Student "instructor"

I'm confused. Does someone think that the AOPA should sue someone because somewhere there is pilot deliberately breaking the law?
 
docmirror said:
Alrighty, what battle that you referred to are AOPA engaged in? I haven't seen anyone from AOPA raise their voice higher than a whisper since I've been a member. They have also not engaged in any legal maneuvering, lawsuit, or been a party to any lawsuit on either side of this unreg pilot issue.
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Why or even how would they get involved in any such legal action to express opposition to people flying illegally? Filing an amicus curiae brief supporting the FAA's action against such a pilot? Hardly.

In any event, my comment on that was not intended to be taken as regarding the specific issue of this particular idiot, but rather on the general issue of pilots complaining about regulations. My point was that either you get on the bus working to change them, or stop whining about them. AOPA works very hard both directly and indirectly to prevent and roll back onerous regulations -- and I don't think anyone here believes the requirement that you have a pilot certificate before flying anything bigger than an ultralight is onerous. OTOH, the anti-GA forces are strong, numerous, well-organized, and well-funded, and if we don't team up against them, we will lose -- and AOPA is the best banner I know under which we can advance the flight for private flyers. That's why I said quit whining here and start supporting AOPA.
 
I did one enforcement on a fellow who crashed his PA28 after running out of gas. He had no license, no medical. Thankfully he was the only one on board, but he did confess that he had carried passengers previously.
 
RotorAndWing said:
I did one enforcement on a fellow who crashed his PA28 after running out of gas. He had no license, no medical. Thankfully he was the only one on board, but he did confess that he had carried passengers previously.
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Was that prosecuted as a criminal case? I would presume so.
 
Ron Levy said:
Why or even how would they get involved in any such legal action to express opposition to people flying illegally? Filing an amicus curiae brief supporting the FAA's action against such a pilot? Hardly.
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Why are you asking me? You brought up AOPAs involvement not me!:confused:

AOPA hasn't done, doesn't do squat. Pilots BOR? They did nothing until the last stage when it was submitted in the senate, and they started slapping themselves on the back for their involvement. Stopping, limiting, or having ANY input on the TFR system? Nope, they did what we do - they whined about it, but made zero traction. Training? So they put out a small mag with some training stuff - pfft. Safety? Fuel avail or changes? We're still no where and soon 100LL is going to be outlawed.

Face it, you've got nothing with AOPA except their ability to market crap to pilots. completely useless, and actually more than useless because it distracts low-information pilots by thinking that they actually do something, while getting nothing done. We might as well call them congress of plane-owners and be done with it.
 
RotorAndWing said:
I did one enforcement on a fellow who crashed his PA28 after running out of gas. He had no license, no medical. Thankfully he was the only one on board, but he did confess that he had carried passengers previously.
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So, was lacking in training and certification an acceptable affirmative defense to the stupidity of running out of gas? :D
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Greg,

Do you have a pilot certificate? Whole bunch of them. How many (Title 14) CFR's do you purposely break on a regular basis?
I don't purposely break any CFRs, I just don't let the CFRs get in the way of a good time.
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Funny thing is most people don't let following the rules stop them from crashing.
 
LDJones said:
How much?
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Not sure. Once it goes to the RA it's out of the local office hands. There is a table in the Order 2150.3B that list violations and fines.

For him it wasn't just a fine, he had the airplane financed and insured. The insurance refused to pay off the airplane, so this guy was left with a bank note on a airplane that no longer exist. Just bad all the way around.
 
docmirror said:
Why are you asking me? You brought up AOPAs involvement not me!:confused:

AOPA hasn't done, doesn't do squat. Pilots BOR? They did nothing until the last stage when it was submitted in the senate, and they started slapping themselves on the back for their involvement. Stopping, limiting, or having ANY input on the TFR system? Nope, they did what we do - they whined about it, but made zero traction. Training? So they put out a small mag with some training stuff - pfft. Safety? Fuel avail or changes? We're still no where and soon 100LL is going to be outlawed.

Face it, you've got nothing with AOPA except their ability to market crap to pilots. completely useless, and actually more than useless because it distracts low-information pilots by thinking that they actually do something, while getting nothing done. We might as well call them congress of plane-owners and be done with it.
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Nothing in the above but distortions and quotation out of context, so I'm done respoding.
 
ClimbnSink said:
Greater then .9 correlation that fat pilots are medically unfit, thus just as illegal as no ticket pilots. The tiny percentage of fatties that don't have apnea can have their sleep study and get back to flying. The others I hope would at least serve a suspension for putting themselves and innocent others at risk. GA can't afford the bad PR of overweight flying narcolepsy units filling the skies.
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So the existence of fat pilots justifies the existence of unlicensed pilots.

