TSA Visits Flight Schools?

gprellwitz said:
Well, I remember a couple of years ago we got a gate assignment from Air New Zealand for our 172. We parked next to a 747 and walked into the terminal from the ramp side. The attendant was a little surprised, wondering where we came from! No problems, though. The plane owner just told security that he'd be coming back out in a few minutes to his plane! Of course, this was in New Zealand, but still post-9/11 at an international terminal.
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Doh! Until the last sentence, I thought you were talking about ORD. :hairraise:
 
ElPaso Pilot said:
Failure to comply with Security Directive $7,500-$11,000
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Hmmm...Is this referring to the SECRET security directives? Do I detect a due process violation here?

It might be good to familiarize yourself with the official procedures approved at your airport - guessing can get a bit expensive for all involved.
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Seems to me that there would be a lot fewer fines if these procedures were both PUBLISHED and POSTED. In fact, I think publishing them in the Airport/Facility Directory should be mandatory. I also think they should be part of every standard briefing when an airport is involved that has such procedures. The current situation is just plain nuts.
 
gprellwitz said:
Actually, now that I think of it, I don't remember the red paint coming up on any FAA exams. Is that covered in any FAA materials? How are pilots expected to know the meaning of the red paint? Is there signage visible from the ramp explaining the meaning?
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In general, if you approach a SIDA from the airside at a smaller airport, there's signage of some sort, maybe painted on the border itself. And they usually do an alternating red/white chevron pattern so it does catch your eye.
 
Palmpilot said:
Hmmm...Is this referring to the SECRET security directives? Do I detect a due process violation here?
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heh, heh.

TMetzinger said:
In general, if you approach a SIDA from the airside at a smaller airport, there's signage of some sort, maybe painted on the border itself. And they usually do an alternating red/white chevron pattern so it does catch your eye.
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Those are the easy ones. The "transient in for service walked unescorted out of the mechanic's shop and onto the ramp without a badge or escort and got himself and the shop busted by the TSA for a local security program escort violation" with a potential 5 figure fine are the tougher ones to ferret out.

Palmpilot said:
The current situation is just plain nuts.
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I couldn't agree more.
 
The term "Police State" comes to mind. :(

I hope when the check me that my papers are in order. Especially now that they are doing highway, and street corner scans, in addition to their GA airport checks.
 
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Ron Levy said:
Yes, some TSA personnel are sworn Federal LEO's with badges, guns, handcuffs, and the power of arrest.
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While true, their role is such that the public including pilots are not likely to ever encounter them - or know that they encountered them. Aside from air marshals, the role of the LEOs is to investigate their own employees or waste fraud and abuse, not regulatory compliance.

Edit please don't make me regret posting this.
 
alaskaflyer said:
While true, their role is such that the public including pilots are not likely to ever encounter them - or know that they encountered them. Aside from air marshals, the role of the LEOs is to investigate their own employees or waste fraud and abuse, not regulatory compliance.

Edit please don't make me regret posting this.
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And like any other Federal agent, they've gone through FLETC or their agency's equivalent, and thats a whole order of magnitude or two in professionalism above the training the screeners get.

There are asshats in every profession, but the training and standards of conduct for federal gun-toters is pretty high across the board.
 
Jeanie said:
Hi Dave,

Yes, a nice woman named Laura came by to visit with George Vose and me regarding student records. She was helpful and pleasant. She's out of El Paso. She visited with Burt in Marfa too.
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I thought glider training was exempt from the 'I am a citizen.' Proof/endorsement bit?
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
My weekend airport manager hugged me on Sunday at the gas pump and warned me of gusts, gave me "wings" for my flight bag when I got my PPL, has my phone number in his phone for flour bombings, and is overall the nicest guy ever.
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He's a great guy. Always with a big "Hi! How are you?" and is generally tickled that you get to go flying that day. I found out recently our kids go to the same school.
 
ElPaso Pilot said:
Those are the easy ones. The "transient in for service walked unescorted out of the mechanic's shop and onto the ramp without a badge or escort and got himself and the shop busted by the TSA for a local security program escort violation" with a potential 5 figure fine are the tougher ones to ferret out.
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Regarding the alleged busting of pilots, does anyone know if this is actually happening, and if so, is there some way for a pilot to find out ahead of time what behavior is forbidden at any particular airport?
 
I am sorry, but if there can be a more compelling illustration that these brainless bureaucrats are completely out of control than the TSA querying Burt Compton at KMRF, I cannot possibly imagine what it might be.
 
