What Plane Should I Get

Re: What Plance Should I Get

MBDiagMan said:
I have read and heard a number of competent CFI's say that a beginner can often solo a taildragger in no more hours than a tricycle. I'm sure this depends on the CFI AND the student.
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Page 1 of my logbook - would you call this "no more hours"?
 

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Re: What Plance Should I Get

MBDiagMan said:
I have read and heard a number of competent CFI's say that a beginner can often solo a taildragger in no more hours than a tricycle. I'm sure this depends on the CFI AND the student.
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I would believe that. I haven't done any tailwheel instruction but I am tailwheel endorsed and I've done a good portion of nosewheel instruction.

I've soloed people in as little as 12 hours total time at a class C and as high as 30 hours. Every student is different.
 
lr60plt said:
Im going to add another vote for the cessna 120/140. I think that fits your bill pretty well. There are tons of them right around 20k, and you can get all-metal ones so you dont have to worry about hangar as much. Nice little taildraggers, simple, dual controls, 5gph...etc.

http://www.barnstormers.com/classified_604072_1946+Cessna+140+.html

http://www.barnstormers.com/classified_519353_1946+CESSNA+140.html

http://www.barnstormers.com/classified_655609_Cessna+140.html
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Captain,

If you decide to pursue a 120/140 PM me and I will give you the run down.
 
Current issue of AOPA Pilot is for the OP. 10 Planes for under $20k
 
Sorry, I've sent no PMs. I'm now putting more weight on a four seater. The idea of leaving one kid behind is turning out to be a harder pill to swallow than I had at first thought.

This picking a make thing is hard. So many pros and cons. I'm finding it hard to seperate what I'd 'like' to have verses what I 'need' to have.

Boring holes on a sunny day sounds great...but wouldn't it be nice if I could pick up a clearance if needed? But then there's cost to acquire and cost to maintain. Times that by 1,000 and that's where I'm at. I thought this thread would spit out the perfect plane for me...instead I'm 20 times more confused than when I started.

Don't get me wrong...I am so appreciative of all your posts. Thank you all so much. I feel like I'm swimming in information now and still don't know anything.
 
For a four place taildragger, sure seems like a 170 would be tough to beat. If you don't go with a taildragger, you have an ideal situation for a Cherokee 140. Even though they are four place, they are known for not being a four ADULT plane. With the boys, even when they get bigger, unless they both turn out to be big linebackers, would make it a completely adequate THREE place.

Also, if you slip to a nose dragger, a Beech Musketeer would make a good three place plane and they are usually available at a good price.
 
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Captain said:
Don't get me wrong...I am so appreciative of all your posts. Thank you all so much. I feel like I'm swimming in information now and still don't know anything.
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Give it a rest for awhile. A confused mind cannot make a decision. Don't chase the airplane. Let it come to you when its ready. You'll know it when it does.
 
Captain said:
Sorry, I've sent no PMs. I'm now putting more weight on a four seater. The idea of leaving one kid behind is turning out to be a harder pill to swallow than I had at first thought.

This picking a make thing is hard. So many pros and cons. I'm finding it hard to seperate what I'd 'like' to have verses what I 'need' to have.

Boring holes on a sunny day sounds great...but wouldn't it be nice if I could pick up a clearance if needed? But then there's cost to acquire and cost to maintain. Times that by 1,000 and that's where I'm at. I thought this thread would spit out the perfect plane for me...instead I'm 20 times more confused than when I started.

Don't get me wrong...I am so appreciative of all your posts. Thank you all so much. I feel like I'm swimming in information now and still don't know anything.
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My vote is still a Stinson 108, preferably a -3. They are great and solid planes and there's tons of engine upgrade options as well as floats. I used to haul banners with one that had an O-470, awesome performing airplane and with the leading edge slats you could land that sucker at a near hover in 20kts of wind. There is also the IO-360KB option which seems pretty slick. Good handling, good flying planes and they don't have any real bad manners to count against them teaching the kids in.

Personally I would only go with a fabric one though. Some of them have been metalized, and some of them got the 'Razorback' kit which puts a fiberglass skin on them; I'm not personally fond of either, but the metalized with a big engine is ok. I wouldn't have the Razorback.
 
Captain said:
Sorry, I've sent no PMs. I'm now putting more weight on a four seater. The idea of leaving one kid behind is turning out to be a harder pill to swallow than I had at first thought.

This picking a make thing is hard. So many pros and cons. I'm finding it hard to seperate what I'd 'like' to have verses what I 'need' to have.

Boring holes on a sunny day sounds great...but wouldn't it be nice if I could pick up a clearance if needed? But then there's cost to acquire and cost to maintain. Times that by 1,000 and that's where I'm at. I thought this thread would spit out the perfect plane for me...instead I'm 20 times more confused than when I started.

