What's your IFR flight workflow?

[fiveoboy01]

What do you guys do/how do you prepare for an IFR flight?

My question mainly centers around weather and what resources you use and in what order to determine things like destination and alternate, go/no go decisions, delaying departure, etc.. Prior to flight and even enroute...

However I'd like to hear about other things you do, such as regarding the airplane itself, your physical and mental state, passenger stuff, anything.

I'm a 200 hour VFR pilot about to take the instrument checkride and while VFR flight planning is ridiculously easy to me, this IFR stuff is a whole different world.

I'm curious to know how the experienced guys who fly IFR often handle their flights from beginning to end.

 

[gismo]

What do you guys do/how do you prepare for an IFR flight?

My question mainly centers around weather and what resources you use and in what order to determine things like destination and alternate, go/no go decisions, delaying departure, etc.. Prior to flight and even enroute...

However I'd like to hear about other things you do, such as regarding the airplane itself, your physical and mental state, passenger stuff, anything.

I'm a 200 hour VFR pilot about to take the instrument checkride and while VFR flight planning is ridiculously easy to me, this IFR stuff is a whole different world.

I'm curious to know how the experienced guys who fly IFR often handle their flights from beginning to end.

These days I do most of my flight planning (wx, route, destination info, alternates, etc) within Foreflight with some additional data from aviationweather.gov and a few other sources (e.g rucsoundings.noaa.gov, www.nws.noaa.gov/mdl/synop/products.php)

But I must emphasize that the best weather tools from a safety of flight perspective are those you can access in flight. Every pre-flight wx source is just a (sometimes well educated) guess. What actually occurs in flight is what's really important and the more the better.

 

[frfly172]

Log into foreflight,pick destination,file direct through foreflight,fly the airplane.

 

[James331]

I'll look at the metars and TAFs in foreflight, look at the radar. sigmets and pireps, for the most part I always file a alternate. Sometimes I'll go on wunderground.com and look at webcams to check if the field has been plowed in the winter time, I'll also check for fuel, deicng and whatnot on fltplan.com if needed.

Fltplan.com is by far the best for filing and figuring fuel burn and ideal altitudes.


As far as no go, outside from normal VFR type stuff, if the field isn't plowed, clear ice, line of thunderstorms, or a huge cell parked somewhere I need to go, also if one airport is saying alls good, but all the nearby airports are reporting LIFR, that's changes things a little.

 

[Clark1961]

Weather: start with a DUATS brief to check off that box. I'll call FSS if something looks wonky in the TAFs or area forecast. Foreflight has some nice tools to look at things like ceilings and temp/dew point spread along the route. Airnav is a reasonably quick way to see what approaches are available at the destination and potential alternates. Looking at approaches also gives info for filing to an IAF rather than direct to the airport. Foreflight also works for that task. RUCsoundings was mentioned by other posters and is handy. It does take some study to learn to use. I'll also call someone at the destination if I think observer info will help.

Airplane: Other than fuel and mechanical condition, I want to know if the GPS database is up to date. With enough prep time I'll print plates which I can do from Airnav.

Enroute: monitor conditions using eyes and ears. Sometimes you can pick up a lot from what other pilots are reporting to ATC. Sometimes I'll ask ATC what they are seeing or what they see other pilots doing. ADS-B weather is handy too. Every great once in awhile I'll talk to FSS while enroute. Sometimes they provide useful info, sometimes not.

 

[James331]

Weather: start with a DUATS brief to check off that box. I'll call FSS if something looks wonky in the TAFs or area forecast. Foreflight has some nice tools to look at things like ceilings and temp/dew point spread along the route. Airnav is a reasonably quick way to see what approaches are available at the destination and potential alternates. Looking at approaches also gives info for filing to an IAF rather than direct to the airport. Foreflight also works for that task. RUCsoundings was mentioned by other posters and is handy. It does take some study to learn to use. I'll also call someone at the destination if I think observer info will help.

Airplane: Other than fuel and mechanical condition, I want to know if the GPS database is up to date. With enough prep time I'll print plates which I can do from Airnav.

