Tower conversation..did I mess up?

francisco collazos

francisco collazos

Pre-takeoff checklist
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So yesterday my friend an I flew to La Belle and on the way back to BKV I had an interesting conversation with the tower. Let me know what you think. Brooksville has two runways (3-21 and 9-27) I radio 10 miles out that we were south east of the field. OK he gave us a right midfield entry for runway 9. About the same time another plane radioed about 10 mi south. The tower had him maneuver for a right base to runway 3. My friend let me know that the other plane and mine were tracking for an intercept and I ended up doing a 360 and let the tower know I was doing that. Well the tower guy said we would we do that since the runways don't cross. I didn't say anything because to be honest I was flying the plane and didn't have the time to explain to him that our paths would cross. The only thing I can think of is that he thought we were more south than south east. I think I should have said East-south east. I also think he gave us 9 because its closer to our hanger vs the other guy.
Any ideas? Seems like I get comments quite frequently from the tower
 
Assuming both aircraft were at the same altitude and ground speed, I would have slowed and turned right 10° north to allow the other aircraft to pass. At arrival at BKV with 3 mid field entering the rt downwind 9, the other aircraft would be on your left and lower on final to 3.
 
francisco collazos said:
So yesterday my friend an I flew to La Belle and on the way back to BKV I had an interesting conversation with the tower. Let me know what you think. Brooksville has two runways (3-21 and 9-27) I radio 10 miles out that we were south east of the field. OK he gave us a right midfield entry for runway 9. About the same time another plane radioed about 10 mi south. The tower had him maneuver for a right base to runway 3. My friend let me know that the other plane and mine were tracking for an intercept and I ended up doing a 360 and let the tower know I was doing that. Well the tower guy said we would we do that since the runways don't cross. I didn't say anything because to be honest I was flying the plane and didn't have the time to explain to him that our paths would cross. The only thing I can think of is that he thought we were more south than south east. I think I should have said East-south east. I also think he gave us 9 because its closer to our hanger vs the other guy.
Any ideas? Seems like I get comments quite frequently from the tower
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Sounds like he thought you were concerned that you and the other plane would be landing at the same time on intersecting runways. Only thing I can think of that would account for him saying “…we do that since the runways don't cross...”
 
luvflyin said:
Sounds like he thought you were concerned that you and the other plane would be landing at the same time on intersecting runways. Only thing I can think of that would account for him saying “…we do that since the runways don't cross...”
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Well that actually makes sense....For sure we would have been close to intersecting in the air if I hadn't seen him on ADS-b.
 
At ten miles out, you're far from downwind and still well outside the D. I'd do whatever maneuvering you need to, and you don't even really have to tell tower unless you want to or are concerned about other traffic. And if you're ten miles SSE and the other guy's ten miles S, you're miles away from each other (someone else can do the math). I probably wouldn't waste the time doing a 360 if you could have maneuvered to enter downwind without passing south of rwy 3.

But above all, you're PIC do what works for you.
 
Lindberg said:
. I probably wouldn't waste the time doing a 360 if you could have maneuvered to enter downwind without passing south of rwy 3.

But above all, you're PIC do what works for you.
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Good point.. I think i do that as a courtesy so that the tower isn't looking and wondering why is a plane flying a circle. I also think that I don't want to change it up that much because I feel that the tower is expecting me to act a certain way. I would have made more sense to land us on 3 but I see why he landed us on 9
 
Lindberg said:
At ten miles out, you're far from downwind and still well outside the D. I'd do whatever maneuvering you need to, and you don't even really have to tell tower unless you want to or are concerned about other traffic. And if you're ten miles SSE and the other guy's ten miles S, you're miles away from each other (someone else can do the math). I probably wouldn't waste the time doing a 360 if you could have maneuvered to enter downwind without passing south of rwy 3.

But above all, you're PIC do what works for you.
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Same answer if you're in the Class D airspace. VFR pilots are responsible for separation. Maybe a hair less responsible if you're getting radar vectors, but still responsible. The OP could have asked the Tower for clarification on the runway assignments and expectations regarding pattern entry between his plane and the other one. But if you think Tower has you on a collision course, don't just keep flying straight ahead to the collision. Talk, think, decide, and do whatever you need to do to stay safe.
 
NoBShere said:
Pilot's version of "when in doubt, throttle out"
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Throttle out? I’d throttle in!!

So there I was… my daughters first take off… at rotation speed I said (gently), “pull”. She gently pulled the THROTTLE!

Hmmm…. The most previous thing she had heard from me was “push” (as in throttle up…) so it stood to reason, I roared a hearty laugh, pushed it in and said I meant the yoke! Wups… bad brief by dad.

Back to your regularly scheduled thread.
 
francisco collazos said:
Good point.. I think i do that as a courtesy so that the tower isn't looking and wondering why is a plane flying a circle. I also think that I don't want to change it up that much because I feel that the tower is expecting me to act a certain way. I would have made more sense to land us on 3 but I see why he landed us on 9
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This is what I'm picturing.
 

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Tools said:
Throttle out? I’d throttle in!!

So there I was… my daughters first take off… at rotation speed I said (gently), “pull”. She gently pulled the THROTTLE!

Hmmm…. The most previous thing she had heard from me was “push” (as in throttle up…) so it stood to reason, I roared a hearty laugh, pushed it in and said I meant the yoke! Wups… bad brief by dad.

Back to your regularly scheduled thread.
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Just so you know, you're not the only one. Me and a first timer had that exact conversation.:rolleyes:
 
Tools said:
So there I was… my daughters first take off… at rotation speed I said (gently), “pull”. She gently pulled the THROTTLE!

Hmmm…. The most previous thing she had heard from me was “push” (as in throttle up…) so it stood to reason, I roared a hearty laugh, pushed it in and said I meant the yoke! Wups… bad brief by dad.
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So, uh, how you makin' out with that flight school thing, Tools?
;)
 
francisco collazos said:
OK so I usually make my midfield downwind more like this...
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My mama told me that the shortest distance between two points is a straight line.;)

So I guess the answer to your original question is, two airplanes were inbound to land, tower have you both instructions that would not create a conflict, and then you turned onto a collision course with the other aircraft. I don't know if I'd call that messing up, since you had a plan, but it likely wasn't what anyone outside of your aircraft was expecting.
 
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Well now i'm thinking..I mean if he says enter and call midfield downwind that is typically what I do vs the first picture that is more "enter a downwind" right? Or am I too literal? I have always entered the midfield downwind from a 45 at the midfield.
 
francisco collazos said:
Well now i'm thinking..I mean if he says enter and call midfield downwind that is typically what I do vs the first picture that is more "enter a downwind" right? Or am I too literal? I have always entered the midfield downwind from a 45 at the midfield.
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When they say report midfield downwind, you fly from your current position to downwind, then call the tower again when you are midfield, not via a 5 mile detour to fly a 45.
 
EdFred said:
When they say report midfield downwind, you fly from your current position to downwind, then call the tower again when you are midfield, not via a 5 mile detour to fly a 45.
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See ...learn new things every day!! Thanks because I think this is really at the heart of the issue and would have never really thought about it. I tend to be more of a "procedural" flyer. So much in aviation is experience that you just have to learn while doing..
 
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