Tug advice.

N747JB

N747JB

Final Approach
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Display name:
John
I’m getting into a hangar soon, hopefully! Any advice for a 414 tug? Flat ground, no incline, no snow or ice to deal with. I’m leaning towards something electric, remote control ones look cool, but I’m trying to keep it a little affordable.
What’s the scoop on the best, simple to operate tugs?
 
My hangar mate got a Aircraft Caddy 4k. It pretty cool. Used it once so far....I like everything about it....I am moving a PA46 with it..
 
Another vote for sidewinders. I have one for my T-Bone and hangar neighbor uses one for his TBM.
 
I sprang for an AC Air robot for the 310. I like being able to walk the wing while I move the plane. Its only weakness is ice, so I have to work around that. But it is worth every penny every time I don’t scrape one tip tank on the hangar wall or the other one on the rudder or the next plane over. I also sometimes drive it across the ramp to the fuel pump so I can gas up and go without multiple engine starts.
 
i hated the sidewinder. Got rid of it as it was just treacherous to use in tighter spaces. For a 414 - I would look at a best tug b8. I used on for my 421C.
 
Anthem said:
i hated the sidewinder. Got rid of it as it was just treacherous to use in tighter spaces. For a 414 - I would look at a best tug b8. I used on for my 421C.
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I'm very happy with my Best Tug also. Used ten or so different tugs over the years. You can get cheaper ones, for sure! And it might even be rational to deal with the hassle and fit and finish since you only use the tug a few minutes a year. But I like that my Best Tug "just works" and doesn't feel like it was cobbled together from whatever someone had laying around in their hangar.
 
I’ve used the Lil Sherman tugging my 310 for years. I bought it used from another 310 owner. It works great, and simply runs off of golf cart batteries.
 
Nice thing about a Sidewinder over others is you can fold it and take it with you to use on other ramps. :D
 
Tools said:
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One of my favorite parts of this industry is that half of it is "you must make this out of carbon fiber so it's light enough to be profitable" and the other half is "you must make this out of the heaviest and thickest metal you can so that the things in the first half don't go rolling places they shouldn't"
 
All the cool kids have AC Air. Buy once, cry once. As the owner of the company told me at a trade show "it's cheaper than hitting the hangar wall even one time".
He wasn't wrong. being able to stand by a wing tip or the back of the hangar is priceless..

As a bonus: it packs enough grunt to get all the way to the fuel island and back, saving multiple cold starts
 
The Sidewinder is definitely the budget choice. I have a tow bar from them that doesn't have the motorized portion and it's well made.

I'm currently using a Best Tugs B5, and it is VERY well made. I think my only complaints are that I'd prefer the switches to be in a different layout and labels lit, and for there to be a balancing system for the two batteries (they're connected in series and it seems to want to wear one out before the other).

Best Tugs does make a remote controlled tug as well. It has tires and not tracks like the AC TrackTech ones, but I think it'd be better if you have any bigger bumps to deal with.

There are a lot of options... Take a walk around your local airport and see what people are using.
 
Half Fast said:
That looks like a solution worthy of @Ted ! :)
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With the MU2 I used my 1-ton Ram (the same one I drove to your house to pick up the RX7) to put the plane in and out. Probably didn’t help my clutch life…
 
Maybe get a golf cart with a tow bar. Bonus, you get to drive around your airport in style.

In a year I also hope to be in a hangar, and I might go the "old riding mower" option. Relatively inexpensive, more than enough power to pull and push the 182, and since it will be gas powered don't have to futz with charging batteries.

But - I don't have a tug, I don't have a plane in a hangar. I'm also trying to get smarter about this by listening to others.
 
Nice - where did you get the tow bar, and how did you attach it to the tractor?
 
WDD said:
Nice - where did you get the tow bar, and how did you attach it to the tractor?
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I welded the tow bar....but they can be purchased. The receiver was welded to the weight rack on the tractor.
 

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Ted said:
With the MU2 I used my 1-ton Ram (the same one I drove to your house to pick up the RX7) to put the plane in and out. Probably didn’t help my clutch life…
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I tried to back the 310 into the hangar with my Yukon and a tow bar once. The ramp was too icy for my robot tug and it was a dark night. It was not easy, even with someone else outside guiding me. It turns out that I can back a single trailer just fine, but I need lessons and/or practice with whatever combination a towbar on a nosewheel turns out to be equivalent to. Since then, I nose the plane into the hangar so I can much more easily pull it (using an ATV most of the time) until the nosewheel is on dry concrete, then bring in the tug to finish the job.
 