Enroute: monitor conditions using eyes and ears. Sometimes you can pick up a lot from what other pilots are reporting to ATC. Sometimes I'll ask ATC what they are seeing or what they see other pilots doing. ADS-B weather is handy too. Every great once in awhile I'll talk to FSS while enroute. Sometimes they provide useful info, sometimes not.

Just make sure you're using ADSB wx for large picture planning, not short range time sensitive tactical decisions, that's the area for a onboard radar.


Should also mention, your OAT should be part of your scan, especially in a non FIKI plane, not just for ice, but also for rapid temp changes.

 

[Clark1961]

Just make sure you're using ADSB wx for large picture planning, not short range time sensitive tactical decisions, that's the area for a onboard radar.

There's a lot more to ADS-B weather than the nexrad display.

 

[OkieAviator]

I pick the destination.. Log into Lockmart file the plan, look at their briefing, notams, ect...30 mins before flight call and get a weather briefing and activate the plan... Fly said plan as ATC directs.

If you're about to checkride you should have this part down for your oral.

 

[Bill Watson]

I'm now completely paperless using Foreflight on a well mounted iPad, iPhone for backup. Biggest challenge was learning to use the scratchpad for copying clearances.

I file IFR for practically all cross countries (i.e. all flights) even in severe clear. For us non-pros, it makes and keeps the work with ATC automatic and second nature.

I trained and flew several years worth of IFR without an AP. That's unimaginable now. I use the AP >80% of the time and know it thoroughly. I struggle to maintain my hand flying skills. Assuming you have an AP but have been training with minimal use of it, reverse it and get proficient with the AP, especially if it can do RNAV LPV approaches.

I use Nexrad for 'tactical' decision making. It's the only inflight tool I've ever used so I use it for all it's worth. Learn it's capabilities and short comings. In my part of the country it enables a tremendous amount of flying.

 

[James331]

I'm now completely paperless using Foreflight on a well mounted iPad, iPhone for backup. Biggest challenge was learning to use the scratchpad for copying clearances.

I file IFR for practically all cross countries (i.e. all flights) even in severe clear. For us non-pros, it makes and keeps the work with ATC automatic and second nature.

I trained and flew several years worth of IFR without an AP. That's unimaginable now. I use the AP >80% of the time and know it thoroughly. I struggle to maintain my hand flying skills. Assuming you have an AP but have been training with minimal use of it, reverse it and get proficient with the AP, especially if it can do RNAV LPV approaches.

I use Nexrad for 'tactical' decision making. It's the only inflight tool I've ever used so I use it for all it's worth. Learn it's capabilities and short comings. In my part of the country it enables a tremendous amount of flying.

I've had my NEXRAD up and my radar up and seen some decent sized diffrences between the two from time to time, personally I wouldn't use it for tactical.

It's great for pulling weather at your destination, keeping a eye on SIGMETS, and whatnot. But for IMC with convective activity around, radar is really the way to go.

 

[Reedster]

It kind of depends on the distance and how much notice I have.

A week out, I start looking at the long range forecasts - mainly just the Weather Channel (although I will watch the news), just to get a big picture of the upcoming weather trends .

3 days out I switch to:

http://www.usairnet.com/cgi-bin/launch/code.cgi?Submit=Go&sta=KORD&state=IL

Along with prognostic charts in Foreflight.

The night before, and day of, I am completely in Foreflight looking at TAF's and MOS's., Pireps (if there are any).

Except in the colder months, I look at the Skew Log T (well worth learning - there is a good IPad app). Sometimes I look at it to see where the tops should be.

I watch for Sigmets, particularly for icing. I hit pack in FF, and if it looks like IMC, then I print out the approaches I think I might use.

I fly often enough that I am comfortable down to the mins: so as long ceilings are at or above the approach, no icing, or convective, I am good to go. I do look for trends right before launch, to pick an alternative. I do that on every long flight.

 

[RotorDude]

I use Nexrad for 'tactical' decision making. It's the only inflight tool I've ever used so I use it for all it's worth. Learn it's capabilities and short comings. In my part of the country it enables a tremendous amount of flying.