Got that.

By the way, what's the accident rate for fat pilots compared to fit pilots?

I'm not fat. Not skinny, either. Just old enough and experienced to recognize the lethal arrogance of youth in several places here.

Dan
 
Dan Thomas said:
So the existence of fat pilots justifies the existence of unlicensed pilots.

Got that.

By the way, what's the accident rate for fat pilots compared to fit pilots?

I'm not fat. Not skinny, either. Just old enough and experienced to recognize the lethal arrogance of youth in several places here.

Dan
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Doesn't justify it, just that fatties are more of an aviation safety hazard then unlicensed pilots. Not having a license doesn't guarantee an unsafe pilot, whereas we know for a fact being fat is unsafe. The other thread made it clear fat pilots have more accidents then fit pilots just based on apnea. Beyond apnea, look up the layman's description of any malady and you will see fatness as an increased risk factor. The fit and fat line is BS, there is no such thing. BTW I ain't young, I'm one of those old bold pilots that are more plentiful then rumor suggests.
 
RotorAndWing said:
Not sure. Once it goes to the RA it's out of the local office hands. There is a table in the Order 2150.3B that list violations and fines.

For him it wasn't just a fine, he had the airplane financed and insured. The insurance refused to pay off the airplane, so this guy was left with a bank note on a airplane that no longer exist. Just bad all the way around.
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And a well earned problem for the "pilot". No sympathy from me.
 
ClimbnSink said:
Doesn't justify it, just that fatties are more of an aviation safety hazard then unlicensed pilots. Not having a license doesn't guarantee an unsafe pilot, whereas we know for a fact being fat is unsafe. The other thread made it clear fat pilots have more accidents then fit pilots just based on apnea. Beyond apnea, look up the layman's description of any malady and you will see fatness as an increased risk factor. The fit and fat line is BS, there is no such thing. BTW I ain't young, I'm one of those old bold pilots that are more plentiful then rumor suggests.
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Maybe you're on to something with this. Still don't like it applied to pilots but.....

He looks a bit hefty.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/0...at-more-than-80-mph-at-time-fatal-crash-ntsb/
 
ClimbnSink said:
Greater then .9 correlation that fat pilots are medically unfit, thus just as illegal as no ticket pilots. The tiny percentage of fatties that don't have apnea can have their sleep study and get back to flying. The others I hope would at least serve a suspension for putting themselves and innocent others at risk. GA can't afford the bad PR of overweight flying narcolepsy units filling the skies.
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Untreated OSA is like 0.080 Alcohol, guy. They're not saying you can't fly, Greg, They're saying you need to get treated to fly, then you can.

YOU are ruining it for the rest of us. Tilton is being completely reasonable here (Gawd, I just defended someone at the FAA....).

I need a break.
 
ClimbnSink said:
Doesn't justify it, just that fatties are more of an aviation safety hazard then unlicensed pilots. Not having a license doesn't guarantee an unsafe pilot, whereas we know for a fact being fat is unsafe. The other thread made it clear fat pilots have more accidents then fit pilots just based on apnea.
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Oh really? More accidents? You found evidence?
 
And for those who think insurance is going to pay off because you paid, despite disregarding the "all applicable FAR clause: Some of us KNOW differently.

Rotor&Wing said:
Not sure. Once it goes to the RA it's out of the local office hands. There is a table in the Order 2150.3B that list violations and fines.

For him it wasn't just a fine, he had the airplane financed and insured. The insurance refused to pay off the airplane, so this guy was left with a bank note on a airplane that no longer exist. Just bad all the way around.
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I'll put my fat, but properly licensed a$$, up against any unlicensed pilot you want to bring to the party. We can make easy and do single engine VFR into IFR to start, then move onto multi engine, with engine failures on takeoff, Vmc demonstrations and if your unlicensed guy wants to show his expertise, we'll jump in a Citation and do some V1 cuts. ;) maybe a couple single engine NDB approaches, I'm sure he'd do a lot better than me. :rolleyes:

ClimbnSink said:
Doesn't justify it, just that fatties are more of an aviation safety hazard then unlicensed pilots. Not having a license doesn't guarantee an unsafe pilot, whereas we know for a fact being fat is unsafe. The other thread made it clear fat pilots have more accidents then fit pilots just based on apnea. Beyond apnea, look up the layman's description of any malady and you will see fatness as an increased risk factor. The fit and fat line is BS, there is no such thing. BTW I ain't young, I'm one of those old bold pilots that are more plentiful then rumor suggests.
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How about Hoover the day after he got his ticket pulled?
N747JB said:
I'll put my fat, but properly licensed a$$, up against any unlicensed pilot you want to bring to the party. We can make easy and do single engine VFR into IFR to start, then move onto multi engine, with engine failures on takeoff, Vmc demonstrations and if your unlicensed guy wants to show his expertise, we'll jump in a Citation and do some V1 cuts. ;) maybe a couple single engine NDB approaches, I'm sure he'd do a lot better than me. :rolleyes:
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flyingcheesehead said:
Oh really? More accidents? You found evidence?
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If you are overweight there is a very high chance you have apnea. If you have apnea you operate at the level of someone legally drunk. If we are going to tolerate fat pilots we might as well tolerate drunk pilots. Same level of performance. The only difference is society shames drunks and makes excuses for fatties. Apologies to Bruce for beating this up again.
 
Aw, give it a rest, Greg. :( We all hate the intervention. All of us do. But the science on this is getting too good to ignore and now there are sentinel events. Look up AAR 09/07 and read part 2.6. That guy is dead.

We don't tolerate drunks. We ground 'em, sober 'em up and give them one more continuously monitored verified chance....and a soberlink. (google it).

Sigh.

henning said:
Invite Dick Cheney to come out duck hunting.
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Ouch. Sorry for being in the wrong place, Mr. Vice President (Whittington was his name, I think).
 
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N747JB said:
I'll put my fat, but properly licensed a$$, up against any unlicensed pilot you want to bring to the party. We can make easy and do single engine VFR into IFR to start, then move onto multi engine, with engine failures on takeoff, Vmc demonstrations and if your unlicensed guy wants to show his expertise, we'll jump in a Citation and do some V1 cuts. ;) maybe a couple single engine NDB approaches, I'm sure he'd do a lot better than me. :rolleyes:
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Or go get groceries in a Super Cub in Alaska during the winter up against the guy with no cert. He likely won't know what a V1 cut in a Citation is but will have groceries from the Costo that's next door to Merrill Field back home safely.
 
ClimbnSink said:
If you are overweight there is a very high chance you have apnea. If you have apnea you operate at the level of someone legally drunk. If we are going to tolerate fat pilots we might as well tolerate drunk pilots. Same level of performance. The only difference is society shames drunks and makes excuses for fatties. Apologies to Bruce for beating this up again.
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I bet arrogance kills 10 times as many pilots as apnea. At least.
 
I think Dr's shouldn't be able to become pilots. Way more dangerous than sleepy pilots,they seem not to have the mental capacity to make the proper decisions when flying.i.e. Vfr into IFR icing up. Even when all the info was provided to them.We have a plane famously named the fork tailed dr killer. I think as a profession they have crashed and killed themselves and other people more than anybody, have yet to read about fatties crashing.let alone a fork tailed fattie killer. In fact I think a Mirage just crashed with a doctor at the controls. Get the doctors on the ground NOW. I believe the week before a doctor crashed killing most of his staff and him self.
 
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willywildes said:
I think Dr's should be able to become pilots. Way more dangerous than sleepy pilots,they seem not to have the mental capacity to make the proper decisions when flying.i.e. Vfr into IFR icing up. Even when all the info was provided to them.We have a plane famously named the fork tailed dr killer. I think as a profession they have crashed and killed themselves and other people more than anybody, have yet to read about fatties crashing.let alone a fork tailed fattie killer. In fact I think a Mirage just crashed with a doctor at the controls. Get the doctors on the ground NOW.
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Arrogant fat Doctors maybe? :dunno:

The problem doesn't seem to be that the Pilot is not licensed. The problem is that he sounds like a jerk. His lack of license is certainly a way to "get back at him" for being a jerk, but it may be overkill to tattletale to the FSDO. A good half step would be to threaten to report him with an anonymous letter, demanding that he both get current and gets his %#&@ together.

marcoseddi said:
Where's he getting the plane from?
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{wishing I had an "Exactly!" emoticon}
Contact the Owner of the plane and make them aware of their role in this potential problem. If he's the Owner, send the letter. It's about preservation of the safety record of the Air park.
 
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After spending a lot of time legally drunk, if that's what sleep apnea feels like, I don't have it! :D I do think you should add smokers to your crusade, oh and anyone over 50.......oh and anyone that can't run a 6 minute mile.:rolleyes:

ClimbnSink said:
If you are overweight there is a very high chance you have apnea. If you have apnea you operate at the level of someone legally drunk. If we are going to tolerate fat pilots we might as well tolerate drunk pilots. Same level of performance. The only difference is society shames drunks and makes excuses for fatties. Apologies to Bruce for beating this up again.
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