Which plane meets these criteria?

A

Artimas

Pre-takeoff checklist
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Artimas
single engine turbo (or ability to easily fly in the teens)
180 kts or more
reliable air conditioning
good autopilot
2 adults plus bags
$250,000

Cirrus, Columbia. Any others? I think reliable air conditioning is the tough thing here. I've heard that most aftermarket ACs are pretty unreliable (no personal experience).
 
Bonanza, C210, P210, Mooney Ovation
 
P210 would be my choice.
 
210 is around 170KTS about 10 KTS short of the criteria.
 
$250K might be a bit limiting for a turbo SR22 with AC but its in the ballpark. Easily meets/beats all of your other specs though. My AC blows ice cold.
 
chevy72402 said:
210 is around 170KTS about 10 KTS short of the criteria.
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Centurions are Cool. Revise the damn criteria. LOL. Anybody know how the planes so far stack up against each other maintenance, parts availability and insurance premium wise. If his 250k is pretty much the bottom of the piggy bank then that's a consideration.
 
If you're really feeling adventurous try the Lancair IV-P. ;)
 
luvflyin said:
Centurions are Cool. Revise the damn criteria. LOL. Anybody know how the planes so far stack up against each other maintenance, parts availability and insurance premium wise. If his 250k is pretty much the bottom of the piggy bank then that's a consideration.
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I know lots of folks fly them commercially out of dirt strip, full gross, high DA, all day, everyday in Africa without too much trouble, though most are 550ed with no turbo.

Lots of busy body government agencies also use them.
 
Mooney ovation is right at that 250k range. Mooney bravo is a good option too but one with factory a/c are hard to come by. SR-22 g2's might be snaggable at 250k, same with decent Columbia 400sl. A late 80s a36tc can be had, two people luggage and bikes!
I personally would go with the turbo bonanza because I like to bike!
 
James331 said:
I know lots of folks fly them commercially out of dirt strip, full gross, high DA, all day, everyday in Africa without too much trouble, though most are 550ed with no turbo.

Lots of busy body government agencies also use them.
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Yeah. Busy bodiness and high cantilever wings go hand in hand
 
Why the A/C requirement? If you're going up into the teens, you shouldn't have a need for A/C up there. I've flown my non A/C plane in the humid Great Lakes when it's been over 90 degrees many times and A/C hasn't ever crossed my mind as being a requirement. Keep the door open until hold short line, close lock, depart. The conditions in NJ aren't that much different than here.
 
A/C is a waste of weight and money if you're flying a turbo in the teens. Get TKS instead.
 
colojo said:
A/C is a waste of weight and money if you're flying a turbo in the teens. Get TKS instead.
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Not if it's a pressurized plane. The 414 this summer was miserable, even in the mid teens (has AC but currently inop). Plus, you won't always want to fly in the teens due to winds.

Know thy plane. The Aztec didn't need AC. The 310 would've benefitted from it as I often had to go to 11k in the summer to keep the cabin comfortable. The 414 needs it.

Personally, I would look for an older Malibu in that criteria. Otherwise, turbo Bonanza is probably your best bet. I'd ask why you actually need a turbo, though. I spent somewhere over 2,000 hours flying without them. Granted, I do like having them now, but they add cost, weight, etc...
 
I agree on the a/c issue. Unless you're somewhere that has you constantly in a long ground delay I really don't see a need for it. Within 15 minutes of getting into the hot plane you should be up at a nice cool altitude. Just gut it out and save the extra weight, cost and hassle.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Not if it's a pressurized plane. The 414 this summer was miserable, even in the mid teens (has AC but currently inop). Plus, you won't always want to fly in the teens due to winds.

Know thy plane. The Aztec didn't need AC. The 310 would've benefitted from it as I often had to go to 11k in the summer to keep the cabin comfortable. The 414 needs it.

Personally, I would look for an older Malibu in that criteria. Otherwise, turbo Bonanza is probably your best bet. I'd ask why you actually need a turbo, though. I spent somewhere over 2,000 hours flying without them. Granted, I do like having them now, but they add cost, weight, etc...
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Ted,
If your plane is pressurized and w/o a/c then yeah - your running around in a little pressure cooker. You need to learn how to "dump" your cabin so you can rapidly get the cooler outside air inside. We used to have to do it all the time on the older 737s.
Art
 
EdFred said:
Why the A/C requirement? If you're going up into the teens, you shouldn't have a need for A/C up there. I've flown my non A/C plane in the humid Great Lakes when it's been over 90 degrees many times and A/C hasn't ever crossed my mind as being a requirement. Keep the door open until hold short line, close lock, depart. The conditions in NJ aren't that much different than here.
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Why have AC in your car? Just drive with the windows down.

Perhaps he gets hot or sweats easily, perhaps he just likes being comfortable or perhaps his wife won't fly without AC. I use my plane for business travel and am often in a full suit and tie flying to/from a meeting. I prefer AC because it keeps me cool and dry even when I'm leaving out of KTEB with a 30 minute wait in the conga line on the taxiway on a 95 degree day.
 