Palmpilot said:
Regarding the alleged busting of pilots, does anyone know if this is actually happening, and if so, is there some way for a pilot to find out ahead of time what behavior is forbidden at any particular airport?
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Here's a few minutes on google.


http://www.studentpilot.com/interac...-security-measures-for-GA&p=435768#post435768
My Columbia is based at BWI at a Signature t-hanger these days. I've found them pretty easy to get along with for the most part. When they crack down it's usually because they know that an MAA or TSA "official" is watching from somewhere on the ramp. They've actually been subjected to $10,000 fines in the past for being caught leaving an unbadged person on the ramp unattended. It's rumored that they got hit with that fine once because an unbadged person who was based there in a t-hanger walked back in to the FBO instead of calling them for an escort/shuttle back in.

Wes
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http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2178967/posts
This is an email I sent out regarding an experience I had today at my flight school. TSA is the Transportation Security Administration; an arm of the gov formed after Sept 11, 2001....

Coming in to work at 7:30am this morning I noticed a guy at the top of the stairs wearing a knit shirt with TSA on the front, trying to open a door that requires a swiped ID badge to enter.

I asked if I could help him. He said that he was with TSA and needed to inspect our flight training records. I said that he needs to follow me to get an ID badge at reception like everyone else, and informed him that it's because of TSA that we have a badge system in the first place. This seemed to irritate him. So he signed the book and got a badge. I then said, now that you have a badge, I need to escort you; who would you like to see? He mentioned the name of our TSA contact at the school. I informed him that he won't show up until 8:30am (1 hour from then). So he said, "OK" and mentioned that he would come back later.

A couple of minutes went by and I noticed him questioning a couple of our students and writing something in a note pad, (He said he was going to leave). As I walked up to him, I heard him say, "How long have you been at the school?" to one of the students. I asked to see his ID. He asked me why. I told him because you were questioning our students about their flight training. He said, "I wasn't questioning them." I said that I heard him ask that question, and that "just because you're wearing a TSA shirt and carrying a folder that says TSA, it doesn't mean you're with TSA. These students are wearing badges, I'm wearing my flight instructor badge, and yet you have no badge showing." He then pulled out his wallet, muttering, "Fine!" and showed me some gold badge with a laminated ID. I have no idea what a proper TSA badge is supposed to look like. I said that I wanted to make a copy of it for our records. He said that I couldn't do that. I started writing down his badge info when he gave me a business card with his name and title and a phone number.

I went away to call the number and he stormed off to his car. The number just went to a voicemail that said his name and "to leave a message"; nothing about TSA. I was expecting some official office answering service or something along those lines. So I asked another worker to look up TSA on the web to try to verify this guy's identity. Anyways....

When I was done teaching my class at 10:30am, I spoke to our company TSA contact who asked what the hell I did to that guy (turns out he was the district manager of TSA Inspectors, out of Jacksonville). He mentioned that the guy needed some calming down when he came back and threatened to call the FBI. I smiled at that news, as did our contact. My boss told me that I did exactly the right thing (I already knew that).

The TSA is a boil on the [rear] of the aviation community. We were recently fined $10k for not restricting access to some undercover TSA lady: that's fine. She was right to check ramp access. What she did not have the right to do was verbally assault the guy that let her out in front of our students, then lecture management in rants and raves. They appear now and again, asking questions, always finding something that should be 'more secure' or some practice that was not 'security conscious', etc; in short, trying to justify their positions.
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http://pressrepublican.com/0100_new...e-fines-for-airport-security-violations/print
Violations at Plattsburgh airport included unlocked security gates

By JOE LoTEMPLIO
PLATTSBURGH — Clinton County could be looking at numerous fines from the federal Transportation Security Administration for violations at Plattsburgh International Airport.

The fines could total up to $260,000 and stem from infractions from more than a year ago.

But county officials have been working with TSA in hopes of rectifying the situation without big costs.

"We continue to work with TSA in hopes of resolving the situation in an agreeable manner," County Deputy Administrator Rodney Brown said.

The county has yet to pay anything in fines, and Brown said they hope it stays that way.

TSA has implemented many safety and security standards at airports across the country since the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.

An agent periodically drops in to assess security at the airport, and if violations are noticed, the county is written up.

The daily TSA staff stationed at the airport also report violations.

All employees working in secure areas of the airport must pass a test to receive official credentials that they must wear around their neck at all times.

County Administrator Michael Zurlo said some of the violations the county has been guilty of have been as minor as someone's badge turning over in the wind so their identification picture cannot be seen.

