S
sayrequest
Guest
I have heard the arguments, read more than a few papers and for me it boils down to a few things I have to get off my chest.
One is pattern entry at uncontrolled fields. I understand what the aim says and I agree. I understand that the 45 is a recommended procedure. I want to cover what others seem to think is acceptable procedure and share why it bothers me to see these cowboy pattern entries and procedures.
Lets start with the upwind or crosswind entry at 500 abv tpa. I have been in the pattern for several hours through out the day and had these cowboys fly in declaring upwind entry to runway 17 say. I am in the pattern with a student making radio calls on every corner of the pattern only to be completely surprised when I have just called my crosswind and some cowboy declares that he is on crosswind desceding to TPA. Yeah buddy, I am on the crosswind directly below you, 300 below tpa, and your going to do what? Think Top Gun when maverick says "I going to slam on the brakes and he'll fly right by", goose says your going to do what. Gutsiest move I ever saw, man.... anyway.....
Without debating the merits of the crosswind entry, a not so cute stunt, for all our sakes, make a few calls before you get there. I keep a running awareness of who is where and when and if I know you are coming I can accomodate you, no problem. We extend downwinds all the time to allow straight in instrument approaches or for stacked up departures to get out, prior to arrival. No problem. Follow the FEDex and UPS guys lead, notice they call several times prior to arrival, usually starting about 10 out. Makes it so easy. Being a pilot is not a secret agent thing. The goal is not to be silent and listen to everyone else, "Oh yeah I knew where you were" Yeah but, we want to know where you are as well. I have heard a million times from some some smug pilot "a radio call is not required," Yeah its not required, but if it doesn't overburden the frequency and you have a radio, use the darn thing.
A few more, for example, 45 Radio calls, I hear, X trafffic, cessna y, 45 left downwind. Which is it Left 45 or Downwind? Oh you meant to say on a 45 for a Left downwind? I almost always hear that call when the aircraft is making a teardrop type entry right on top of the downwind. A couple points. It's not really a 45 and why include both locations in the call? I understand the "on a 45 for a left downwind call", but isn't the logical conclusion of being on a left 45, a left downwind? Why wouldn't you just say x traffic, cessna y is on a 3 mile left 45, 17. Notice that it is quite clear that you are on a 45 and not a downwind, and that it is infinitely more helpful to me if I am on the crosswind as I know you are 3 out (I can extend upwind or start my cross). I won't wonder if the 45 you are talking about is an 8 mile 45 or the turning downwind instantaeously type of deal. As for the 45, when you are over the field, survey the scene and use the advantage of the altitude to select some ground references for your 45. For me 3 mile 45 is my minimum. I know you guys are way better, way cooler, you don't need that private pilot long 45.. I usually fly a 5 mile 45 if terrain allows. Try it, it gives you more time to pickup crosswind / patten traffic and more time for them to accomodate you. Also fly a real 45, if pattern entry dictates Southeast entry, don't curve in from 1 mile due east. It may seem counter intuitive but a long 45 is more professional and safer.
Also if you fly at a towered airport Right pattern is something ATC gives you because they control the airspace and are sitting in a tower with the sole job of separating traffic. See 91.126 for uncontrolled fields, says all turns to left unless otherwise established for airport. I have heard more than a couple people loudly declare on CTAF, "turning right base" on a left hand rwy and they weren't in helicopters, "avoiding the flow of fixed wing traffic". They are breaking a regulation and making a radio call about it. I always find that interesting, saw a King Air 300 guy do it last month. like, what are you thinking?
Also Position and Hold is an ATC thing that I see at uncontrolled fields. Some how, someone believes that the FAA's main concern over past decade "runway incursions" somehow is exempt if you do it on purpose at uncontrolled fields. It always ends when the guy who just landed misses the nearest turnoff that captain position and hold figured landing traffic should have made. Soon after, the silent downwind traffic now well on a base (The one you didn't see when you thought the faa hired you to be atc in your high wing, sitting at the end of the runway) tells you he's on base turning final. Even if the spacing does work out so that traffic clears the end of runway as you lift off and landing traffic flares, I think you guys should get some recurrency training. Also consider the potential go around situation that double upwind traffic creates.