RudyP said:
Why have AC in your car? Just drive with the windows down.

Perhaps he gets hot or sweats easily, perhaps he just likes being comfortable or perhaps his wife won't fly without AC. I use my plane for business travel and am often in a full suit and tie flying to/from a meeting. I prefer AC because it keeps me cool and dry even when I'm leaving out of KTEB with a 30 minute wait in the conga line on the taxiway on a 95 degree day.
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Well, if you really wanted to keep that suit jacket looking good - never sit down while wearing it. I can't begin to imagine flying like that. My work blazer ( the ole horse blanket) comes off and goes on a hangar as soon as I step in the cockpit, the tie shortly thereafter. Now that I think about it I don't even drive the car like that - it just takes too long for the a/c to cool off, I'd be sweat soaked clear thru.

No, if I were a high roller driving around in my airplane making those billion dollar deals left and right I'd fly in a t-shirt with the suit pants on and the nice shirt and jacket hanging up in the back. But hey that's just me.
 
RudyP said:
Why have AC in your car? Just drive with the windows down.

Perhaps he gets hot or sweats easily, perhaps he just likes being comfortable or perhaps his wife won't fly without AC. I use my plane for business travel and am often in a full suit and tie flying to/from a meeting. I prefer AC because it keeps me cool and dry even when I'm leaving out of KTEB with a 30 minute wait in the conga line on the taxiway on a 95 degree day.
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Thank god I'm not in HR, if it's hot outside and some mental midget shows up to the office wearing a full suit, I'd be questioning his mental firepower.

Used to see this a lot on SoCal, it never inspired confidence lol
 
In some businesses it's still a fact of life. But hey thanks for the gratuitous insult.
 
RudyP said:
In some businesses it's still a fact of life. But hey thanks for the gratuitous insult.
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Not an insult to you, it's a insult to poorly thought out business culture.

Wearing a full suit and tie when it's 90 outside doesn't really scream intelligence, adaptability, or really even fashion sense, the running to escape the heat like a sweaty vampire, not a good look, the BO doused in men's perfume, and the sweat streaks.... not in vogue.
 
Thanks for the replies.
Just for reference, I am currently flying a normally aspirated 210. It will get to 165 kts at best, but is happiest at around 160. If I get a new plane, I'd like it to be significantly faster. I want A/C for local flights around Florida in the summer.

A friend has a Malibu. He says it's a maintenance hog, plus it won't fit in my hangar.

Doesn't need to be a turbo, it just seems like that might help the criteria more easily.


I'm leaning towards a Cirrus or Columbia, but asked because I was wondering what planes I might be missing. Mooneys are kind of tight inside...maybe a Bonanza.

Thanks again all!
 
RudyP said:
Why have AC in your car? Just drive with the windows down.

Perhaps he gets hot or sweats easily, perhaps he just likes being comfortable or perhaps his wife won't fly without AC. I use my plane for business travel and am often in a full suit and tie flying to/from a meeting. I prefer AC because it keeps me cool and dry even when I'm leaving out of KTEB with a 30 minute wait in the conga line on the taxiway on a 95 degree day.
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A lot of times I do, along with having the top off. Then again, I'm not aa pretentious cirrus driver that needs to show off. :D
 
I guess my experience is the opposite. I had a Columbia for several years and was the most expensive plane to own I have ever had. My Malibu is exact opposite. It has been extremely cheap to own in the several years I have owned it. The Columbia had several flaws for me. 1. It wasn't pressurized. 2. The useful load with full fuel was about 280 lbs. 3. Wasn't fiki. 4. Couldn't land on grass strips which I like to do. The Columbia wasn't airworthy without its wheel pants. 5. Was hard for people to get in and out of. Older people especially. 6. Even with air conditioning it was hot inside on hot days and you couldn't taxi with doors open. 7. It was noisy compared to pressurized planes. 8. My annual cost to own including yearly maintenance averaged over 12000.00$. My Malibu either doesn't have any of these problems or not to the extent if at all. My average cost to own per year with annual and maintenance has been about 5000$ I flew both planes about same number of hours per year.
 
If you can get past the A/C, a lance or glasair with a big engine would easily do it.
 
Artimas said:
single engine turbo (or ability to easily fly in the teens)
180 kts or more
reliable air conditioning
good autopilot
2 adults plus bags
$250,000
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Maybe I missed it but I'm surprised nobody suggested a Mooney 252. They exceed all the listed performance criteria, and are much less than $250,000. You can find a good one for around $160,000 and spend the leftover money on new A/C and a TKS anti-ice system (though a 252 is likely to already have at least one of those). Heck, if it doesn't have Speed Brakes (and again, many already do) you could afford to get those installed too, and still be below $250,000.

And the Mooney 252 offers something no other does: 201 kts cruise using only about 13 gph.

There's a Mooney 252 on Controller right now with a 0 time engine for $159,000.
 
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