Other violations include unlocked gates, improperly filled out files and not following the airport-security plan.

Zurlo said some of the problems have occurred because of tenants at the airport and not county employees.

As a result, all gate keys were taken from tenants, and county officials must now escort tenants who want to utilize a gate.
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http://www.gjsentinel.com/breaking/articles/security_measure_upsets_airpor

http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/TSA_Locks_Out_Punta_Gorda_Pilots_201640-1.html
As the Transportation Security Administration continues to eye GA as a security threat, it locked out a group of owners from a through-the-fence arrangement at Florida's Punta Gorda Airport, south of Sarasota. Pilot Larry Hofmeister told us Friday that a group of owners with hangars on private property adjacent to the airport had a good working arrangement that allowed them to taxi from their hangars to a gate into the airport, which they could open by remote control. This week, the TSA halted that arrangement, claiming that it represents a security threat.

Now, to access the airport, the owners have to notify the FBO, which will send a lineman to open the gate on a time-permitting basis. Hofmeister told us the hangars have their own fenced-in area which itself requires a security card to access, so access to the runway is controlled by not one, but two gates. The TSA apparently took the action because it was unhappy with a pilot who taxied away from the access gate before it was closed. TSA didn't immediately return our call seeking additional information.
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Other tidbits:

http://www.flyprescott.com/challengestatement.html

http://www.generalaviationnews.com/2009/02/04/tsa-conducts-‘inappropriate’-screenings-at-fbos/
 
Good grief. I'm glad that I live here and I think if I had to deal with crap like that at my flight school I'd take up motorcycles or scuba diving or knitting.....
 
Palmpilot said:
Regarding the alleged busting of pilots, does anyone know if this is actually happening, and if so, is there some way for a pilot to find out ahead of time what behavior is forbidden at any particular airport?
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They could tell you, but then they'd have to kill you.
 
ElPaso Pilot said:
Here's a few minutes on google...
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Those appear to be cases of airport businesses and/or airport operators being fined, which I was already aware of. I was asking if pilots are getting fined, which is of concern to me because I'm not aware of any system for informing transient pilots of the requirements prior to arrival.
 
Palmpilot said:
Those appear to be cases of airport businesses and/or airport operators being fined, which I was already aware of. I was asking if pilots are getting fined, which is of concern to me because I'm not aware of any system for informing transient pilots of the requirements prior to arrival.
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Misread your post. As far as I have seen, it's been the private airport businesses that suffer, hence the occasional paranoia about escorts one sees at some airports.

I'd still hate to be the cause of a large fine to a mom & pop.

$ignature ... maybe not so much. ;)
 
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If the TSA lady verbally assaulted me, and my FBO employees, and ranted, and raved like in the above example, I would have called the police. Then filed a written complaint to the TSA documenting the misconduct, with a copy going to my elected Federal representatives.
 
Keeping passengers together when on the ramp is like herding cats. Sometimes they straggle to and from the airplane from the FBO. I have not had even once instance of them being questioned by the TSA. Sometimes the FBO doesn't like it too much but that is more because they are a hazard to themselves if airplanes are moving around. I'm not sure how this post set off a wave of unwarranted paranoia. As I mentioned before, I don't even have a SIDA badge.
 
There are many, many examples of government overstepping their bounds when it comes to this type of "security" here in the U.S. and elsewhere, that I don't think it is paranoia at all.

If you want to be so trusting as to give up the ability to freely walk around an airport as a fully licensed pilot, than that is fine, but please don't impede my freedom to do so. If a TSA agent shows up at my hangar, I will call the police, and let them verify the credentials of the TSA person, because frankly, I don't know what their I.D. is supposed to look like, and it may be a terrorsist in disguise. You know, you can't be too carefull these days. :rolleyes:
 
Anthony said:
There are many, many examples of government overstepping their bounds when it comes to this type of "security" here in the U.S. and elsewhere, that I don't think it is paranoia at all.

If you want to be so trusting as to give up the ability to freely walk around an airport as a fully licensed pilot, than that is fine, but please don't impede my freedom to do so. If a TSA agent shows up at my hangar, I will call the police, and let them verify the credentials of the TSA person, because frankly, I don't know what their I.D. is supposed to look like, and it may be a terrorsist in disguise. You know, you can't be too carefull these days. :rolleyes:
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All I'm saying is that I've never had problems getting access to the ramp other than onto the airline sterile area and I have been on countless ramps many at airports with airline service. Have you had any problem?
 