Doesn't end there, gets better, consider the traffic that takes the runway and thinks that line checks or runway checks/ configurations should be handled on the runway. I came from one of the busiest airports in the country. Cleared for takeoff does not allow for delay. If you require delay you should say ready to go rwy x request short delay. Tower would have chewed you out for not requesting a stunt like that. Do you require a tiedown with that take off? They didn't clear you for takeoff with a 747 5 mile final at 180 knots so you could make sure your heading indicator lined up with runway heading and brief the merits of a short field takeoff. Hold short lines are where you get ready, not the runway. At uncontrolled fields you should do the same.. Just say taking rwy x with short delay. Not regulation, just courteous flying. I can then plan accordingly. I have been on downwind self announcing and had to go around after traffic remained on the runway while I moved around the pattern to base and then final.
For heavens sakes Most of what I am talking about assumes an attitude that these cowboys are the only ones in the sky. Lastly, I have read several things contrary to straight in traffic and I personally am fine with it. I expect 45 traffic and straight in traffic, doesnt bother me, I hate traffic in places that I don't expect to see it. Not that it relieves me from see and avoid, thats my job, I just don't think that traffic descending on me in crosswind, or people that think a 45 degree entry is a steep spiral to downwind is a good idea.
Today I was almost killed when an airplane rented at our FBO (with a radio) entered the downwind in stealth mode (not making calls) in a steep banking descending turn to downwind. I had called my takeoff with the intention of closed traffic, crosswind and downwind. He didn't maintain a listening watch, and I didn't hear or see a peep from him on CTAF untill he filled up my windscreen in a steep decending turn to downwind. He said he never saw me, newer pilot. Fine, but don't be offended when you come to my airport and I chew up some cowboy for pulling some stunt and compounding it with no radio calls. I don't care how big your airplane is or if you have 25,000 hours. I love flying but have no room for those who don't have regard for safety or courtesy in their flying. I look forward to your comments. I hope these things are not typical of your flying, if so get an instructor and ask them if I am all wet or maybe you aren't as safe a pilot as you thought you were.
One is pattern entry at uncontrolled fields. I understand what the aim says and I agree. I understand that the 45 is a recommended procedure. I want to cover what others seem to think is acceptable procedure and share why it bothers me to see these cowboy pattern entries and procedures.
Lets start with the upwind or crosswind entry at 500 abv tpa. I have been in the pattern for several hours through out the day and had these cowboys fly in declaring upwind entry to runway 17 say. I am in the pattern with a student making radio calls on every corner of the pattern only to be completely surprised when I have just called my crosswind and some cowboy declares that he is on crosswind desceding to TPA. Yeah buddy, I am on the crosswind directly below you, 300 below tpa, and your going to do what? Think Top Gun when maverick says "I going to slam on the brakes and he'll fly right by", goose says your going to do what. Gutsiest move I ever saw, man.... anyway.....
Without debating the merits of the crosswind entry, a not so cute stunt, for all our sakes, make a few calls before you get there. I keep a running awareness of who is where and when and if I know you are coming I can accomodate you, no problem. We extend downwinds all the time to allow straight in instrument approaches or for stacked up departures to get out, prior to arrival. No problem. Follow the FEDex and UPS guys lead, notice they call several times prior to arrival, usually starting about 10 out. Makes it so easy. Being a pilot is not a secret agent thing. The goal is not to be silent and listen to everyone else, "Oh yeah I knew where you were" Yeah but, we want to know where you are as well. I have heard a million times from some some smug pilot "a radio call is not required," Yeah its not required, but if it doesn't overburden the frequency and you have a radio, use the darn thing.
