University of North Dakota

[Seanaldinho]

So Im starting to look at UND as a serious possibility in my future. (ATC major)

My reasons:
Public school (not private school prices)
Big Fleet of Diverse Aircraft
Large Aviation Program

What's the real scoop with the program? Actual cost? Jobs afterwards? Climate (I am a Florida boy...)?

Any information about the school really. Thanks.

 

[LDJones]

I can connect you with real students you can talk to....my son is a third year ATC major there and absolutely loves the school. It's a well-run program, but not cheap...like all the other programs.

 

[Skylane81E]

Got a former ramp monkey going there, seems happy

 

[murphey]

Be prepared for very cold winters and cross-wind takeoffs & landings.

 

[asgcpa]

I grew up in Winnipeg, Canada. No biggie about weather. You get used to it. Better than sweltering in humidity in the summer.

 

[Seanaldinho]

I grew up in Winnipeg, Canada. No biggie about weather. You get used to it. Better than sweltering in humidity in the summer.

I'll argue with you on that one.

Be prepared for very cold winters and cross-wind takeoffs & landings.

Thats what Im most worried about. Not the crosswinds but the cold.

I can connect you with real students you can talk to....my son is a third year ATC major there and absolutely loves the school. It's a well-run program, but not cheap...like all the other programs.

Can you give me an estimate as to how many flying days there really are? Also Ive seen that with the ATC major comes a PPL, but Ill already have mine by the time I get there. So can I instead of doing a PPL do a commercial? (You may not be able to answer this, I came here actually to look for questions to send to admissions.)

And in comparison to some places *cough* Embry *cough* it looks cheap.

 

[asgcpa]

I'll argue with you on that one.



Thats what Im most worried about. Not the crosswinds but the cold.



Can you give me an estimate as to how many flying days there really are? Also Ive seen that with the ATC major comes a PPL, but Ill already have mine by the time I get there. So can I instead of doing a PPL do a commercial? (You may not be able to answer this, I came here actually to look for questions to send to admissions.)

And in comparison to some places *cough* Embry *cough* it looks cheap.

Argue away....cold isn't too bad. Bundle up, wear gloves and you are golden. Besides, lots of bright sunlight and smooth air in winter from what I recall.

 

[BillTIZ]

Be prepared for very cold winters and cross-wind takeoffs & landings.

They do have a xwind runway. But if you can't handle a ND xwind "breeze", you'll never fly. They used to halt flight operations if it got too cold, like -25F?

I've seen -40F (= -40C) at Grand Forks.

(4 yrs, 5 winters at KRDR)

The FBO would pull a HP aircraft over from UND for us non-student local renters.

 

[DavidWhite]

Whenever I'm up that way all I hear is people who can't speak English on the radio and in the pattern. I think they have a lot of foreign students up there

 

[poadeleted21]

I'll argue with you on that one.



Thats what Im most worried about. Not the crosswinds but the cold.



Can you give me an estimate as to how many flying days there really are? Also Ive seen that with the ATC major comes a PPL, but Ill already have mine by the time I get there. So can I instead of doing a PPL do a commercial? (You may not be able to answer this, I came here actually to look for questions to send to admissions.)

And in comparison to some places *cough* Embry *cough* it looks cheap.

When the sky is crystal clear, the thermometer pegged to the left and all the moisture has been squeezed out of the air, flying don't get any better. Plus, it's free horsepower.

beats this, my flight from Savannah to SC00 this past weekend.... not a cloud in the sky 96% Humidity.

 

[NoHeat]

To save money, a student I know got his PPL and instrument rating at our club while taking all his general education classes at a community college. Then he started at Univ. of Dubuque needing only 2 years to complete their bachelor's program intended for airline pilots.

That is a strategy that's worth a look, to economize.

 

[Seanaldinho]

When the sky is crystal clear, the thermometer pegged to the left and all the moisture has been squeezed out of the air, flying don't get any better. Plus, it's free horsepower.

beats this, my flight from Savannah to SC00 this past weekend.... not a cloud in the sky 96% Humidity.

Im used to 100% humidity, 90*+ and building clouds... well I would certainly be more rounded...

 

[NoHeat]

Whenever I'm up that way all I hear is people who can't speak English on the radio and in the pattern. I think they have a lot of foreign students up there

There are more and more foreign students at all kinds of universities in the US. I have taught a class that was 1/3 mainland Chinese undergrads. Ten years ago nobody could have imagined that. It is a good thing for our economy.

 

[Flavius Renatus]

Buy a couple pair of Long Johns, they help a lot with the cold.

 

[NineThreeKilo]

I dont know about the ATC side of the house, however I've heard only good things about the pilot side.

