The Return of Go Fly America

[EdFred]

Uh, yeah it is. All 5010 data is publicly available.

 

[gkainz]

Woo Hoo Hoo! I even remembered my password. I'm ready.

My goal--50 new-to-me airports in the next 12 months. Come here little airport!

Thanks, Nick

I remembered mine, too! Whoo hooo! Either means my memory doesn't suck as bad as I thought, or my password was too easy!

Admirable goal, Barb - I like it! I've scoped a few around here that I am going to target. I noticed you already grabbed a bunch last time around that were on my list between here (KBJC) and Custer, SD (KCUT) ...

 

[SkyHog]

Because the FAA isn't "open."

Plus the FAA doesn't use ICAO ids, and therefore doesn't have anything but the 3 digit IDs that aren't used in Hawaii or Alaska. For example, try to find on the FAA's site anywhere that Unalaska is PADU. Closest you'll get it DUT, which can be interpolated to PADU, but that isn't consistent enough to make the assumption, unfortunately.

And, their data is all in capital letters, which makes translating airport names to uword bizarre sometimes. I don't get the FAA sometimes, I really don't.

Probably still running a mainframe or something that doesn't handle lowercase characters.

 

[Everskyward]

I remembered mine, too! Whoo hooo! Either means my memory doesn't suck as bad as I thought, or my password was too easy!

My challenge was to remember the email address I used, which I don't use any more.

It's nice to see this come back, particularly because we have quite a few people around here now who weren't around back then.

 

[jason]

Plus the FAA doesn't use ICAO ids, and therefore doesn't have anything but the 3 digit IDs that aren't used in Hawaii or Alaska. For example, try to find on the FAA's site anywhere that Unalaska is PADU. Closest you'll get it DUT, which can be interpolated to PADU, but that isn't consistent enough to make the assumption, unfortunately.

And, their data is all in capital letters, which makes translating airport names to uword bizarre sometimes. I don't get the FAA sometimes, I really don't.

Probably still running a mainframe or something that doesn't handle lowercase characters.

https://nfdc.faa.gov/nfdcApps/airportLookup/airportDisplay.jsp?category=nasr&airportId=DUT

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org.../fs/alaskan/alaska/fai/locid/media/locid1.pdf

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...systemops/fs/alaskan/alaska/fai/locid/locid1/

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...an/alaska/fai/locid/locid2/index.cfm?print=go

 

[wsuffa]

Thanks for bringing this back, Nick. I'm in. With a tad bit 'o luck, I'll be able to knock one or two off next week. If it were active this weekend (as opposed to next Monday), I could probably pick up some more.

 

[TangoWhiskey]

Nick, would it be difficult to make the map view not 'zoom back out' when you click between 'available' and 'claimed'? If I zoom in to the DFW area, and it's showing 'claimed' airports with blue markers, and I then click the 'available' link in the legend box, it zooms back out to the entire world.

 

[TangoWhiskey]

Man, two of the poker run airports from this year's Gaston's would have been eligible to be claimed!

Do we need to use "OPERATION: FLY" signs going forward, or will "GO FLY AMERICA" signs work? I only ask because the Rules page (http://www.operationfly.com/rules) says " A printable sheet you can use in your photographs can be found here, but you can make your own as well", but the "claim.pdf" file linked to "here" is AWOL, 404 (not found).

 

[denverpilot]

KAPA may not be in Denver but it's not in Centennial either. It's in unincorporated Arapahoe County (most of it is, anyway, with the southern tip in Douglas County) with a mailing address of Englewood.

http://co-centennial.civicplus.com/DocumentView.aspx?DID=2621

Hmmm.. never realized that. My City Council person sure gives a different impression...

Anyway, back to fun stuff... this thing sounds fun, I guess. Motivation to go somewhere, anyway...!

 

[gprellwitz]

Man, two of the poker run airports from this year's Gaston's would have been eligible to be claimed!

Do we need to use "OPERATION: FLY" signs going forward, or will "GO FLY AMERICA" signs work? I only ask because the Rules page (http://www.operationfly.com/rules) says " A printable sheet you can use in your photographs can be found here, but you can make your own as well", but the "claim.pdf" file linked to "here" is AWOL, 404 (not found).

