You tell them there’s a similar callsign on the frequency...

Maybe if the controller didn’t mumble the takeoff clearance and annunciated, there wouldn’t have been the confusion.
 
I listened to it a couple times and I couldn't hear the who was being cleared.

One on side I would have thought with two similar sounding callsigns on frequency that the controller would be very specific as to making sure the callsign was clearly stated.

Then again, I don't see how neither aircraft didn't ask who the T.O. clearance was for.
 
I don't see where the controller was not clearly issuing a take off clearance to SW. Controller did tell SW not to expect to stop when he told SW to line up and wait. Perhaps he should have told Delta to continue holding, SW will be departing 31C. I know I used to issue that when I had two planes on intersecting runways like this.

The two obviously stepped on each other reading back the clearance. The controller perhaps should have stated the clearance was for SW and Delta to continue holding.. Thankfully the controller was watching his traffic and prevented a possible meeting of aluminum.
 
Listen again without looking at the text at the 1:07 mark. I can't make out any callsign.

And being told to expect something is not the same as being told to do something. ;)
 
I agree just listening to the calls signs it is not obvious which plane was cleared for takeoff, but twice the controller said "cleared for takeoff 31C," so shouldn't that have been the DL's clue the clearance was not for them?
 
Curious - when a controller knows there is this potential, and “thirteen” cans be confused with “thirty,” why wouldn’t he say the call sign as “one three two eight” instead of “thirteen twenty eight?”

I always call my tail number as “one two three alpha bravo,” for example, not “one twenty-three.”
 
Van Johnston said:
I agree just listening to the calls signs it is not obvious which plane was cleared for takeoff, but twice the controller said "cleared for takeoff 31C," so shouldn't that have been the DL's clue the clearance was not for them?
Click to expand...
I agree with that. But I think this is a good example of confirmation bias. They were cleared on to the runway so they expected a clearance for takeoff. When they heard the words "cleared for takeoff", the rest of the transmission became white noise to them.
 
"Expectation bias"...when you taxi onto a runway, you expect to be cleared for takeoff. The controller was expecting the pilots to listen carefully after noting similar callsigns. Everybody was trying to get the maximum done in minimum time.

You spend enough time in the cockpit, and eventually you screw up...you just hope it doesn't make YouTube. ;)
 
Keep in mind that these recordings were likely archived from LiveATC, so certain parts of the feed might've not been picked up as clearly as they were actually heard in person, depending on the position of the receiver. What seems to be a mumbled and static-y transmission, might've actually been clear to those listening in the cockpit. Obviously there was some confusion here, so that isn't an excuse to ask for clarification.
 
All factors considered that was DL's eff up.

Similar call signs aside, they were on 4R and the aircraft cleared for takeoff was 31C among other things.

Situations like these are why I'm not a super huge fan of my company check list. There is too much talking and not enough listening after we go "below the line" - "below the line" is the call to finish the Before Take Off checklist. the problem being our op spec has us saying "runway heading verify checked" which is a good thing but they don't want you to say it until within 30 degrees of runway heading. Most of the time that interferes with ATC giving you a takeoff clearance. So you either need to try and squeeze it in really fast before you anticipate the ATC call or spout it off really quick as the PF firewalls the throttles...

A lot depends on the Capn and whether they dick around taxiing on to the runway, etc, etc. Some people amaze me with how bad their SA is. I'll regularly have PFs calling for stuff while I"m replying to ATC calls. Its really kind of scary the kind of stuff I see out there sometimes.
 
Stepped on transmissions. Shades of the Canary Islands. Beginning AND ending the call sign with the Company name may have helped.

NOTE−
If aircraft identification becomes a problem when the
procedures specified above are used, the call sign must be
restated after the flight number of the aircraft involved.
EXAMPLE−
“American Five Twenty−One American.”
“Commuter Six Eleven Commuter.”
“General Motors Thirty−Seven General Motors.”
 
donjohnston said:
Listen again without looking at the text at the 1:07 mark. I can't make out any callsign.
Click to expand...
Likely due to the LiveATC feed. It should have been clear to the aircraft.

Half Fast said:
I always call my tail number as “one two three alpha bravo,” for example, not “one twenty-three.”
Click to expand...
AIM 4-2-4 a. 5. Air carriers and commuter air carriers having FAA authorized call signs should identify themselves by stating the complete call sign (using group form for the numbers) and the word "super" or "heavy" if appropriate. EXAMPLE-- 1. United twenty-Five Heavy. 2. Midwest Commuter Seven Eleven.

donjohnston said:
But I think this is a good example of confirmation bias.
Click to expand...
Exactly. Confirmation/Expectation bias. Also, there are a lot of things going on in a takeoff clearance. Callsign, departure instructions, runway, (often) winds, and the cockpit procedures of lights, clocks, fuel, heading bug set/LNAV confirmation, and control transfer (of F/Os leg). It's easy to miss an item.
 
Both crews were warned of a similar callsign and acknowledged.
The two crews were on different runways and one of them f***ed up big time by reading back the takeoff clearance (twice) that was not meant for them and especially for their rwy.
The controller sure had a chance to prevent this problem by enunciating the callsign clearer.
All-in-all, the possibly disastrous outcome was averted.
 
Controller also could have had the Delta crew hold on the taxiway until giving takeoff clearance to SWA. Would likely have prevented the confusion. Probably lots of lessons learned by all parties here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Pros, semi-pros, amatuers, we all eff up - six CAP airplanes in or approching the pattern at HGR a few years ago, all with call signs "CAP 18xx"; tower controller bolloxed them up, and continue to confuse 'em, for an extended time. I was number seven heading in, and so just used my N number, to avoid the cluster pluck. The guy was just having a bad day, and it snowballed on him. We gotta look out for the other guy sometimes.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top