where to go for Type Rating ?

I haven't flown a fake airplane hooked to computer so I'm a fraud.
 
RotorAndWing said:
James,

I was flying professionally before you were born. And guess what? This was going on then and it will continue after both of us are gone.

If you like your job, so be it. What this guy does with his career is his life and his business. Your argument that he is somehow hurting the profession is pure bovine scatology.

Get over it.
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Point taken.
 
RotorAndWing said:
James,

I was flying professionally before you were born. And guess what? This was going on then and it will continue after both of us are gone.

If you like your job, so be it. What this guy does with his career is his life and his business. Your argument that he is somehow hurting the profession is pure bovine scatology.

Get over it.
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I don't think many people have issues with contract pilots, it's not a big deal. If people want to make a career out of being jonny on the spot when somebody needs them, great.

I think the issue is someone being SIC on a 50 million dollar jet with an operation that is too cheap to send them to the schoolhouse for real SIC training, versus doing the required bounces and no more for a 61.55 sign off.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
I don't think many people have issues with contract pilots, it's not a big deal. If people want to make a career out of being jonny on the spot when somebody needs them, great.

I think the issue is someone being SIC on a 50 million dollar jet with an operation that is too cheap to send them to the schoolhouse for real SIC training, versus doing the required bounces and no more for a 61.55 sign off.
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Indeed.... NJP, is that the deal here?
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
I don't think many people have issues with contract pilots, it's not a big deal. If people want to make a career out of being jonny on the spot when somebody needs them, great.

I think the issue is someone being SIC on a 50 million dollar jet with an operation that is too cheap to send them to the schoolhouse for real SIC training, versus doing the required bounces and no more for a 61.55 sign off.
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what exactly is that vs what the standard SIC training is? I apologize for my lack of knowledge.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
I don't think many people have issues with contract pilots, it's not a big deal. If people want to make a career out of being jonny on the spot when somebody needs them, great.

I think the issue is someone being SIC on a 50 million dollar jet with an operation that is too cheap to send them to the schoolhouse for real SIC training, versus doing the required bounces and no more for a 61.55 sign off.
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Again, who put you in charge?

Guys, excoriating someone for what they have chosen as a career or job is bovine scatology at its finest. Do you think the guy that stroked the check for the Falcon actually cares what you or others think about the way he runs his operation? Are you assuming he might read this and cry out " Oh Lord! What am I doing! Get that young lad to FlightSafety this minute!"

If the OP is happy, the owner is happy and the PIC is happy, so be it. its not affecting your little part of the world.

Let it go and be the best you can be.
 
NJP_MAN said:
Some owners have found that you can contract co pilots. Once they learn that then they don't go back. Its the difference of 50k yr and 150 a year.
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Nothing against you, but if I was able to afford to operate a jet, I'd want both of my pilots to have the same level of training. Otherwise, you might as well just get a single pilot certified jet.

I don't think you are doing anything wrong. It's just that there can be a huge difference in the outcome when the crap hits the fan if you have a flight crew where both pilots have been through the ringer in the sim vs one fully trained captain and another pilot who has the bare minimum to be legal.
 
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NJP_MAN said:
I've seen owners of jets collect coupons from all the FBOs Sunday papers. I seen owners drive rental cars because they don't want to pay for a car where there house is. I've seen owners refuse to replace the carafe lid for coffee on their plane that costs $200. I've seen run only contract pilots for both seats because they don't want to pay the normal costs of having employees. I've seen lots of strange stuff and they own multi million dollar jets. Some of the owners get rich because they are smart with money even down to the penny.
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I know. I have seen those types too. Just saying that when you consider the overall cost of operating a jet, paying for things like training for the co-pilot is really small stuff and a worthy investment, I think.

If those things are really going to break the bank, maybe, just maybe you'd be better off chartering a jet vs owning the jet.
 
NJP_MAN said:
If having contract pilots works for them then thats all they care about. There is an immense opportunity for pilots like myself and it should be taken advantage of. It pays many people's bills and I can live with that.
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Like I said earlier, I really have no problem with you or anyone else doing contract flying. I'm just a little surprised at where some operators will look to cut costs.
 
Thread reopened after some cleanup. Please keep it civil in here and on topic. Personal attacks are a violation of the RoC. If you see a post that violates the RoC feel free to report it. If it doesn't violate the RoC ignore it or respond in a civil manner.
 
Fearless Tower said:
It has, but it has lead to an interesting discussion. I must admit to being oblivious to this aspect of the industry. Learn something new every day.
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Another dirty secret of the industry is how the training budget is spent. This example is not the norm but still goes on. Generally the management company for the aircraft charges the owner for crew salaries and annual sim school. Then some operators have been known to skim on training (elect to not send both of their pilots to sim school) and only send one while the SIC gets a sign off IAW 61.55. Which is perfectly legal on 91 operations, saves the management company the sim expense and then often pays the SIC far less than industry standard.

Nothing against contract pilots, I've been one. It is a great segment of the industry if done properly and not abused.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
How much is a Cessna 500 series type rating ?
 
NJP_MAN said:
Who wants one of those ?
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People who figure if they are going pay for a Type themselves, they might as well get something that maximizes their marketing for future employment.

The CE-500 type is one of the most common.