A few more, for example, 45 Radio calls, I hear, X trafffic, cessna y, 45 left downwind. Which is it Left 45 or Downwind? Oh you meant to say on a 45 for a Left downwind? I almost always hear that call when the aircraft is making a teardrop type entry right on top of the downwind. A couple points. It's not really a 45 and why include both locations in the call? I understand the "on a 45 for a left downwind call", but isn't the logical conclusion of being on a left 45, a left downwind? Why wouldn't you just say x traffic, cessna y is on a 3 mile left 45, 17. Notice that it is quite clear that you are on a 45 and not a downwind, and that it is infinitely more helpful to me if I am on the crosswind as I know you are 3 out (I can extend upwind or start my cross). I won't wonder if the 45 you are talking about is an 8 mile 45 or the turning downwind instantaeously type of deal. As for the 45, when you are over the field, survey the scene and use the advantage of the altitude to select some ground references for your 45. For me 3 mile 45 is my minimum. I know you guys are way better, way cooler, you don't need that private pilot long 45.. I usually fly a 5 mile 45 if terrain allows. Try it, it gives you more time to pickup crosswind / patten traffic and more time for them to accomodate you. Also fly a real 45, if pattern entry dictates Southeast entry, don't curve in from 1 mile due east. It may seem counter intuitive but a long 45 is more professional and safer.
Also if you fly at a towered airport Right pattern is something ATC gives you because they control the airspace and are sitting in a tower with the sole job of separating traffic. See 91.126 for uncontrolled fields, says all turns to left unless otherwise established for airport. I have heard more than a couple people loudly declare on CTAF, "turning right base" on a left hand rwy and they weren't in helicopters, "avoiding the flow of fixed wing traffic". They are breaking a regulation and making a radio call about it. I always find that interesting, saw a King Air 300 guy do it last month. like, what are you thinking?
Also Position and Hold is an ATC thing that I see at uncontrolled fields. Some how, someone believes that the FAA's main concern over past decade "runway incursions" somehow is exempt if you do it on purpose at uncontrolled fields. It always ends when the guy who just landed misses the nearest turnoff that captain position and hold figured landing traffic should have made. Soon after, the silent downwind traffic now well on a base (The one you didn't see when you thought the faa hired you to be atc in your high wing, sitting at the end of the runway) tells you he's on base turning final. Even if the spacing does work out so that traffic clears the end of runway as you lift off and landing traffic flares, I think you guys should get some recurrency training. Also consider the potential go around situation that double upwind traffic creates.
Doesn't end there, gets better, consider the traffic that takes the runway and thinks that line checks or runway checks/ configurations should be handled on the runway. I came from one of the busiest airports in the country. Cleared for takeoff does not allow for delay. If you require delay you should say ready to go rwy x request short delay. Tower would have chewed you out for not requesting a stunt like that. Do you require a tiedown with that take off? They didn't clear you for takeoff with a 747 5 mile final at 180 knots so you could make sure your heading indicator lined up with runway heading and brief the merits of a short field takeoff. Hold short lines are where you get ready, not the runway. At uncontrolled fields you should do the same.. Just say taking rwy x with short delay. Not regulation, just courteous flying. I can then plan accordingly. I have been on downwind self announcing and had to go around after traffic remained on the runway while I moved around the pattern to base and then final.
For heavens sakes Most of what I am talking about assumes an attitude that these cowboys are the only ones in the sky. Lastly, I have read several things contrary to straight in traffic and I personally am fine with it. I expect 45 traffic and straight in traffic, doesnt bother me, I hate traffic in places that I don't expect to see it. Not that it relieves me from see and avoid, thats my job, I just don't think that traffic descending on me in crosswind, or people that think a 45 degree entry is a steep spiral to downwind is a good idea.
Today I was almost killed when an airplane rented at our FBO (with a radio) entered the downwind in stealth mode (not making calls) in a steep banking descending turn to downwind. I had called my takeoff with the intention of closed traffic, crosswind and downwind. He didn't maintain a listening watch, and I didn't hear or see a peep from him on CTAF untill he filled up my windscreen in a steep decending turn to downwind. He said he never saw me, newer pilot. Fine, but don't be offended when you come to my airport and I chew up some cowboy for pulling some stunt and compounding it with no radio calls. I don't care how big your airplane is or if you have 25,000 hours. I love flying but have no room for those who don't have regard for safety or courtesy in their flying. I look forward to your comments. I hope these things are not typical of your flying, if so get an instructor and ask them if I am all wet or maybe you aren't as safe a pilot as you thought you were.