I've had my NEXRAD up and my radar up and seen some decent sized diffrences between the two from time to time, personally I wouldn't use it for tactical.

It's great for pulling weather at your destination, keeping a eye on SIGMETS, and whatnot. But for IMC with convective activity around, radar is really the way to go.

I use NEXRAD (ADS-B FIS-B on Garmin Pilot GDL39) for "tactical" too, but with some caveats.
First, for convective stuff I have StormScope as a live and independent input, which has yet to send me into any rough stuff.
Second, I never look at static reflectivity images alone, but always keep them in a dynamic loop, constantly checking the most recent timestamp (which I assume has some unknown delay beyond the stated value). The dynamic display tells me which way the cell in question is moving, and I make sure to give the business end an extra wide berth, allowing for the delay. If it's serious weather I'd give it even more leeway. If possible, I prefer passing on the tail end of the cell, knowing that any delay is working in my favor.
Also, with all that fancy onboard instrumentation, the best tools are still the old eyeballs, so whenever possible I use that input in conjunction with the electronic gizmos.

 

[jordane93]

Now that it's getting colder I look at freezing levels more closely. Just do everything you do for planning VFR cross countries

 

[fiveoboy01]

Now that it's getting colder I look at freezing levels more closely. Just do everything you do for planning VFR cross countries

Maybe I'm overthinking it and you're correct. Obviously icing and convective activity are the two big things, but there are plenty of resources for both as far as planning.

I know the DPE will bring this up and I want to have a good answer... so yeah as mentioned that's part of the reasoning for the question... but I also want to form good habits with regards to planning.

 

[RotorDude]

Maybe I'm overthinking it and you're correct. Obviously icing and convective activity are the two big things, but there are plenty of resources for both as far as planning.

I know the DPE will bring this up and I want to have a good answer... so yeah as mentioned that's part of the reasoning for the question... but I also want to form good habits with regards to planning.

For real-life flight planning I have created my own checklist for each type of mission that I fly, in the form of a simple text file with a list of items to be checked off. I make sure to include both general and specific/personal items. There is little difference for me if it's IFR or VFR (which might be a game time decision), since much of the needed planning is the same. It includes things like "Check NOTAMs" and "Check TFRs", as well as my own personal things (like "Check spare batteries for tablets", "Bring jacket"). In the case of international flights, there are things like eAPIS and CANPASS. Before leaving for the airport, any item not checked with a 'v' or 'N/A' stands out like a sore thumb, and when they are all checked I know I am covered. Sometimes I discover things that could have been done better preparation-wise, so I update the checklist as applicable.

 

[Datadriver]

1) Days in advance I watch the outlooks on Vans Weather page
at http://www.vansairforce.net/weather.htm

1b) Make sure EFB is loaded with current charts

2) If #1 doesn't make me cancel right away then I get a briefing from weathermeister.com 12 hours in advance

3) repeat step 2 2 hours in advance

4) Check http://rucsoundings.noaa.gov/gifs/ for estimate of moisture bases.

5) File IFR prior to leaving the house

 

[James331]

I can't remember the last time I had more than 15-20 minutes from when learned my distinction to the time I had the prop turning.


Planning days out, mind blown

 

[fiveoboy01]

I've never checked the weather any sooner than the day before for any flight, simply because in my opinion the forecast is more accurate the less far out it is.

Not sure how/if I should change that habit for IFR, but I'm guessing I don't really need to.

 

[OkieAviator]

I've never checked the weather any sooner than the day before for any flight, simply because in my opinion the forecast is more accurate the less far out it is.

Same, checking weather a week out is about pointless... The weather guys can't get it straight so I doubt I would do any better.

 

[gismo]

I use NEXRAD (ADS-B FIS-B on Garmin Pilot GDL39) for "tactical" too, but with some caveats.
First, for convective stuff I have StormScope as a live and independent input, which has yet to send me into any rough stuff.

