WDD said:
Expunged records? So, if possible, and after 5 years of AA meetings, etc., he goes before a judge and gets the record expunged, what happens?

Legally it didn't happen. There is no record available. But I would think the FAA wouldn't care about that legal definition, would still want to know "have you ever in your life" been arrested, etc. Has expunging then getting a medical ever happened? Would this ever be a good idea? On one hand, it could giving a sober person a fresh start; on the other hand, it could let let a sober alcoholic untrained on how to keep sober fly a plane full of people.

BTW - what is it about flying you want to do? Hobby? Profession? I'm curious why you are working to get a 1st class at this time. Were you already a pilot?
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Wrong. Expunged records are sealed, not destroyed. They can be obtained by law enforcement and government agencies with court approval. It is also my understanding that if the records were sent to the FBI, they may or may not honor expungement requests.

Doesn't really matter with respect to the FAA - the question asks whether you have ever, in your life, had the issue.
 
bbchien said:
Yes they do recognize when an individual has turned their life around, but there are many many hoops. The hops are there to make as certain as possible that the "square filers" don't get through. The crucial item is, "What's between your ears", not just what's in your mouth. Its' tough to determine accurately and it's an exhaustive process.

Check out if your AME is on the "HIMS" AME list. If not, seek a different advisor The 120 odd HIMS AMEs are trained in the FAA view of your situation. A garden variety AME, Even Senior, is generally not.
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I understand that. I’ll stick with it however long it takes and do whatever’s required for the FAA to be confident that I’m not going to be a liability.

I looked into it and my AME is in fact on the “HIMS” list.
 
KeepWatch said:
The fact that there are two incidents is going to automatically provide you with a diagnosis of Dependence from the FAA under DSM-IV, no questions asked. Actually, there will be a lot of questions asked, but this will be the end result. The current medical community no longer uses this standard....... no matter.

The attitude you convey in your writing is that of "I was never dependent in the first place. I'm done. I no longer need to worry about this, but I'll DO whatever I need to do to get a 1st Class Medical."

The potential problem I see is that the FAA will diagnose you with dependence. Your opinion is that you were never dependent. If they perceive this as how you view yourself, there could be some issues. Now at the end of the day, continued documented sobriety may win out and you get your medical nonetheless....... I don't know.

The attitude the FAA will want perceive in you is that of "I had a problem. That problem is prone to come back, and I am aware of this. I'll continue to be proactive and not grow complacent in my attitude towards the danger that alcohol represents to me."

Edit...... I heartily recommend you remove your last name from earlier posts at the very least.
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This might get a ban hammer but I’m having a problem with everybody coaching this guy and the others in a similar situation what to tell the FAA and you need to have this attitude and say this word and oh don’t do this and don’t do that when obviously this guy has that attitude and has that problem. Y’all are helping him game the system just because you don’t like it.
 
Seems to me that most folks are trying to be encouraging and helpful to someone who is trying to turn his life around. It’s not so much about “gaming the system” and more about not getting in your own way as you navigate a very rigid process.
 
It's my understanding that the small population of certified AME's in this field are further confined by those that significantly practice it as a specialty. I'd want to find the AME (nationwide) that does these often and the FAA trusts. Then do whatever they say and expect a long drawn out effort.
 
Dave Theisen said:
Seems to me that most folks are trying to be encouraging and helpful to someone who is trying to turn his life around. It’s not so much about “gaming the system” and more about not getting in your own way as you navigate a very rigid process.
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Really, reviewing some of the post here I see the phrases, this is what the FAA wants to hear. This is the attitude that the FAA want to see. With the OP going oh OK yeah I can do that, whatever it takes. How is that not coaching?
 
Morgan3820 said:
Really, reviewing some of the post here I see the phrases, this is what the FAA wants to hear. This is the attitude that the FAA want to see. With the OP going oh OK yeah I can do that, whatever it takes. How is that not coaching?
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Isn't that just like what we do when we prepare for a checkride? This is how the DPE wants you to do the maneuver. This is the book answer to that question. It's just good preparation. It's too bad the OP posted all this under his real name, but c'est la vie.
 