I think you can go one of 2 routes, or both. One is a larger solution for your hangar (like Best), the other is a smaller one that you can take along if the need arises (like Minimax).
 
rwellner98 said:
But I like that my Best Tug "just works" and doesn't feel like it was cobbled together from whatever someone had laying around in their hangar.
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Ouch! I "cobbled together" my electric tug from stuff in the garage, the hangar and parts from an electric scooter company. It's not the kind of tug you'd use with a tri-gear twin, but it is perfect for my taildragger. I saved thousands of dollars, I got some personal satisfaction from designing and building it and my back thanks me every time I pull my plane back into the hangar. Don't knock self sufficiency. I couldn't afford to fly without a lot of DIY efforts. For a big twin, the lawnmower route looks pretty good to me. That said, I do know folks with more wherewithal than me that are happy with their Best Tugs.
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Flyhound said:
Ouch! I "cobbled together" my electric tug from stuff in the garage, the hangar and parts from an electric scooter company.
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Looks good on you though...

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aftCG said:
All the cool kids have AC Air. Buy once, cry once. As the owner of the company told me at a trade show "it's cheaper than hitting the hangar wall even one time".
He wasn't wrong. being able to stand by a wing tip or the back of the hangar is priceless..

As a bonus: it packs enough grunt to get all the way to the fuel island and back, saving multiple cold starts
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i have one for the T-6, wouldnt go any other way when i have to put a 42' wingspan taildragger in a 45' hangar.
 
unsafervguy said:
i have one for the T-6, wouldnt go any other way when i have to put a 42' wingspan taildragger in a 45' hangar.
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Thread drift alert…

Which model do you use for the T-6?
 
I've used the AC Air tugs and the Sidewinders quite a bit. I like them both.

The Sidewinders are super easy to use. Virtually no learning curve, it's just like pushing it by hand, only powered.

The ACAir tugs are a little trickier to learn, but not bad. The ones with the lazy susan offer a great amount of flexibility in moving the plane without worrying at all about nosewheel limits, they are super flexible in that regard. But man are they LOUD! Forget about talking with someone while you're using it (or hearing their warnings). That's my main complaint about them, otherwise they're great for all the reasons others have stated above.
 
my main complaint with the ac air tug is that our fuel island is a little over 1/3 a mile away or so. So its close to a mile there and back. The AC air tug is usually rated for a mile, but that means it must be fully charged before I go to the fuel island and back, or it just wont make it. So in this particular circumstance, I will go with a gas powered riding tug. But I do like the best tugs, and I do like the ac air tugs for around the hangar in/out type of thing.

And forget the sidewinder trying to go 1/3 of a mile to a self service fuel dock. . that would be a back breaker. .. and doubtful the battery has a chance to make it there, forget coming back.
 
Anthem said:
my main complaint with the ac air tug is that our fuel island is a little over 1/3 a mile away or so. So its close to a mile there and back. The AC air tug is usually rated for a mile, but that means it must be fully charged before I go to the fuel island and back, or it just wont make it. So in this particular circumstance, I will go with a gas powered riding tug. But I do like the best tugs, and I do like the ac air tugs for around the hangar in/out type of thing.

And forget the sidewinder trying to go 1/3 of a mile to a self service fuel dock. . that would be a back breaker. .. and doubtful the battery has a chance to make it there, forget coming back.
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Oh, certainly the Sidewinder isn't going to make it that far. Towing a Baron, I estimate it gets about 4 tows in or out of the hangar per battery charge. It's really stressing that drill battery. And the AC Air likely isn't going to go that distance either, at least reliably.

But come on, to be fair that's not the expected use case for either of them. They're expected to be used to move the plane in and out of the hangar, not tow it down the taxiway to get fuel. That's a function of either a dedicated tow vehicle (golf cart etc.) or just taxi the plane there.
 
RussR said:
Oh, certainly the Sidewinder isn't going to make it that far. Towing a Baron, I estimate it gets about 4 tows in or out of the hangar per battery charge. It's really stressing that drill battery. And the AC Air likely isn't going to go that distance either, at least reliably.

But come on, to be fair that's not the expected use case for either of them. They're expected to be used to move the plane in and out of the hangar, not tow it down the taxiway to get fuel. That's a function of either a dedicated tow vehicle (golf cart etc.) or just taxi the plane there.
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And if you had a hangar - would you get a dedicated tow vehicle AND something else ? Like I said - I like the dedicated in/out options (though not the sidewinder), but if you have the need to tow your aircraft to fuel or something, be aware of its shortcomings. And taxi the plane there would be a bad option for say turboprops, as cycles count. And a many cycles for a 10 minute taxi would be a bad idea come Hot or overhaul time. And while this doesnt apply as much for pistons, its probably a bad idea to fire up piston engine(s) to taxi to fuel as well.
 