The biggest downside to SS data is that when you're within 15-20 nm of an active cell (or worse yet an area of widespread cells) the display often gets saturated with false strike indications. I suspect this is due to reflections of the storm's RF energy off terrain features. But whatever the cause this issue severely compromises the usefulness of a SS for close in work. Of course if you remain at least 25nm from the any displayed strike as the manufacturer recommends you probably won't suffer from this disadvantage, but you'll need a pretty wide gap between any cells when you're trying to go tactical.

Second, I never look at static reflectivity images alone, but always keep them in a dynamic loop, constantly checking the most recent timestamp (which I assume has some unknown delay beyond the stated value). The dynamic display tells me which way the cell in question is moving, and I make sure to give the business end an extra wide berth, allowing for the delay. If it's serious weather I'd give it even more leeway. If possible, I prefer passing on the tail end of the cell, knowing that any delay is working in my favor.

Crossing behind a cell is usually safer than the front (leeward) side for the reason you stated plus the much higher likelihood for hail downwind of cell. But the one thing you can easily miss with downlinked NEXRAD is when a cell happens to "pop" as it's headed across your path due to the inherent delays.

Also, with all that fancy onboard instrumentation, the best tools are still the old eyeballs, so whenever possible I use that input in conjunction with the electronic gizmos.

Visual avoidance can work well with widely scattered TRW but won't usually get you through a line.

 

[RotorDude]

The biggest downside to SS data is that when you're within 15-20 nm of an active cell (or worse yet an area of widespread cells) the display often gets saturated with false strike indications. I suspect this is due to reflections of the storm's RF energy off terrain features. But whatever the cause this issue severely compromises the usefulness of a SS for close in work. Of course if you remain at least 25nm from the any displayed strike as the manufacturer recommends you probably won't suffer from this disadvantage, but you'll need a pretty wide gap between any cells when you're trying to go tactical.

I agree that you get some additional noise when closer in, but the short-range setting filters much of it out. I have to admit that when there is that much "action" on the SS, I try to avoid it by at least 20 nm, esp. the leading edge.
What's nice about the SS is that it often detects turbulence without a visibly active cell, which helps you find smoother air.

Crossing behind a cell is usually safer than the front (leeward) side for the reason you stated plus the much higher likelihood for hail downwind of cell. But the one thing you can easily miss with downlinked NEXRAD is when a cell happens to "pop" as it's headed across your path due to the inherent delays.

I have never seen a cell "pop" in seconds out of the blue. There is virtually always ample warning, if you stay on top of all inputs. But cutting it close, esp. at the leading edge, is very risky, so you shouldn't. And relying on NEXRAD alone (or any single input) is risky in itself.

Visual avoidance can work well with widely scattered TRW but won't usually get you through a line.

No single input is always reliable, and yes, "visual avoidance" per se is not reliable when you are dealing with a line or embedded cells. But as one more input to the others I mentioned, even in solid IMC, you often get brief glimpses of what's around you, enough sometimes to build at least a partial mental image. Add that to the other inputs, and you get a better picture and improved ability to choose deviations if needed.

 

[JasonM]

I actually think it is easier to plan IFR flights than VFR. There is just so many variables that you need to watch out for on a VFR flight that takes a lot more planning. As long as you follow the rules and stay out of crazy weather, IFR will be a cake walk 99% of the time. Good luck on your checkride.

 

[Gucci Pilot]

What do you guys do/how do you prepare for an IFR flight?

My question mainly centers around weather and what resources you use and in what order to determine things like destination and alternate, go/no go decisions, delaying departure, etc.. Prior to flight and even enroute...

However I'd like to hear about other things you do, such as regarding the airplane itself, your physical and mental state, passenger stuff, anything.

I'm a 200 hour VFR pilot about to take the instrument checkride and while VFR flight planning is ridiculously easy to me, this IFR stuff is a whole different world.

I'm curious to know how the experienced guys who fly IFR often handle their flights from beginning to end.