Well, from the initial post, "The official password will be released on 7/11/2011, when the challenge officially resumes. " Don't be jumping the gun there, pardner!

 

[TangoWhiskey]

Well, from the initial post, "The official password will be released on 7/11/2011, when the challenge officially resumes. " Don't be jumping the gun there, pardner!

See, there I go again!

 

[denverpilot]

How about a way to "steal" a claim...? Number of landings there after the initial claim... something like that? More of a game that can't only be won, "once"... so to speak.

That could make it interesting / add some strategy to it.

 

[TangoWhiskey]

How about a way to "steal" a claim...? Number of landings there after the initial claim... something like that? More of a game that can't only be won, "once"... so to speak.

That could make it interesting / add some strategy to it.

Like FourSquare? Record and always display who got the initial "claim", but then show the top 10 visitors... and somebody is "king" or "mayor" or "airport director" for having the most distinct visits to that field.

 

[denverpilot]

Like FourSquare? Record and always display who got the initial "claim", but then show the top 10 visitors... and somebody is "king" or "mayor" or "airport director" for having the most distinct visits to that field.

That's what I was thinkin'. Of course, I don't have to actually code it, so it's easy for me to make up stuff that Nick has to go try to do. LOL!

About three of us keep swapping the "Mayorship" at KAPA. According to Foursquare, I haven't left the airport in a month.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Plus the FAA doesn't use ICAO ids, and therefore doesn't have anything but the 3 digit IDs that aren't used in Hawaii or Alaska. For example, try to find on the FAA's site anywhere that Unalaska is PADU. Closest you'll get it DUT, which can be interpolated to PADU, but that isn't consistent enough to make the assumption, unfortunately.

Aren't the numbered airports (ie, 3G2 or C29 or WV62) non-ICAO ID's?

If you're using ICAO ID's, does that mean that this is gonna turn into "Go Fly The World?"

But it was just a joke, ya know.

Question, though: I still have quite a few claim pictures from my big trip in 2008 that I didn't get submitted before Go Fly America was locked down. Can I still submit those?

 

[SkyHog]

https://nfdc.faa.gov/nfdcApps/airportLookup/airportDisplay.jsp?category=nasr&airportId=DUT

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org.../fs/alaskan/alaska/fai/locid/media/locid1.pdf

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...systemops/fs/alaskan/alaska/fai/locid/locid1/

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...an/alaska/fai/locid/locid2/index.cfm?print=go

I need to find out where they are getting their data from. Using FAA data would be ideal, but their downloadable data doesn't include ICAO IDs for Alaska, Hawaii, or any of the outlying territories, only IATA or FAA IDs.

I've learned a lot about 4 digit IDs - for example, all HI airports start with PH. Generally, the next two letters are the first two letters of the FAA's id, except when it starts with an H, then its the next 2 letters after. But if there's a conflict, then its a different ID.

Same with Alaska.

What that spells out is that short of actually having a data feed I can grab from the FAA that has the actual ICAO IDs, there is no consistent formula I can use to reliably get ICAOs out there for Alaska and Hawaii.

 

[JeffDG]

I need to find out where they are getting their data from. Using FAA data would be ideal, but their downloadable data doesn't include ICAO IDs for Alaska, Hawaii, or any of the outlying territories, only IATA or FAA IDs.

I've learned a lot about 4 digit IDs - for example, all HI airports start with PH. Generally, the next two letters are the first two letters of the FAA's id, except when it starts with an H, then its the next 2 letters after. But if there's a conflict, then its a different ID.

Same with Alaska.

What that spells out is that short of actually having a data feed I can grab from the FAA that has the actual ICAO IDs, there is no consistent formula I can use to reliably get ICAOs out there for Alaska and Hawaii.

FADDS (Facility Aeronautical Data Distribution System) should have what you need. You have to register for an account to download the data with NFDC (National Flight Data Center), but there is no fee or other cost associated with the data.