Flew with a few low time grads, very impressed with their knowledge and airmanship (way better from the riddle and ATP offering I've flown with).

 

[LDJones]

I'll argue with you on that one.

Thats what Im most worried about. Not the crosswinds but the cold.

Can you give me an estimate as to how many flying days there really are? Also Ive seen that with the ATC major comes a PPL, but Ill already have mine by the time I get there. So can I instead of doing a PPL do a commercial? (You may not be able to answer this, I came here actually to look for questions to send to admissions.)

And in comparison to some places *cough* Embry *cough* it looks cheap.

They're not shutdown very often...you'll actually get real IFR experience, too! But on many days the visibility is endless! It's also a pretty safe area to train as there is a long, straight level "runway" every mile!

 

[asgcpa]

A buddy of mine who flies for Porter graduated from there years ago. He has nothing but good things to say.....

 

[Seanaldinho]

Well you all make a compelling argument and I will be delving deeper and submitting an application soon. I still just cant wrap my head around North Dakota...

 

[LDJones]

I dont know about the ATC side of the house, however I've heard only good things about the pilot side.

Flew with a few low time grads, very impressed with their knowledge and airmanship (way better from the riddle and ATP offering I've flown with).

Their tower sim is the best available, according to a friend who retired from ATC and now teaches at the FAA academy in OKC. He said UND's sim beats anything they have in OKC.

It should be good....the "lab fee" for my son's Radar 1 class last semester was $1,800!

 

[LDJones]

Well you all make a compelling argument and I will be delving deeper and submitting an application soon. I still just cant wrap my head around North Dakota...

Try...it's a nice place with great people and 13% growth in their economy, best in the country!

 

[asgcpa]

Well you all make a compelling argument and I will be delving deeper and submitting an application soon. I still just cant wrap my head around North Dakota...

Look at the bright side....It's a few hours trip up north to my homeland where the legal drinking age is 18 for good beer.....just kidding. Good luck.

 

[weilke]

I work about 60 miles south of GF.

You say you are from Florida. Buy a jacket

Seriously, get used to winter weather and travel safety. Get not only a jacket, but also thermal pants, mukluk boots, snowboarding mitts, hat and facemask for winter travel. You dont want to be the guy who freezes to death within city limits when his car stalls. Doesn't have to be fancy, surplus store stuff will do. Put snow-tires on your car (AWD/4WD is nice but not a requirement), have a block heater installed after you arrive and if you can splurge, get a Astro-Start remote-starter.

The weather is not really bad. Just imagine about any weather phenomenon you can think off and add 30mph wind. Now some people say that below 0F it is all the same. Well, they are wrong, -30 just hurts.

The town itself is not that exciting. Like any college town, they tend to get a bit full of themselves. The good thing is, you have an airport and access to planes, so the Twin Cities are doable for a weekend.

 

[jpower]

Argue away....cold isn't too bad. Bundle up, wear gloves and you are golden. Besides, lots of bright sunlight and smooth air in winter from what I recall.

You can always add more layers. There comes a point when taking off layers, however, where you must stop.

 

[JeffDG]

I grew up in Winnipeg, Canada. No biggie about weather. You get used to it. Better than sweltering in humidity in the summer.

Grew up in Saskatchewan, now live in Tennessee...I concur 100% with all of that.

 

[JeffDG]

Look at the bright side....It's a few hours trip up north to my homeland where the legal drinking age is 18 for good beer.....just kidding. Good luck.

Depends where you cross the border...still 19 in Estevan!

 

[JeffDG]

You can always add more layers. There comes a point when taking off layers, however, where you must stop.

For the love of God, yes, must stop!

 

[Clark1961]

Try...it's a nice place with great people and 13% growth in their economy, best in the country!

that's jus' the oil bidness and all that evil fracing! (there is no "k" in frac)

 

[bluee]

Buy some Ibex wool clothing. Ibex is great!

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Kstate (Kansas State) Salina, Kansas also has a public supported University- aviation management school with everything from A&P training and flight instruction to airport management. Unsure about the ATC training. Most tuition and books are covered by the size of a pell grant. Room and board can be paid with a minimum wage job on the side. Probably can be done with minimal loans if any.

Living in the midwest you shoudl prepare yourself for cold winters.

Good Luck

So Im starting to look at UND as a serious possibility in my future. (ATC major)

My reasons:
Public school (not private school prices)
Big Fleet of Diverse Aircraft
Large Aviation Program

What's the real scoop with the program? Actual cost? Jobs afterwards? Climate (I am a Florida boy...)?

Any information about the school really. Thanks.

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Sorry, I call BULL**** on this. You never get used to the knife piercing cold, never ever.....