Don't get me wrong...I am so appreciative of all your posts. Thank you all so much. I feel like I'm swimming in information now and still don't know anything.
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Have a look at the aircraft for sale in your area, considering your priorities. Sounds like the four place has popped up on the priority list, thus you had become unconfused about at least one thing. So limit your search for four place aircraft.

Next, is your priority IFR or tail dragger? Perhaps you can get both, there are such aircraft out there. I would think you'd want a tricycle gear, since you're teaching your sons. I know people here blather on about how much better tail draggers are, but all the trainers made now are tricycle gear and have been for decades. That speaks volumes to me.

I myself would strongly consider something of the Cherokee line in your situation, but I'm biased. Nonetheless, it shouldn't be rocket surgery to pick up an IFR certified four seat aircraft in your area for the price you've specified.
 
I find IFR in FL with a small plane useless as tits on a boar. If you can't fly in the clear down here, you sure as hell don't want to meet up with what's in those clouds. All the guys flying Bahamas routes 135? Most of them aren't current for IFR because they won't go into the actual we typically get down here.
 
Jaybird180 said:
Give it a rest for awhile. A confused mind cannot make a decision. Don't chase the airplane. Let it come to you when its ready. You'll know it when it does.
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When it comes to you, don't make any sudden moves and let it sniff your hand. ;)
 
I'm very late to this thread. Did somebody already recommend the Bonanza or King Air yet? ;)
 
MBDiagMan said:
For a four place taildragger, sure seems like a 170 would be tough to beat. If you don't go with a taildragger, you have an ideal situation for a Cherokee 140. Even though they are four place, they are known for not being a four ADULT plane. With the boys, even when they get bigger, unless they both turn out to be big linebackers, would make it a completely adequate THREE place.

Also, if you slip to a nose dragger, a Beech Musketeer would make a good three place plane and they are usually available at a good price.
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I have to agree, a 172 set up for IFR ought to be possible in the budget.
 
MBDiagMan said:
For a four place taildragger, sure seems like a 170 would be tough to beat.
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I have a '55 170B.

Technically it is IFR capable, mine is currently legal for /U. Put DME in it and I could fly most all VOR and ILS/LOC approaches. I just don't need to right now.

For taildraggers the chief "rival" to the 170 in terms of price (actually the 170 commands a slight premium), configuration and performance is the Piper PA20 or the PA22 converted to tailwheel ops. The differences are almost a wash there. But it is Continental vs. Lycoming, aluminum vs. fabric.

It's a great plane. Mine is slightly heavier than the average of the breed and I have 750lbs useful. I often find myself wishing for the next model up, like most airplane owners.
 
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Re: What Plance Should I Get

Captain said:
I'm 6'4" if that makes a difference. 230lbs.
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One of the 150hp Citabria models would be my recommendation for pilot comfort, utility and safety reasons.

All of the side-by-side models (tricycle and tailwheeel) are going to be a very tight fit, and those with light wing loading (LSAs and similar) are relatively difficult to handle in >5kt winds.

It's a fair argument that light-wing-loaded trainers make better pilots, but I don't think they're practical in your case.

Citabrias are among the easiest taildraggers to fly, and the 150hp versions will fly out of ground effect at almost any forward speed, which helps reduce PIO groundloops on takeoff:-) In fact, Amelia Reid and Marge (my taildragger instructors) avoided using 150hp Citabrias for primary TD training because they were too easy to fly! I'd recommend 150hp in your case due to above-FAA-average size.

There have been spar-crack issues reported recently on Citabrias, and I'd strongly recommend that you invest in a comprehensive pre-buy, particularly if the aircraft has been used for acro training.
 
Re: What Plance Should I Get

edmeis3 said:
One of the 150hp Citabria models would be my recommendation for pilot comfort, utility and safety reasons.

All of the side-by-side models (tricycle and tailwheeel) are going to be a very tight fit, and those with light wing loading (LSAs and similar) are relatively difficult to handle in >5kt winds.

It's a fair argument that light-wing-loaded trainers make better pilots, but I don't think they're practical in your case.

Citabrias are among the easiest taildraggers to fly, and the 150hp versions will fly out of ground effect at almost any forward speed, which helps reduce PIO groundloops on takeoff:-) In fact, Amelia Reid and Marge (my taildragger instructors) avoided using 150hp Citabrias for primary TD training because they were too easy to fly! I'd recommend 150hp in your case due to above-FAA-average size.

There have been spar-crack issues reported recently on Citabrias, and I'd strongly recommend that you invest in a comprehensive pre-buy, particularly if the aircraft has been used for acro training.
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First post..:yesnod:

Welcome to POA..:)
 
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