They publish facility data every 56 days (same as A/FD). It's the same data you see on AirNav and similar sites (I'd bet that it's where AirNav gets it). The full download is about 35MB, zipped. The APT.txt file (that contains most of the stuff you're talking about) unzips to about 170 MB however.

I just checked, and the ICAO references is one of the fields in the data file (I've attached the record layout description file for your reference).

 

[SkyHog]

FADDS (Facility Aeronautical Data Distribution System) should have what you need. You have to register for an account to download the data with NFDC (National Flight Data Center), but there is no fee or other cost associated with the data.

They publish facility data every 56 days (same as A/FD). It's the same data you see on AirNav and similar sites (I'd bet that it's where AirNav gets it). The full download is about 35MB, zipped. The APT.txt file (that contains most of the stuff you're talking about) unzips to about 170 MB however.

I just checked, and the ICAO references is one of the fields in the data file (I've attached the record layout description file for your reference).

That just might work better for the site. The FAA data I was using did not have as much info. I already have a FADDS account from before, so I'm digging through to see if this can be implemented easily.

Thanks for the suggestion Jeff!

 

[EdFred]

I bet if you did all this through the Apple Store you would have no issues.

 

[Steve]

Question, though: I still have quite a few claim pictures from my big trip in 2008 that I didn't get submitted before Go Fly America was locked down. Can I still submit those?

Just photoshop the new code words in and you're good to go....

 

[SkyHog]

Question, though: I still have quite a few claim pictures from my big trip in 2008 that I didn't get submitted before Go Fly America was locked down. Can I still submit those?

Ooh...that's a good question....

 

[rpadula]

Nick,

I can go to the Airports by State page (http://www.operationfly.com/reports/airportList), select a state, and get the list of airports by status. I can then click on an airport identifier from the list to see it on the map, or click on "CLAIMED" to read about it.

However, when I'm done, if I click on the browser's Back button, it takes me back to the page to select a state from the dropdown box. It doesn't take me to the actual previous page, which was the list of airports.

Happens at home on Safari and at work on Firefox.

 

[SkyHog]

Nick,

I can go to the Airports by State page (http://www.operationfly.com/reports/airportList), select a state, and get the list of airports by status. I can then click on an airport identifier from the list to see it on the map, or click on "CLAIMED" to read about it.

However, when I'm done, if I click on the browser's Back button, it takes me back to the page to select a state from the dropdown box. It doesn't take me to the actual previous page, which was the list of airports.

Happens at home on Safari and at work on Firefox.

Sure enough....that's AJAX for ya. Lemme think of a good clean way to fix that.

 

[rpadula]

Sure enough....that's AJAX for ya. Lemme think of a good clean way to fix that.

Perhaps you should try this:

(ya, I know what AJAX is)

 

[SkyHog]

How about a way to "steal" a claim...? Number of landings there after the initial claim... something like that? More of a game that can't only be won, "once"... so to speak.

That could make it interesting / add some strategy to it.

This is phase one. There is a LOT of new features to be coming throughout the following few years. What you have described is not the first big new feature to be coming.....I think you will like what is though

For now, its back where it was 2 years ago

 

[SkyHog]

FADDS (Facility Aeronautical Data Distribution System) should have what you need. You have to register for an account to download the data with NFDC (National Flight Data Center), but there is no fee or other cost associated with the data.

They publish facility data every 56 days (same as A/FD). It's the same data you see on AirNav and similar sites (I'd bet that it's where AirNav gets it). The full download is about 35MB, zipped. The APT.txt file (that contains most of the stuff you're talking about) unzips to about 170 MB however.

I just checked, and the ICAO references is one of the fields in the data file (I've attached the record layout description file for your reference).

Holy cow!! Did you actually look at the file? That might be the most disorganized "feed" I've ever seen. I'm looking for a rhyme that allows me to parse it easily, but seriously, I think I'm going to cry just looking through it.

 

[kimberlyanne546]

I just joined but too bad the password doesn't come out until after my solo cross country this weekend. Oh well. Almost all the airports in California are claimed!