Everskyward said:
All I'm saying is that I've never had problems getting access to the ramp other than onto the airline sterile area and I have been on countless ramps many at airports with airline service. Have you had any problem?
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I understand where you are coming from, but just because neither you nor I have had any "problems" on a GA ramp from the TSA, doesn't means it isn't happening.

Recently, on a business trip, driving in NJ, I was pulled over at a mandatory, state police check point supposedly to check for NJ state inspections. I am not an NJ resident, but yet they could pull me over, and detain me without probably cause. Next to the state police inspection van was a TSA van who was "augmenting" their procedures. Once I explained I was an out of state resident, and showed my out of state license and registration, they let me go. I was almost late for my meeting. It is something right out of the Gestapo/STASI/KGB playbook, and it is currently gaining scope in the U.S.
 
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gprellwitz said:
Actually, now that I think of it, I don't remember the red paint coming up on any FAA exams. Is that covered in any FAA materials? How are pilots expected to know the meaning of the red paint? Is there signage visible from the ramp explaining the meaning?
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Usually, there is a sign that indicates that the area is a secured area and cannot be entered without authorization. Sometimes, like at KSAF, the words "TSA SECURED AREA" are painted on the red line as well.

But there's no need for it to be on the FAA exam, because I don't believe its enforceable anyway. What can a non LE do to you for crossing? They can't detain you, and I'm pretty sure the FAA can't violate you for it.

Just sayin'.
 
SkyHog said:
Usually, there is a sign that indicates that the area is a secured area and cannot be entered without authorization. Sometimes, like at KSAF, the words "TSA SECURED AREA" are painted on the red line as well.

But there's no need for it to be on the FAA exam, because I don't believe its enforceable anyway. What can a non LE do to you for crossing? They can't detain you, and I'm pretty sure the FAA can't violate you for it.

Just sayin'.
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Thats not really true...

I have a GA badge here at JAC and with the issuence of that to me I was instructed to challange anyone not properly ID'ed, The "blue shirts" can detain anyone they feel is a threat and I am pretty sure none of them are Sworn LE officers. Just hang around a GA aiport with commercial flights for a day or so and watch how the entire dog and pony show really works...:(:(:(:redface:... I don't like it but I love my plane and I want 24/7 access to it.

Ben.
 
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SkyHog said:
Usually, there is a sign that indicates that the area is a secured area and cannot be entered without authorization. Sometimes, like at KSAF, the words "TSA SECURED AREA" are painted on the red line as well.

But there's no need for it to be on the FAA exam, because I don't believe its enforceable anyway. What can a non LE do to you for crossing? They can't detain you, and I'm pretty sure the FAA can't violate you for it.

Just sayin'.
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Detain, no. Fine, yes.

Read up on the TSA's administrative fine procedure.

I posted the link earlier.
 
N801BH said:
Thats not really true...

I have a GA badge here at JAC and with the issuence of that to me I was instructed to challange anyone not properly ID'ed, The "blue shirts" can detain anyone they feel is a threat and I am pretty sure none of them are Sworn LE officers. Just hang around a GA aiport with commercial flights for a day or so and watch how the entire dog and pony show really works...:(:(:(:redface:... I don't like it but I love my plane and I want 24/7 access to it.

Ben.
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How does an unarmed man without authority detain you? I wouldn't allow myself to be detained anymore that I'd allow someone in the streets to detain me.

And that's not internet tough talk, that's self-preservation.
 
Anthony said:
There are many, many examples of government overstepping their bounds when it comes to this type of "security" here in the U.S. and elsewhere, that I don't think it is paranoia at all.

If you want to be so trusting as to give up the ability to freely walk around an airport as a fully licensed pilot, than that is fine, but please don't impede my freedom to do so. If a TSA agent shows up at my hangar, I will call the police, and let them verify the credentials of the TSA person, because frankly, I don't know what their I.D. is supposed to look like, and it may be a terrorsist in disguise. You know, you can't be too carefull these days. :rolleyes:
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But, what if there were another January 5 style attack? Could the country recover from that?

Oh, wait, there was. Scratch that.

And, in both cases, if the TSA security stuff had been in place, both pilots would have been wearing their badges when they flew into the buildings.

Whatever it takes to keep us safe. That's what needs to be done.

