What we put up with for tailwinds
- Thread starter Lance F
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steingar
Taxi to Parking
You will never hear me bash Mooneys. Me want. Problem with Mooneys is they take lots of Money.
Skylane81E
Final Approach
I'll only ever bash Mooneys for beings small and that isn't unfair IMO and if you don't need big irrelivant.
EdFred
Taxi to Parking
Same here. You really kind of wear one. For me it's like trying to squeeze into a medium T when I wear XXL.
Richard
Final Approach
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Ack...city life
Multitasking! Breathing, eating, flying....living the dream.
And I had Sirius/XM playing through the intercom (The Spectrum).
and what'd I tell ya. 4 posts/2 Mooneys are small bashes
(Love you guys 
)
Let'sgoflying!
Touchdown! Greaser!
Love it!
EdFred
Taxi to Parking
And I had Sirius/XM playing through the intercom (The Spectrum).
and what'd I tell ya. 4 posts/2 Mooneys are small bashes
Hey, Mooneys are great for you girly men!
rpadula
En-Route
Glad to see you pop up here Lance. How'd you make out through those nasty tornado-spawnin' T-storms last week? I seem to recall a pretty big one go right over Covington late that night.
Just thunder and lightning for Covington. A little east of here in Madison there are a bunch of missing roofs, huge trees down and stuff. This area got off pretty light compared to a lot of others.
Ted
The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted
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iFlyNothing
Exactly, that doesn't cut it, too slow. Needs to cruise at 180 true....
That's what I was thinking. 164 is what I expect with a headwind.
I love me some tailwinds. Nice, Lance!
That's what I was thinking. 164 is what I expect with a headwind.
I love me some tailwinds. Nice, Lance!
That's the thing I never understood about Mooneys, until they put in the big engines, they always had them underpowered to take best advantage of the airframe. The Mooney always needed a 240hp engine. With 240hp it'll cruise 180KTAS, and 180 cruise is my minimum requirement for a traveling machine.
Ted
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iFlyNothing
A local at my airport has a Mooney Missile with the IO-550 conversion. Even with that, his cruise is 175 KTAS at about 18 gph. About the same speed as the 310 on not much less fuel.
I've spent enough time flying the continent in 150 KTAS airplanes that I can handle that just fine. I look more at the leg length, and less than 600 nm legs safely makes a lot of trips really difficult, especially when you're going far off the beaten path. 750 nm legs are even better, since at that point you can do Houston to Cozumel non-stop. I can do that without a tailwind in the Aztec or 310, but not with enough fuel reserves to make me feel good for the amount of time over water.
Seems to me 180 is somewhat arbitrary. Frankly what I like is Mach .81, but at $5.85 a gallon 7.4 gph and 150 true will have to do.
Ted
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iFlyNothing
Exactly. I have a friend who's crossed the country a number of times in her Cherokee, barely pushing 110 kts.
All comes down to how much time you have, and how much you can put up with for headwinds.
Not really, I chose 180 because it's 3 miles a minute and under most conditions it allows me to get from anywhere in the lower 48 to anywhere in the lower 48 in a comfortable day.
rpadula
En-Route
Glad to hear you're OK.
BTW, did ATC call you with a re-route while you had that sammich jammed in your mouth?
"Atlanta Center..mmmmmppphhh nom nom nom"
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
Hmm. Even E55 -> KEPM? 2501nm.
(I think that's as far apart as two public-use airports get in the CONUS.)
Personally, 10 hours of flying in a day is more than enough for me. So, I'd have to go 250KTAS to be able to go from anywhere to anywhere in the ConUS in a day. Of course, living in the middle of the country, the furthest from the home 'drome is 1560nm... So I could theoretically get to or from anywhere in the ConUS in a day at 160 KTAS. Hmmm, sounds like a Twin Comanche...
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
That depends. Was there ketchup on your hot dog?
