Top Tier Tax Solution

[Henning]

It's a perpetual motion machine.........

Same as our current system. All economies only work on belief, there is nothing substantive to 'markets', money only works because people believe it does and we use it as a societal promise. That faith in the future is what makes for the perpetual motion.

 

[Henning]

Remind me where we're gonna get all of the energy to bust loose that many H2 molecules.

Right now natural gas and nuclear, plus growing wind production and solar... Any way you want to produce the electricity is fine. It will take several years of consumer product production before we would really have to add any infrastructure capacity as we can store the unused electricity that keeps the grid up and charged during off peak time, plus we can also run those plants at their most efficient capacity full time. Then there are the renewable resources that we waste away in much the same fashion, especially wind. What the beauty is it matches the best efficiency of the generation system and lets you store electricity for demand consumption, like a battery with no charging time that gives you back hot water as you use electricity.

There is a reason everything in the universe is made from hydrogen.

 

[PaulS]

Same as our current system. All economies only work on belief, there is nothing substantive to 'markets', money only works because people believe it does and we use it as a societal promise. That faith in the future is what makes for the perpetual motion.

Energy density, ease of manufacture and economic viability make the world run from an energy standpoint. Trying to force that through legislation will never work and will destroy jobs and economies. Just saying something is so doesn't make it work.

As an example, barring any huge technological breakthroughs in wind and solar, if the tax credit and green credits were abandoned today, the systems in place now would disappear in 10 to 20 years, they are not viable without huge subsidies from tax and rate payers.

 

[Gerhardt]

Energy density, ease of manufacture and economic viability make the world run from an energy standpoint. Trying to force that through legislation will never work and will destroy jobs and economies. Just saying something is so doesn't make it work.

As an example, barring any huge technological breakthroughs in wind and solar, if the tax credit and green credits were abandoned today, the systems in place now would disappear in 10 to 20 years, they are not viable without huge subsidies from tax and rate payers.

Oil isn't what you'd call a renewable resource. Wait until it really gets scarce. We have to encourage a change of energy sources somehow. Maybe huge price spikes are the way to do it?

 

[Henning]

Right now we waste on order of 80% of the energy value of our oil between production and consumption inefficies. Energy density is really only required in aircraft at this point, and that can be phased into straight up algae biofuels reusing much of the same infrastructure to refine into JetA. The Navy is putting out huge contracts for it, so is Richard Branson to fuel Virgin.

Jay Leno is driving around in a H2 fuel cell vehicle, so are more in LA, pity they just throw away the water. The auto manufacturers still aren't thinking multi tiered efficiency, the water should be condensed and collected for either re-electrolisizing or home consumption.

We can no longer afford to look at this as a 'what is the cheapest way to get energy' problem any longer. We have to look at 'what is the best way to get energy and water for a population that nature cannot support under our current slash and burn market system.

Money will have no value when the water runs out, the food dies, and we don't have the energy left or the infrastructure to produce the volumes of fresh water required. Lets see you eat all the cash and gold you saved.

 

[PaulS]

Right now we waste on order of 80% of the energy value of our oil between production and consumption inefficies. Energy density is really only required in aircraft at this point, and that can be phased into straight up algae biofuels reusing much of the same infrastructure to refine into JetA. The Navy is putting out huge contracts for it, so is Richard Branson to fuel Virgin.

Jay Leno is driving around in a H2 fuel cell vehicle, so are more in LA, pity they just throw away the water. The auto manufacturers still aren't thinking multi tiered efficiency, the water should be condensed and collected for either re-electrolisizing or home consumption.

We can no longer afford to look at this as a 'what is the cheapest way to get energy' problem any longer. We have to look at 'what is the best way to get energy and water for a population that nature cannot support under our current slash and burn market system.

Money will have no value when the water runs out, the food dies, and we don't have the energy left or the infrastructure to produce the volumes of fresh water required. Lets see you eat all the cash and gold you saved.

The inefficiencies is oil use are a function of physics and thermodynamics., not some corporate scandal. It's getting better, but there is still plenty of room for improvement.

Part of the problem here is the many of us have become googlized. We have a question, we type into the magic box and our answer is there within seconds. We start to think all problems are solved in 0.5 seconds, or worse, that throwing money at a particular idea will make it work. That doesn't work with these problems, if it did, Solyndra would have produced a solar cell and storage tech that would run a car with a rooftop cell.

Once again, I think battery technology will end our use of oil as a personal transport fuel, I'm hoping I see it in my lifetime. Unless someone solves some the technical issues with hydrogen, Jay Leno will be one of the only few who will be able to afford to tool around using it in a personal vehicle.