 

[SkyHog]

I just joined but too bad the password doesn't come out until after my solo cross country this weekend. Oh well. Almost all the airports in California are claimed!

That is true...but, there are a lot of airports in Nevada, Arizona, and Oregon, depending on where you are in California, they might be within an hour or 2 of ya!

Plus, you can always submit visits for airports that were already claimed!

 

[jason]

Man, I'm going to be flying to an unclaimed airport this weekend. Are you sure you can't post the password tomorrow so that some of us can get going?

 

[kimberlyanne546]

That is true...but, there are a lot of airports in Nevada, Arizona, and Oregon, depending on where you are in California, they might be within an hour or 2 of ya!

Plus, you can always submit visits for airports that were already claimed!

Right, this is why I was bummed they won't send out the materials until later. I don't think I'm "allowed" to get out of the plane anyway, and that is one of the rules to take a photo for the site, but it is my first cross country solo and it would be cool to submit a visit (Ukiah).

It should only take about 2 hours, and I need 5 hours of XC solo for my cert, so there is always "next time".

Kimberly

 

[kimberlyanne546]

Man, I'm going to be flying to an unclaimed airport this weekend. Are you sure you can't post the password tomorrow so that some of us can get going?

Right - I'm going on Saturday (already claimed). I did see an unclaimed airport within my section of California, but it is not paved and I don't think I can take a rental there . . . not to mention I'm a student.

Kimberly

 

[jason]

Right, this is why I was bummed they won't send out the materials until later. I don't think I'm "allowed" to get out of the plane anyway, and that is one of the rules to take a photo for the site, but it is my first cross country solo and it would be cool to submit a visit (Ukiah).

It should only take about 2 hours, and I need 5 hours of XC solo for my cert, so there is always "next time".

Kimberly

Umm. Who's rule is that? I refueled the airplane and grabbed some lunch on my solo XC.

Also, you can claim without getting out of the airplane. I did so here...

http://www.operationfly.com/airports/viewClaim/650

 

[denverpilot]

Not getting out of the plane is silly. What kinda rule is that? How do you close your flight plan, look at the return weather, make a return trip go/no-go decision, file a new flight plan...

... and get some water so you can try out that in-flight "system" discussed in another thread? ha.

Or do folks only do that from your cell phones now without getting out to walk around these days?

Did ya know there used to be walk-in Flight Service stations? I only ever did it once...

I'm sure there's folks here who did it all the time though...

And I used a pay phone more than once to close a flight plan and get another before cell phones were common/cheap. Sigh. I'm feeling old.

I was told to get out and ask someone on the field to sign my logbook to prove I'd been there. That used to be a commonly done thing. I have no idea why.

Plus you need the experience of using a crappy unmaintained tie-down rope that'll just barely reach by about two inches, to remind ya to bring your own these days with FBOs being beyond cheap.

 

[JeffDG]

Holy cow!! Did you actually look at the file? That might be the most disorganized "feed" I've ever seen. I'm looking for a rhyme that allows me to parse it easily, but seriously, I think I'm going to cry just looking through it.

Did you look at the record definition? It's actually really clear, there are a whole boatload of fixed width columns, and the APT_rf.txt file tells you exactly which column to start/end with.

The thing that gets most people is that they've mixed multiple different record formats into the APT.txt file in one big mashup.

For example, you're mostly interested in the rows that start with "APT", as those are airport records. Additionally there are ATT (Attendance - shows when the airport is manned), RWY (Runway definitions), and RMK records. So when you parse, you need to use different definitions and columns to process each. If you're just looking for airports, ignore all the rows that don't start with APT and it gets MUCH simpler.

 

[wsuffa]

Man, I'm going to be flying to an unclaimed airport this weekend. Are you sure you can't post the password tomorrow so that some of us can get going?

Likewise.

 

[kimberlyanne546]

Not getting out of the plane is silly. What kinda rule is that? How do you close your flight plan, look at the return weather, make a return trip go/no-go decision, file a new flight plan...

... and get some water so you can try out that in-flight "system" discussed in another thread? ha.

Or do folks only do that from your cell phones now without getting out to walk around these days?