Morgan3820 said:
Really, reviewing some of the post here I see the phrases, this is what the FAA wants to hear. This is the attitude that the FAA want to see. With the OP going oh OK yeah I can do that, whatever it takes. How is that not coaching?
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.

Coaching someone through the process is far from gaming the system.
 
Austin F said:
Whether I can get a job or not down the line is the next question.
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Nobody really addressed this. I have no wisdom on the FAA side of the process other than what's been said already.

However, I have made flying a pretty successful side business through flight instructing and contract work. It has been acceptably lucrative for me. And I have never once been asked about any criminal history, arrest records, etc., by any potential employer. That said, I also haven't flown for an airline or for any other "business" with an HR department, etc. I don't think I've ever actually filled out a job application for any of my flying jobs either.

So, I don't know if your history will or won't be an issue for any potential employer, but for anything I've done, I've never even been asked.
 
Dave Theisen said:
.

Coaching someone through the process is far from gaming the system.
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Telling somebody which form to fill out is helping. Telling them how to fill out and what words to use to get what they want that is gaming. IMHO. It is no different than writing the essay for your kid’s literature assignment.
 
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Morgan3820 said:
Telling somebody which form to fill out is helping. Telling them how to fill out and what words to use to get what they want that is gaming. IMHO. It is no different than writing the essay for your kid’s literature assignment.
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I agree. If the FAA was reasonable in their expectations I might care if someone provided the very specific assistance you’re referencing. As it is I could not care less. It’s neat that you do.
 
Morgan3820 said:
Telling somebody which form to fill out is helping. Telling them how to fill out and what words to use to get what they want that is gaming. IMHO. It is no different than writing the essay for your kid’s literature assignment.
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It’s not really possible to game the system when it comes to HIMS. You might be able to for a little bit but long term it’s not really possible. Your files go thru so many hands someone is going to see thru any BS. Eventually certain patterns or behaviors if negative would become apparent and you will be outed.
 
Morgan3820 said:
This might get a ban hammer but I’m having a problem with everybody coaching this guy and the others in a similar situation what to tell the FAA and you need to have this attitude and say this word and oh don’t do this and don’t do that when obviously this guy has that attitude and has that problem. Y’all are helping him game the system just because you don’t like it.
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I can assure you I’m not trying to “game the system” and like others in this thread have mentioned, I think it’d be nearly impossible to do so anyhow. I’m going to be put through the ringer. I’ll be expected to back up my claims with verifiable evidence, and I don’t think any amount of smooth talking or advice from anyone on here is going to be able to catapult me to my medical. The only way, is to prove I’m responsible and ready. Backed with evidence. If that takes 20 years, so be it. I’ll stick with it.

Now, with that being said, I can see your cause for concern. Obviously we don’t want to enable people who are not fit to fly and give them the keys to the kingdom. But based on everything I’ve seen on here, the chances of that happening are slim to none. I’d assume the FAA makes their decisions on a case by case basis and there’s no “one size fits all” approach to this process. You’d have to be able to fool several officials on multiple levels and you’d get tripped up somewhere along the way.
 
If this painful and long path outlined is "gaming the system", then yikes! I read it as "here is what you have to do" - go to AA and log the meetings, get checked by counselor, etc. Didn't sound like a work around - sounded like advice I would give a friend whether or not the FAA was involved. I also like the advice given of "you had 2 incidences - yes, there is a problem" instead of "here is how you get out of it".

My "expunge the records" question was academic - I can see how it might come across as sweeping things under the rug - which I do not advocate. It wasn't directly helpful to the OP, so I could have done without putting it up.
 
Austin F said:
I’m ready to do whatever it takes, and I’m not going to give up. ... when it comes down to it, I just want to fly.
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While working with HIMS AME for medical issues, remember options for some activities remain available.

Consider a discovery flight, lesson(s) with a flight instructor, study for knowledge test, checking sport pilot certificate, etc.

If aviation is described as a huge passion, not having a medical (or, not yet) isn’t an obstacle to begin, to see first-hand whether flying (in training environment) matches expectations.

Also might consider joining an aviation community; or setup a PoA forum profile. Many have and will offer encouragement.
 
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