I love Mooneys. I'm 6'4", They fit me well. (I hear Al Mooney was 6'5".) I also love efficiency, and the Mooney 201 is one of the best there is at being both relatively fast and very efficient.
Nice bird, Lance!
Hmm. Even E55 -> KEPM? 2501nm.
(I think that's as far apart as two public-use airports get in the CONUS.)
Personally, 10 hours of flying in a day is more than enough for me. So, I'd have to go 250KTAS to be able to go from anywhere to anywhere in the ConUS in a day. Of course, living in the middle of the country, the furthest from the home 'drome is 1560nm... So I could theoretically get to or from anywhere in the ConUS in a day at 160 KTAS. Hmmm, sounds like a Twin Comanche...
I'm good with 18hrs in a day, more than that is a push for me.
Ted
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But 18 hours worth of travel is hardly "comfortable," even for iron butters like me. With my routine trips from Houston to NH these days in the 310 at 175 KTAS, I'm wishing there was an easy way to put TSIO-550s on and bump that up to 200ish.
I'd love 240kts or better myself as well, hell, I'd like to be Mach 3+, just can't afford it. As I said 180 is my MINIMUM traveling plane speed.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
I'm good with an 18-hour day... But that doesn't translate to 18 flight hours. Every fuel stop takes a minimum of an hour it seems, more if I grab a courtesy car to go get food, more yet if I need to check weather again, etc.
My longest 2 days of flying were Houston to Madison (where I didn't start flying right away in the morning, flew 5.3 KEFD->KSIK, ate at Lambert's, fueled the plane, and flew 3.5 KSIK->KRFD (stop&go to make it count for my comm solo XC)->KMSN) and Denver to Madison (KFTG->KFMZ(look around, try to find someone to unlock the fuel pump, give up, leave)->KLNK (Dinner in town w/Jesse and Tristan)->KAHQ (so I could say "Wahoo Traffic..."
) ->KRDK (to actually buy fuel)->C29). So, while both were long, maybe I could have done longer if I had really been trying to get somewhere, and packed food to eat on the plane instead of making longer stops and/or socializing. But there is a point of diminishing safety in there somewhere.
I'm good with an 18-hour day... But that doesn't translate to 18 flight hours. Every fuel stop takes a minimum of an hour it seems, more if I grab a courtesy car to go get food, more yet if I need to check weather again, etc.
My longest 2 days of flying were Houston to Madison (where I didn't start flying right away in the morning, flew 5.3 KEFD->KSIK, ate at Lambert's, fueled the plane, and flew 3.5 KSIK->KRFD (stop&go to make it count for my comm solo XC)->KMSN) and Denver to Madison (KFTG->KFMZ(look around, try to find someone to unlock the fuel pump, give up, leave)->KLNK (Dinner in town w/Jesse and Tristan)->KAHQ (so I could say "Wahoo Traffic..."
So, while both were long, maybe I could have done longer if I had really been trying to get somewhere, and packed food to eat on the plane instead of making longer stops and/or socializing. But there is a point of diminishing safety in there somewhere.
I take a bag of jerky, chips, drinks, powerbar type food with me and I'll call up on UNICOM when I'm still 20 out telling them that I need "fast turn fueling". Usually I'm not on the ground more than half an hour. I have found that even with normal headwinds I can make it from South Florida to the Bay Area in CA in under 18 hrs. I don't waste any time.
jesse
Touchdown! Greaser!
I love Mooneys. I'm 6'4", They fit me well. (I hear Al Mooney was 6'5".) I also love efficiency, and the Mooney 201 is one of the best there is at being both relatively fast and very efficient.
Nice bird, Lance!
I'm 5'7" and 160 lbs and I feel as cramped in a Mooney 201 as I do in a Cessna 150. It took me awhile to figure out why that was. It mostly came down to the seats being shoved very close together giving you almost no elbow room from the passenger. Plus the legs are pretty horizontally restricted.