From the link above:
Under one single CE-500 type rating, a crew member may pilot of any of the following Cessna jet aircraft:
Citation I CE-500
Citation I SP CE-501
Citation II CE-550
Citation II SP CE-551
Citation SII CE-S500
Citation Bravo CE-550B
Citation V CE-560
Citation Ultra CE-560U
Citation Encore CE-560E
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Bottom line, if you are going to pay for a Type yourself you have two options: either do it in something unique that you might never get to fly again, OR do it in something that gives you the most bang for your buck, ie something that has the highest demand/flexibility for future employment.
 
NJP_MAN said:
Who wants one of those ?
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You can't fault people here for thinking that you are trolling them.

I thought the original premise was that you wanted to do the rating just to preserve your written and to put it in the book. Spending 22k on the piece of paper seems a more efficient way to spend money than 70k. Also, lots of Citations around, there may even be an opportunity to get some contract flying out of it.
 
Fearless Tower said:
People who figure if they are going pay for a Type themselves, they might as well get something that maximizes their marketing for future employment.

The CE-500 type is one of the most common.

From the link above:


Bottom line, if you are going to pay for a Type yourself you have two options: either do it in something unique that you might never get to fly again, OR do it in something that gives you the most bang for your buck, ie something that has the highest demand/flexibility for future employment.
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I don't know how up to date this list is but it gives you an idea of cost.

Interesting that someone can buy a type in a transport jet cheaper than a business jet, but it does have a lot to do with supply and demand.

And for the first time jet type remember that it comes with an SOE restriction that takes 25 hours of flying the airplane to remove.
 
Fearless Tower said:
OR do it in something that gives you the most bang for your buck, ie something that has the highest demand/flexibility for future employment.
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If I'm going to work for someone they will pay for my training. Thats why I wanted to do the 737. Just to preserve my written while gaining knowledge of an airplane that I won't probably ever fly again. I fly because I enjoy it. Not because I want to work.
 
RotorAndWing said:
And for the first time jet type remember that it comes with an SOE restriction that takes 25 hours of flying the airplane to remove.
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Maybe I missed it earlier, but if he does his ATP initial in a jet, his whole ATP certificate is considered restricted until he gets the SOE limitation removed?
 
weilke said:
lots of Citations around, there may even be an opportunity to get some contract flying out of it.
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I don't want to contract in citations. I kinda want to instruct at a place like flight safety one day. Maybe even instruct in the 737.
 
NJP_MAN said:
If I'm going to work for someone they will pay for my training. Thats why I wanted to do the 737. Just to preserve my written while gaining knowledge of an airplane that I won't probably ever fly again. I fly because I enjoy it. Not because I want to work.
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Which would fall into the first option that I stated. Which is fine, if you have the money and that is what you want to do. I've considered it myself....when the time comes (a year or two) I'd love to do my ATP initial in the DC-3 (already have the SIC and a little under 10 hrs). We'll have to see how badly the Beech 18 drains my financial resources....
 
Fearless Tower said:
Which would fall into the first option that I stated. Which is fine, if you have the money and that is what you want to do. I've considered it myself....when the time comes (a year or two) I'd love to do my ATP initial in the DC-3 (already have the SIC and a little under 10 hrs). We'll have to see how badly the Beech 18 drains my financial resources....
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You and a couple of other chaps are in the small group who have added value to this thread. Thanks for your imput and staying somewhere in the realm of the original topic.
 
NJP_MAN said:
I don't want to contract in citations. I kinda want to instruct at a place like flight safety one day. Maybe even instruct in the 737.
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Maybe not to contract, but if you were ever looking to get out of contracting and get a full time job, it could be advantageous. That is why people pay for CE-500 types.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Maybe not to contract, but if you were ever looking to get out of contracting and get a full time job, it could be advantageous. That is why people pay for CE-500 types.
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I hate to say it but I think if I want out of the contracting business I would go to the airlines. If I have to work a "real job" I might as well go to where the future looks really bright. I don't like the thought of the airlines because of the regionals however. I don't really want to be dragging an RJ around at .78 to get to Moline or Dayton for an exotic overnight in the holiday inn. Thats not my cup of tea.
 
This thread is very confusing.

I wish you luck, whichever direction your aviation career takes you.
 
NJP_MAN said:
I hate to say it but I think if I want out of the contracting business I would go to the airlines. If I have to work a "real job" I might as well go to where the future looks really bright. I don't like the thought of the airlines because of the regionals however. I don't really want to be dragging an RJ around at .78 to get to Moline or Dayton for an exotic overnight in the holiday inn. Thats not my cup of tea.
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I think this is something you need to get firmly established in your mind before you do a 737 type...what you plan to do with your flying career, and whether or not you plan to go to the airlines.

If your plans are in the corporate world, a 737 type rating will probably close more doors than it opens. The impression many chief pilots will get is that you plan to jump ship when the first major airline calls.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Maybe I missed it earlier, but if he does his ATP initial in a jet, his whole ATP certificate is considered restricted until he gets the SOE limitation removed?
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No...the only restriction on the ATP would ve "circling in VMC only" if they don't circle to land for the checkride, which isn't a big deal.
 
NJP_MAN said:
I hate to say it but I think if I want out of the contracting business I would go to the airlines. If I have to work a "real job" I might as well go to where the future looks really bright. I don't like the thought of the airlines because of the regionals however. I don't really want to be dragging an RJ around at .78 to get to Moline or Dayton for an exotic overnight in the holiday inn. Thats not my cup of tea.
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So basically, you don't want to put your time in like the rest of us. Gee wouldn't that be nice, just to skip to the big leagues.

Maybe you should throw applications at the majors, I'm sure they'll be eager to hire a non-type rated 7X FO over the thousands of applicants they have with 121 time and multiple type ratings
 
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