[/scarcasm]
 
SkyHog said:
OK - at KSAF, who gets the fine? American Airlines? I think I'm ok with that.
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Well, Section VI.3 below says it could be you, if you cross the painted red line, or don't show the little TSA man your airman certificate if requested, or anything else they deem a violation that may or may not be listed. :rolleyes:

http://www.tsa.gov/assets/pdf/enforcement_sanction_guidance_policy.pdf
3. Other Security Violations by Individuals or Persons*

A. Attempt to circumvent a security system, measure, or procedure by the artful concealment of a non-explosive liquid, aerosol, or gel (other than those permitted) $100-$200

B. Interference with screening

i. Including physical contact $1,500-$5,000
ii. Non-physical interference $500-$1,500
iii. False threats $1,000-$2,000​

C. Entering sterile area without submitting to screening $1,000-$3,000

D. Tampering or interfering with, compromising, modifying, attempting to circumvent, or causing a person to tamper or interfere with, compromise, modify or attempt to circumvent any security system, measure, or procedure. Includes the artful concealment of prohibited items (except for those prohibited items covered by section III.A., above) $1,500-$6,000

E. Entering or being present within a secured area, AOA, SIDA, or sterile area without complying with the systems, measures, or procedures being applied to control access to, or presence or movement in, such areas $500-$3,000

F. Improper use of airport access medium $500-$3,000

G. Fraud and intentional falsification $2,500-$6,000 +Criminal Referral

H. Failure to allow inspection of airman certificate, authorization, FAA license $1,000-$3,000​


*Violations not listed above are subject to the regulatory civil penalty maximum of $11,000.
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Anthony said:
If the TSA lady verbally assaulted me, and my FBO employees, and ranted, and raved like in the above example, I would have called the police. Then filed a written complaint to the TSA documenting the misconduct, with a copy going to my elected Federal representatives.
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Ditto

Anthony said:
There are many, many examples of government overstepping their bounds when it comes to this type of "security" here in the U.S. and elsewhere, that I don't think it is paranoia at all.

If you want to be so trusting as to give up the ability to freely walk around an airport as a fully licensed pilot, than that is fine, but please don't impede my freedom to do so. If a TSA agent shows up at my hangar, I will call the police, and let them verify the credentials of the TSA person, because frankly, I don't know what their I.D. is supposed to look like, and it may be a terrorsist in disguise. You know, you can't be too carefull these days. :rolleyes:
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I have no idea what their ID looks like, so they'd get to convince the local law that they are legitimate. I have no use for the TSA, anywhere.
 
Sam D said:
He's a great guy. Always with a big "Hi! How are you?" and is generally tickled that you get to go flying that day. I found out recently our kids go to the same school.
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Thanks, Sam, I agree, he is the greatest.
 
N801BH said:
..I was instructed to challange anyone not properly ID'ed...
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If anyone wants me to "challenge" potential terrorists, they're going to have to issue me a weapon and give me training on how and when to use it.
 
ElPaso Pilot said:
Well, Section VI.3 below says it could be you, if you cross the painted red line, or don't show the little TSA man your airman certificate if requested, or anything else they deem a violation that may or may not be listed. :rolleyes:
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"E. Entering or being present within a secured area, AOA, SIDA, or sterile area without complying with the systems, measures, or procedures being applied to control access to, or presence or movement in, such areas $500-$3,000"

This is the part that bugs me. I know that "ignorance of the law is no excuse," but with most laws you can look them up, typically online these days. How and where can a transient pilot look up "the systems, measures, or procedures being applied to control access to, or presence or movement in, such areas"? That's why I think there's a serious due process issue.

As for fines for airport businesses, etc., I think it would be in their own best interest to do everything they can to inform both transient and locally based pilots of the rules ahead of time.

I think these rules need to be in the Airport/Facility Directory, preflight briefings, a central online database for every airport that has them, and posted at appropriate places at the airports involved. Otherwise, it's just a game of "gotcha." The fact that the rules are not being strictly enforced is all well and good, but the fact that they are on the books means that they could be enforced at any time.
 
SkyHog said:
How does an unarmed man without authority detain you? I wouldn't allow myself to be detained anymore that I'd allow someone in the streets to detain me.

And that's not internet tough talk, that's self-preservation.
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I said challange,,, I didn't say I had to detain....

The joke around here is the defination of "challange"...