Did ya know there used to be walk-in Flight Service stations? I only ever did it once...

I'm sure there's folks here who did it all the time though...

And I used a pay phone more than once to close a flight plan and get another before cell phones were common/cheap. Sigh. I'm feeling old.

I was told to get out and ask someone on the field to sign my logbook to prove I'd been there. That used to be a commonly done thing. I have no idea why.

Plus you need the experience of using a crappy unmaintained tie-down rope that'll just barely reach by about two inches, to remind ya to bring your own these days with FBOs being beyond cheap.

I'll have to ask my instructor, however, I think he just wants me to come right back. As others have said, doing stuff at the destination is beyond the privileges of a student pilot (getting lunch). This is a training flight and not a sight seeing thing. In terms of closing the flight plan, I could pull over and just stop and call them on the cell, yes. Or I could close it when I'm near / over the airport. I'd open my coming back flight plan on the radio when airborne on the way back. Weather I'd check before I go, it is only 50 - 60 nm each way so I could get the weather once. I could also get a weather check in flight on the radio.

 

[EdFred]

I'll have to ask my instructor, however, I think he just wants me to come right back. As others have said, doing stuff at the destination is beyond the privileges of a student pilot (getting lunch). This is a training flight and not a sight seeing thing. In terms of closing the flight plan, I could pull over and just stop and call them on the cell, yes. Or I could close it when I'm near / over the airport. I'd open my coming back flight plan on the radio when airborne on the way back. Weather I'd check before I go, it is only 50 - 60 nm each way so I could get the weather once. I could also get a weather check in flight on the radio.

No it isn't. A lot of instructors will have their students get out of the plane and go sign the register in the FBO to prove they were there. Or bring back a business card or something, or a receipt from lunch.

 

[jason]

I'll have to ask my instructor, however, I think he just wants me to come right back. As others have said, doing stuff at the destination is beyond the privileges of a student pilot (getting lunch). This is a training flight and not a sight seeing thing. In terms of closing the flight plan, I could pull over and just stop and call them on the cell, yes. Or I could close it when I'm near / over the airport. I'd open my coming back flight plan on the radio when airborne on the way back. Weather I'd check before I go, it is only 50 - 60 nm each way so I could get the weather once. I could also get a weather check in flight on the radio.

I didn't say that, actually, I said the opposite. There is nothing in the regs that say you can't get out of the airplane. If that is a limitation that your instructor is placing on you...then that's his thing.

 

[wsuffa]

I'll have to ask my instructor, however, I think he just wants me to come right back. As others have said, doing stuff at the destination is beyond the privileges of a student pilot (getting lunch). This is a training flight and not a sight seeing thing. In terms of closing the flight plan, I could pull over and just stop and call them on the cell, yes. Or I could close it when I'm near / over the airport. I'd open my coming back flight plan on the radio when airborne on the way back. Weather I'd check before I go, it is only 50 - 60 nm each way so I could get the weather once. I could also get a weather check in flight on the radio.

Interesting to see a different perspective.

My PP instructor insisted that I land, get out, have the plane topped off & interact with the FBO staff. Get lunch, too, if I wanted. Oh, and bring the receipt back as it was a wet rental.

He wanted to make sure I learned not only the fundamentals of flying the plane, but also the practicalities of air travel, FBO procedures, and the differences in airport handling at different airports. It was about the entire learning experience, not just the ability to fly. He also had a philosophy that FBOs would go away if we didn't patronize them & buy fuel when we stopped.

Among other things, it taught me the importance of making sure the FBO had a good vending machine around lunch time...

Having said that, every instructor is different.

 

[kimberlyanne546]

This is a good question, I don't want to mis-quote him. I don't know what he wants me to do; we are going to meet before the flight to discuss everything and get him to sign my log book.

I was talking about a thread I read either on here or the other pilot site. Someone posted they were going somewhere and getting the $100 hamburger or meeting someone on their first solo XC and posters replied that it was beyond the limitations of being a student pilot.

It would be fun to get out and stretch my legs though! I will email him today and find out what the plan is.

Kimberly