If you grow up with it you might learn that you have to tolerate it but if not, I do not believe you ever get used to it.

Maybe you get used to 20-30 degrees but not -20-50 wind chill

I grew up in Winnipeg, Canada. No biggie about weather. You get used to it. Better than sweltering in humidity in the summer.

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Well you all make a compelling argument and I will be delving deeper and submitting an application soon. I still just cant wrap my head around North Dakota...

Make your campus visit in January or February then you can be sure of the worst of it. If it aint that bad then go for it.

 

[AggieMike88]

Whenever I'm up that way all I hear is people who can't speak English on the radio and in the pattern. I think they have a lot of foreign students up there

Stop by KDTO sometime

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Hear the Indian accents in Tamiami, FL or the Chinese in Deer Valley, AZ

 

[asgcpa]

Depends where you cross the border...still 19 in Estevan!

Not to offend my American friends, but, having grown up in Canada we used to have a joke.....

Q: What does American Beer and a fisherman have in common?

A: They are both pretty damm close to water.

Last I checked, drinking age in Manitoba was 18....may be wrong now.

 

[asgcpa]

Sorry, I call BULL**** on this. You never get used to the knife piercing cold, never ever.....

If you grow up with it you might learn that you have to tolerate it but if not, I do not believe you ever get used to it.

Maybe you get used to 20-30 degrees but not -20-50 wind chill

Sorry Tony, having grown up there I was used to it. Played hockey on outdoor rinks in that type of weather.....yeah I know, frostbite on the feet.

 

[JeffDG]

Not to offend my American friends, but, having grown up in Canada we used to have a joke.....

Q: What does American Beer and a fisherman have in common?

A: They are both pretty damm close to water.

Last I checked, drinking age in Manitoba was 18....may be wrong now.

Estevan's still in Saskatchewan last I checked.

 

[JeffDG]

Sorry Tony, having grown up there I was used to it. Played hockey on outdoor rinks in that type of weather.....yeah I know, frostbite on the feet.

Concur.

You can dress for cold. At a certain point, you cannot continue to remove layers for heat.

Spent many a cold morning at -40 going out to feed the cows, or out on the ice playing hockey.

One thing I remember...no matter how cold it got, I never wore gloves when I was a referee in hockey games...constant motion kept your fingers nice and warm.

 

[hindsight2020]

The fact that DYING from exposure within city limits by mere benign under-preparation is a realistic possibility, tells you all you need to know about the "subjective" merit of comparing a ND winter to the humidity and temperatures of the Southeast US. Which is to say, they're not even close to being equally apart from the ideal datum point. I'm from Puerto Rico, went to school all over the Southeast and Midwest US. Which is to say I know where your climate acclimation baseline sits currently. I'm telling you, you're gonna hate going to college in North Dakota. Just like I hated Indiana between November and March.

An Indiana winter is a nuisance, a Kansas winter is a nuisance, hell even a Michigan winter is a nuisance. a North Dakota half-year can kill you. I'm not trying to equate the indignity of living in North dakota in the winter as that of getting terminal cancer, but to suggest it's just as harmless as an aggregate 90deg/90%h southeastern summer is just crazy. You can get an ATC education anywhere warmer dude. Embry is not your only outlet in Florida in order to do this.

Good luck!

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Sorry Tony, having grown up there I was used to it. Played hockey on outdoor rinks in that type of weather.....yeah I know, frostbite on the feet.

God Bless you! I love Canada and I love to visit Canada, no doubt the best part of America in many ways...... I am a weenie when it comes to frigid temps.

My Mediterranean DNA finds it easier to deal with 113 d F temperatures than with 13 d F days.

Although once in a while, a very cold winter in Kansas, brings -20 wind chills for 10 days at a time, I just Snowbird to Palm Springs or Miami or stay inside the house for the week and hibernate. I hated college when I had to get up every day regardless of wx and go to class.

I also find the very humid heat in the Houston area summers very, very uncomfortable but I do not find that it matchs the piercing pain of very cold.

 

[weilke]

Whenever I'm up that way all I hear is people who can't speak English on the radio and in the pattern. I think they have a lot of foreign students up there

Those nonacademic contract students from china and southeast asia provide the multiengine 'dual given' time for the UND flight instructors. Most of the flight time, they have a babysitter on board who can pipe up after the third misunderstood communication.
One of the overseas kids flipped a 172 off the end of the 5500ft runway in Park Rapids. Nobody had noticed the crash, banged up as he was, he walked into the FBO after the mile foot-treck along the runway. Between the flight suit, the scratched up face and his limited english, the FBO took a while to piece together that it wasn't an alien zombie invasion but a plane crash.