I made my own as well. Used the rear end of a riding mower. It has fwd and rev modes. Use a washing machine motor and a simple cable clutch with a idle pully on it. Cut off the front end where the seat is and just put a swivel wheel there and a handle. Total cost was about $300, took an afternoon to build and it's easy to work with. For a bigger twin, might need to add some lead ballast, but if it's flat ground should work as is.
 
Anthem said:
And if you had a hangar - would you get a dedicated tow vehicle AND something else ? Like I said - I like the dedicated in/out options (though not the sidewinder), but if you have the need to tow your aircraft to fuel or something, be aware of its shortcomings. And taxi the plane there would be a bad option for say turboprops, as cycles count. And a many cycles for a 10 minute taxi would be a bad idea come Hot or overhaul time. And while this doesnt apply as much for pistons, its probably a bad idea to fire up piston engine(s) to taxi to fuel as well.
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My point I thought was pretty simple - if you need to tow the plane to the fuel pump, you get an actual tow vehicle - a golf cart or a tractor or an old riding lawnmower or basically any other kind of tug that you ride on. You don't get a Sidewinder or an AC Air unit or anything else that is essentially just a powered tow bar - if you do, don't complain that it isn't appropriate for your intended use. That's like buying a 152 and then being disappointed that it's not very good for crossing the Atlantic.

An actual tug, of course, can pull the plane out of and back into the hangar as well. So if you need a long-distance tug, and only want to buy one item, you get that. But, sure, I know people that have a tug for when they need to do long-distance stuff and a sidewinder or similar for just pull-in and pull-out.

I'm not sure what you're talking about regarding taxiing to/from the fuel pumps. That's pretty standard practice and is what most people do, piston owners at least. You go flying, land and taxi to the pumps, fuel up, then restart and taxi to the hangar. Or if you need gas before the flight, you taxi to the pumps then leave from there. That's pretty normal. Doing otherwise significantly lengthens your preflight time as you tug the airplane to the fuel pump, then tug the plane back, then load up and depart - does anybody do that?

Turbine aircraft in my experience are more likely to be pulled out or fueled by the FBO, although sure, if your FBO doesn't provide that service, then I'd be looking into an actual tug.
 
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RussR said:
Or if you need gas before the flight, you taxi to the pumps then leave from there. That's pretty normal. Doing otherwise significantly lengthens your preflight time as you tug the airplane to the fuel pump, then tug the plane back, then load up and depart - does anybody do that?

Turbine aircraft in my experience are more likely to be pulled out or fueled by the FBO, although sure, if your FBO doesn't provide that service, then I'd be looking into an actual tug.
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If the option to fill is there via trucks - absolutely. But turbine aircraft generally dont taxi to the fuel pumps and then taxi back. The cycle count is quite costly. Thats why you tug there and tug back, or you can depart from there, but you have to get your tug back. yes, I'm at an airport that jet-a is only available at the pump and not via trucks. Would it be better if they had jet-a trucks - absolutely. But guess what ? they dont.

I have an actual tug. And i concur with you - that if you need to go further distances - get a real tug and not a towbarles substitute. Just saying there are use cases for the real tugs, whereby by even the best tugs electric units will and do struggle. . . but thats not knocking all electric tugs, as the lektro and jetporter are both electric, and they lasts for miles/hours at a time - but again - much more industrial.
 
Thought a takeoff was required to count as a cycle for a turbine?
 
Rather than start a new thread, I figured I'd tag on to this one. I'm in the market for a tug as well, but for a 1964 210D. Looking hard at the Sidewinder based on recommendations in this thread. I am also looking at the Minimax tug. Does anyone have a pirep on the Minimax?
 
Barrett50 said:
I made my own as well. Used the rear end of a riding mower. It has fwd and rev modes. Use a washing machine motor and a simple cable clutch with an idle pully on it. Cut off the front end where the seat is and just put a swivel wheel there and a handle. Total cost was about $300, took an afternoon to build and it's easy to work with. For a bigger twin, might need to add some lead ballast, but if it's flat ground should work as is.
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Nice! Would really like to see some pictures of that.
 
RussR said:
The ACAir tugs are a little trickier to learn, but not bad. The ones with the lazy susan offer a great amount of flexibility in moving the plane without worrying at all about nosewheel limits, they are super flexible in that regard. But man are they LOUD! Forget about talking with someone while you're using it (or hearing their warnings).
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We have the lazy susan on our Best Tug. Best thing ever when you have a Mooney! I can now turn the plane in place when it's on the tug with no worries about the very tight nosewheel limits (9 degrees on one side of center, 12 degrees on the other side!)

Also the Best Tugs are very quiet. If you want a remote-controlled tug and still want to be able to hear warnings, their Romeo series might be just the ticket.
 
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