That said. I still love flying in a Mooney but nobody is going to convince me it's as comfortable as a Bonanza. The Bo seats aren't so close together, hell there is even room for an arm rest that can come up. Plus the seating position is more comfortable and my legs don't feel so restricted.
I think a lot of it really comes down to the feet position as well. If I'm instructing in a Bo I can put my feet flat on the floor in comfort. In a Mooney it really wants me to put my feet on the rudder pedals but I don't do that unless it's needed.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
Yeah, usually I'm fueling the plane myself. I'm a cheap bastard, and I go for the places with cheap fuel, which are usually self serve.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
Not to mention, it'll be somewhat claustrophobia-inducing with the panel right in your face.
It's definitely a tall-person airplane - And it's not super-wide by any means. It feels like a Cherokee to me in terms of width (barely enough) and height (enough that I don't bump my head, so plenty) but the legroom is HUGE.
OTOH, I bump my head in most of the Beeches because of the rounded roof. Spike's Bo, for some reason, didn't have that problem... Lower seats?
In that class, I think the Comanche fits me the best. It's very wide, the square-ish cabin cross section keeps me from bumping my head, and the legroom is adequate for me. But, it's not as efficient as the Mooney.
Yeah, usually I'm fueling the plane myself. I'm a cheap bastard, and I go for the places with cheap fuel, which are usually self serve.
That's even better, it gives me a 15 minute turn around on the ground. What irks me though is when some yahoo leaves his plane parked in front of the pump after they fuel and I have to get out and move them out of the way. If it wouldn't cost me more time, I'd just light their planes on fire.
steingar
Taxi to Parking
I'm 5'7" and, er, ahem... oh, about ah, er, ahem... maybe 150 pounds, and I never felt cramped in a 150.
jesse
Touchdown! Greaser!
I don't feel cramped in a 150 unless I'm instructing. Then it's uncomfortable as hell trying to figure out where to put your feet. If you put them flat on the floor you can't get them to the pedals in an instant if you need to as the pedals will run your feet over. So you end up having to just kind of hold them in an awkward position.
If the other person is bigger than me, they tend to spill over the seat, and that also makes things a bit cramped.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
My "one hour" includes the time it takes to slow down, land, taxi in, fuel, pee, start up, taxi out, take off, climb, and get back to cruise - So I basically add an hour to the "cruise" time for a fuel stop when I'm planning on getting somewhere by a specified time.
I also can probably fuel the DA40 faster - The "one hour" also includes jockeying a ladder to fuel the 182.
I'm sure glad they haven't slowed down 100LL pumps the way they've slowed down gas pumps in recent years. 3-4gpm? Really?
TangoWhiskey
Touchdown! Greaser!
Hey, Mooneys are great for you girly men!
I guess that makes me one. Love Mooneys!
bigred177
Cleared for Takeoff
My "one hour" includes the time it takes to slow down, land, taxi in, fuel, pee, start up, taxi out, take off, climb, and get back to cruise - So I basically add an hour to the "cruise" time for a fuel stop when I'm planning on getting somewhere by a specified time.
I also can probably fuel the DA40 faster - The "one hour" also includes jockeying a ladder to fuel the 182.
I'm sure glad they haven't slowed down 100LL pumps the way they've slowed down gas pumps in recent years. 3-4gpm? Really?
Just pee under the wing while self serve fueling and you could probably shave a few more minutes off!
That's what I do.
Skylane81E
Final Approach
Only flown one Bo, and the seats were about a mile too far above the floor. Less headroom than a DA-20. Only one plane ever beat it for cramped, 6'4" and all leg doesn't go to well with a 150
I felt like Jenna Jamison while flying it, didn't like it my legs belong together thank you very much!
steingar
Taxi to Parking
Can't say I've had that problem. It can get kinda cramped with a plus sized individual, though. Fortunately I'm not a member of that club. Yet.