I view it as saying " hey partner, can I help you with anything".. if they say naw, I am just headed to my plane, then I make some small talk while they head to their plane . Technically I am escorting them but adding a little chit chat makes it seem like a simple conversation... The truth is, if some towelhead is already on the airport with a mission to jihad there is a 99.9992 chance he will kill me anyway with a knife, gun, bomb,, you name it... Remember they can carry weapons,,,, we can't...:nonod::mad:
 
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Palmpilot said:
"E. Entering or being present within a secured area, AOA, SIDA, or sterile area without complying with the systems, measures, or procedures being applied to control access to, or presence or movement in, such areas $500-$3,000"

This is the part that bugs me. I know that "ignorance of the law is no excuse," but with most laws you can look them up, typically online these days. How and where can a transient pilot look up "the systems, measures, or procedures being applied to control access to, or presence or movement in, such areas"? That's why I think there's a serious due process issue.

As for fines for airport businesses, etc., I think it would be in their own best interest to do everything they can to inform both transient and locally based pilots of the rules ahead of time.

I think these rules need to be in the Airport/Facility Directory, preflight briefings, a central online database for every airport that has them, and posted at appropriate places at the airports involved. Otherwise, it's just a game of "gotcha." The fact that the rules are not being strictly enforced is all well and good, but the fact that they are on the books means that they could be enforced at any time.
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You're preaching to the crowd, buddy!

You want to get even more wound up? Read this: http://www.tsa.gov/assets/pdf/airport_security_design_guidelines.pdf -- it's the thin little booklet that the TSA provides to airports to design their security plan. Look how hard the TSA makes it for the public to see what the rules are. They loves classifying their procedures as SSI (Sensitive Security Information) or "need to know", as they feel it is a security risk having the bad guys know the rules.

This is a crying shame, because it gives them the power to potentially incriminate anyone without due process or accountability. Why do you think that TSA fines and searches are administrative and/or civil?



CRIMINAL REFERRAL: Referral for criminal investigation and enforcement is appropriate where there appears to be a violation of criminal laws. Criminal penalties and fines are different and wholly separate from the civil penalties assessed by TSA. Withdrawal of criminal charges will not affect civil penalty charges, and vice versa.
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N801BH said:
A said challange,,, I didn't say I had to detain....

The joke around here is the defination of "challange"...

I view it as saying " hey partner, can I help you with anything".. if they say naw, I am just headed to my plane, then I make some small talk while they head to their plane . Technically I am escorting them but adding a little chit chat makes it seem like a simple conversation... The truth is, if some towelhead is already on the airport with a mission to jihad there is a 99.9992 chance he will kill me anyway with a knife, gun, bomb,, you name it... Remember they can carry weapons,,,, we can't...:nonod::mad:
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I think your airport bent over and exceeded the guidelines to be good little boys and girls.

ID challenge procedures are recommended for the SIDA and sterile areas, not the AOA (Airport Operations Area.)

http://www.tsa.gov/assets/pdf/airport_security_design_guidelines.pdf
112a0id.jpg


Air Operations Area (AOA)
An AOA is a portion of an airport, specified in the ASP, in which the security measures specified in 49
CFR 1542 are carried out. This area includes aircraft movement areas, aircraft parking areas, loading
ramps, and safety areas, used by aircraft regulated under 49 CFR 1544 and 49 CFR 1546, and any adjacent
areas (such as general aviation areas) that are not separated by adequate security systems, measures, or
procedures. This area does not include the secured area.
The airport operator is required to control and prevent access to the AOA, control movement within the
AOA, and control unauthorized penetrations of the AOA. TSA regulations do not specify how to
accomplish this requirement but rather leave the solution to the local authorities, subject to TSA approval.


Security Identification Display Area (SIDA)
A SIDA is a portion of an airport, specified in the ASP, in which security measures specified in 49 CFR
1542 are carried out, and specifically it is an area requiring display of an authorized identification media.
Regulations do not require a SIDA to have access controls, so it cannot, by itself, be a secured area.
However, a secured area requires ID display, so it is always a SIDA. A SIDA may include other areas of
the airport. Generally, the airport operator has the responsibility to secure SIDAs and prevent or respond
immediately to access by unauthorized persons and vehicles. SIDAs may lie within AOAs.
Ordinarily, SIDA layouts should be held to the smallest manageable size to provide the level of protection
sought for the area or facility. The SIDA is the area that requires the greatest continuous procedural
attention from employees. The number of SIDA access points should be limited to the minimum necessary
for operational practicality.
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El Paso. You might consider the fact that Jackson Hole was and is the home of VP Cheney and while he was sitting VP ,security was like no other airport in the country so maybe I have seen things the rest of you guys haven't. The SS did their job perfectly and the TSA fed off the procedures... IMHO.
 
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