Well destination is determined by where I need to go. I look at the approaches, how low will they get me down. Any restrictions such as circling at night, procedures that are NA when the tower is closed. Can I fly the approaches with the airplanes current nav equipment? Basically so I don't end up in this scenario: http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=86471

Standard VFR stuff, will the FBO be open when I get there, is the runway adequate, etc. Day before I will take a glance at the weather on aviationweather.gov and notams on https://www.notams.faa.gov/dinsQueryWeb/

Day of I will do the actual planning, pick an alternate even if I don't need one. If I do need an alternate, odds are the weather will be crap at the airport on the other side of town too so I try to pick an alternate that is a distance away from my real destination or one that has more precise approaches than my destination. Make sure the alternate qualifies.

Big things I watch out for are thunderstorms and icing because if I am flying something small, odds are it isn't certified for known ice. The minimum weather required for filing alternates and such are pretty good about keeping you out of trouble. Yeah it's good to have personal minimums if you are inexperienced though. Airplane, passengers, my physical wellbeing is no different if I am IFR or VFR.

 

[coloradobluesky]

I have a checklist of everything I needed before I embarked on an IFR flight. It was developed based on experience, didnt copy one in a book or anything like that. That way I dont forget anything.

 

[NoHeat]

For IFR, the two big weather issues are thunderstorms and icing. If the sky is clear, neither of those can happen, and my planning effort is reduced to picking a route and altitude, and fuel. Otherwise I spend tons of time studying the noaa site, Foreflight images, and skew T's. I usually call FSS for an abbreviated briefing, asking only for adverse weather and TFRs.

 

[Captain]

Fltplan.com does it all for me. Entire IFR flight from stem to stern.

 

[Sundancer]

Wunderground a couple days out, AWC weather at home, before heading to the airport, AWC one more time, then call for a human briefing, after picking altitude.

Looking at Aera in-flight for METARS (and radar, if needed), unless the weather is at or near VFR. Looking at thunder-bumpers in the warm months, freezing level in the cold months.

Generally do not/not launch into lowering or sketchy (C-172, STEC single-axis, G-530, Aera) at destination. Don't file an alternate unless required to.

I avoid extended periods in the clag; an hour in solid IFR is more than enough in a 172. Not a heavy-duty IFR platform, not single pilot, even with a single-axis AP.

 

[Captain]

Wunderground a couple days out, AWC weather at home, before heading to the airport, AWC one more time, then call for a human briefing, after picking altitude.

Looking at Aera in-flight for METARS (and radar, if needed), unless the weather is at or near VFR. Looking at thunder-bumpers in the warm months, freezing level in the cold months.

Generally do not/not launch into lowering or sketchy (C-172, STEC single-axis, G-530, Aera) at destination. Don't file an alternate unless required to.

I avoid extended periods in the clag; an hour in solid IFR is more than enough in a 172. Not a heavy-duty IFR platform, not single pilot, even with a single-axis AP.

I disagree. I always file an alternate unless I can't for weight. Filing an alternate makes be carry a little extra gas and fuel is options. Plus, there are times an alternate is required that you might miss. Flying in Canada for example. By making that the bias I'm more likely than not covered.

 

[Kritchlow]

nah.... Fun but not worth it.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Don't file an alternate unless required to.

I don't understand that one at all. From a SOP and habit-forming standpoint, it would seem that the opposite — always thinking in terms of a viable alternate even if the weather is CAVU — makes more sense.

 

[James331]

I don't understand that one at all. From a SOP and habit-forming standpoint, it would seem that the opposite — always thinking in terms of a viable alternate even if the weather is CAVU — makes more sense.

For my IFR work I almost always have enough gas for a alternate, plus FltPlan.com's suggested alternate nearly always works, probably takes me a extra 60 seconds, so I just do it by default, I can think of a good reason why not to?

 

[Captain]

Fltplan.com has one glaring alternate problem. I've contacted them about it but they've not fixed it afaik.

If you fly to IAD it suggests DCA as the top suggested alternate. DCA may not be the best choice...especially with BWI nearby.

 

[jordane93]

I don't understand that one at all. From a SOP and habit-forming standpoint, it would seem that the opposite — always thinking in terms of a viable alternate even if the weather is CAVU — makes more sense.

Same. I always file an alternate.

 

[nddons]

It kind of depends on the distance and how much notice I have.



