Sen. Inhofe (OK) son dies in plane crash.

Hawker800 said:
What is it with MU-2's?
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Making no statement about this particular accident since there is really nothing to go by yet, the MU-2 is a high-performance machine that is very demanding in OEI operations. Along with the Malibu the MU-2 has been re-examined on several occasions and always continues to be certified (and rightly so in my opinion) - but airplanes like the Malibu, the MU-2, and before them the Bonanza, are not tolerant of carelessness or poor systems management in emergencies. Again, NOT saying that is the issue in Sen. