T&G more risky than Stop and Go?

[gsengle]

That's fine gengle, whatever you're comfortable with. Myself either electric or using the trim wheel manually I can get close if not right on it. Not boasting either, just my experience.

Yep just saying it depends on the airplane. Should be fine in trainers. And when you'd want to do it is in primary training. I wouldn't do it in more complex airplanes because really what's the point? You already have your ppl. Still surprised a DPE had me do one in a twin once. I didn't have a checklist for all the configuration changes required, and ended up missing an item...

(Cowl flaps open, carb heat off, flaps up, mixtures, props, trim for take off, confirm fuel pumps on)


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[mscard88]

I did it in a PA32R and C310, hell even the Brasilia and ATR-72 I flew too.

 

[gsengle]

I did it in a PA32R and C310, hell even the Brasilia and ATR-72 I flew too.

Yep no biggie given enough runway, and if you have a checklist ready...


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[steingar]

If I do a touch and go in the J, it's more of a land, roll, and go. During the roll phase I'm getting the cowl flaps open, and the flaps and trim to takeoff position. Then I'll throttle up and go. Like Micheal says, to throttle up without doing that will require some serious Popeye arms to keep the nose down.

The other worry is that if you decide to do a "real" takeoff the gear is coming up. Problem is it take quite an effort in my Johnson-bar equipped Mooney. Might decide to just let the gear hang and keep the speed down for the go around. Of course, I might pull the gear up on the odd one and forget with all the distractions causing these go-arounds in the first place. Next thing you know I'm gear up when I shouldn't be. Good recipe for a bad outcome to no purpose that I can discern beyond saving time during training.

 

[Clark1961]

So what other procedures are you teaching that the aircraft manufacturer advises against?

I am not teaching any procedures that an aircraft manufacturer prohibits or advises against. I am capable of reading an individual aircraft's AFM to determine the status of a procedure so I don't have to hear a rumor and assume it fits all.

 

[Clip4]

I am not teaching any procedures that an aircraft manufacturer prohibits or advises against. I am capable of reading an individual aircraft's AFM to determine the status of a procedure so I don't have to hear a rumor and assume it fits all.

Yes, I never said that this issue was relevant to all 172s, feel free to search my posts if you feel I said that. But, if you look at production numbers of various years of 172s, you will find the slip recommendation applies to a very large number of the fleet.

 

[Clark1961]

Yes, I never said that this issue was relevant to all 172s, feel free to search my posts if you feel I said that. But, if you look at production numbers of various years of 172s, you will find the slip recommendation applies to a very large number of the fleet.

And yet you fabricate a story that I am teaching procedures that manufacturers advise against. Definitely a problem here and it is of your making.

 

[Clip4]

And yet you fabricate a story that I am teaching procedures that manufacturers advise against. Definitely a problem here and it is of your making.

I never fabricated any story, but feel free to quote where I did.

 

[gsengle]

I never fabricated any story, but feel free to quote where I did.

Children children, please, I get enough bickering from the kids at home.


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[Clark1961]

So what other procedures are you teaching that the aircraft manufacturer advises against?

This is your fabrication. You are an unethical jerk.

 

[gsengle]

Yeah it doesn't work at home either


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[denverpilot]

I guess the Cessna advising to avoid slips with full flaps isn't factual enough.

Not to mention he didn't say "172" in the original post. He's utterly clueless about the 172 fleet AND all of the rest of the Cessna fleet, THEN decides Clark is a CFI and teaching against the book -- about something that only applies to SOME of the 172 fleet.

His Google searches from mom's basement aren't keeping up with the conversation I guess. Same stuff happened when talking about other types. Bad info, corrected, acted insulted, changed story, still didn't get it right...

It's entertaining though. Definitely entertaining. Mostly because I anxiously await whatever incorrect garbage he spouts next. It's fun to ask leading questions when he does it to see if he bites and makes himself look even more clueless.

 

[denverpilot]

By the way. I did five stop and goes at night and didn't die tonight. Just sayin'. Airplane was off the runway and climbing before the halfway point each time. Lots of runway left in case it was needed.

 

[Matthew]

By the way. I did five stop and goes at night and didn't die tonight. Just sayin'. Airplane was off the runway and climbing before the halfway point each time. Lots of runway left in case it was needed.

You, sir, are a steely-eyed missile man.

 

[OkieAviator]

As a 172 pilot I don't do T&Gs. In fact after each landing I exit the runway and do a full preflight inspection and run up before taking back off. It's increases your safety by 10 fold.

 

[Matthew]

As a 172 pilot I don't do T&Gs. In fact after each landing I exit the runway and do a full preflight inspection and run up before taking back off. It's increases your safety by 10 fold.

What, no wx brief?

 

[denverpilot]

You, sir, are a steely-eyed missile man.

You should have seen the three T&Gs before the S&Gs! Daredevil!

 

[OkieAviator]

What, no wx brief?

I don't get weather briefs... waste of time.

 

[denverpilot]

I don't get weather briefs... waste of time.

Yeah but that's because you live where there's only two weather phenomena. Hotter than Chris Christie's crotch in sweatpants, and tornado coming out of a line of embedded thunderstorms.

Every 24 hours.

 

[OkieAviator]

Yeah but that's because you live where there's only two weather phenomena. Hotter than Chris Christie's crotch in sweatpants, and tornado coming out of a line of embedded thunderstorms.

Every 24 hours.

That's true, only fly during tornadoes for the tailwind.

 

[OMGIFORGOTHOWTOLAND]

I don't allow students to do either touch/go or stop/go.

1. The proper completion of after landing and takeoff check lists is more likely.
2. The risk of taking off without the aircraft properly configured is reduced.
3. The chances of taking off without enough runway is eliminated.
4. The chances of a student running off the side of a runway while configuring the plane and/or applying power without having the plane under control is eliminated.
5. Situational awareness is increased because they have to stop, look for traffic and listen to the radio.

I Agree with this. On my first solo I did taxibacks, after that I was allowed to do touch and go's. It would be like teaching a student to start an engine right after a simulated engine failure in a multi. When an engine failure actually occurs the student will go by muscle memory which means they are trying to start a failed engine. Things in this situation become muscle memory that shouldn't be when learning the basics. We want them to stop and think about what they are doing while creating those habits. Checklist and Time = Good and reduces risk which as a CFI is the name of the game.

 

[OMGIFORGOTHOWTOLAND]

Why is a touch and go more risky? Because the student might run off the side of the runway? Shouldn't they be skilled enough to not do that before they solo?

I worked at a couple flight schools that did not allow student pilots to do touch and goes, and it made the first solo kind of anti-climactic.

Haha thats true. Anti-climactic for those on the ground sure, Im sure the student is still gripping that yoke like it was the last thing they would ever do.