A week out, I start looking at the long range forecasts - mainly just the Weather Channel (although I will watch the news), just to get a big picture of the upcoming weather trends .



3 days out I switch to:



http://www.usairnet.com/cgi-bin/launch/code.cgi?Submit=Go&sta=KORD&state=IL



Along with prognostic charts in Foreflight.



The night before, and day of, I am completely in Foreflight looking at TAF's and MOS's., Pireps (if there are any).



Except in the colder months, I look at the Skew Log T (well worth learning - there is a good IPad app). Sometimes I look at it to see where the tops should be.



I watch for Sigmets, particularly for icing. I hit pack in FF, and if it looks like IMC, then I print out the approaches I think I might use.



I fly often enough that I am comfortable down to the mins: so as long ceilings are at or above the approach, no icing, or convective, I am good to go. I do look for trends right before launch, to pick an alternative. I do that on every long flight.

Great summary. I think the info presented on usairnet.com is very accurate, especially with respect to ceilings.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Fltplan.com has one glaring alternate problem. I've contacted them about it but they've not fixed it afaik.

If you fly to IAD it suggests DCA as the top suggested alternate. DCA may not be the best choice...especially with BWI nearby.

FltPlan's list of alternates are based on two criteria: proximity and the availability of a TAF. Not weather, not special alternate minima, not traffic flow. It still requires pilot decision-making.DCA is listed first because it is closer than BWI. That's all.

 

[Captain]

FltPlan's list of alternates are based on two criteria: proximity and the availability of a TAF. Not weather, not special alternate minima, not traffic flow. It still requires pilot decision-making.DCA is listed first because it is closer than BWI. That's all.

I know. But they could go in there and inhibit that one airport if they chose. It's easy for pilots to get in a flow and miss a gotcha like that. Not saying pilots shouldn't be responsible but on the other hand no sense setting ourselves up for failure.

Theres no reason NOT to remove DCA as an alternate from the list, IMO.

 

[midlifeflyer]

I know. But they could go in there and inhibit that one airport if they chose. It's easy for pilots to get in a flow and miss a gotcha like that. Not saying pilots shouldn't be responsible but on the other hand no sense setting ourselves up for failure.

Theres no reason NOT to remove DCA as an alternate from the list, IMO.

There are probably others you can say that about.

 

[Sundancer]

I disagree. I always file an alternate unless I can't for weight. Filing an alternate makes be carry a little extra gas and fuel is options. Plus, there are times an alternate is required that you might miss. Flying in Canada for example. By making that the bias I'm more likely than not covered.

No problem, feel free to disagree! I was responding to the post, but not advocating a course of action. It works for me, is all.

For planning, filing an alternate doesn't make me carry more gas - thinking I might need it makes me carry more gas.

 

[Ghery]

Now that it's getting colder I look at freezing levels more closely. Just do everything you do for planning VFR cross countries

Amen to that. Living on the west side of the state of Washington I have a great ice machine to cross to get across the state - the Cascade Mountains. I've experienced ice twice, the first time was exciting, the second time my CFII wasn't concerned. I don't want to make it three times. My purpose for getting the IR was to get through a layer on the west side (up or down, doesn't matter) and then have clear flying the rest of the trip. If I have to fly across the state completely in the clag I drive. My wife wouldn't enjoy it and it's too much like work to me. I fly for fun, not because I have to.

To the OP, you'll find that having an IR just adds to the list of weather that you won't fly in. Instead of simply "clouds in the way" it becomes "what kind of clouds?", "what's in those clouds?", "what are the bases? (are they below minimums for approaches to airports along the way or at the destination)", "what are the tops? (am I going to be in the clag all the way?)", etc. I know a number of experienced pilots who absolutely will not fly in IMC across the Cascades in a single engine aircraft. What I don't know is if this is based on reality or years of flying jets with thrust you can trust for the airlines, but I respect their experience and opinions. They may be overly conservative, but, like me, they're old and they didn't get that way by being stupid. When the time comes, know your limitations and set your own personal limits. Then, don't violate them.

Finally, best of luck on the written and your check ride. I know the feeling of relief you will have when that DPE says, "Congratulations!"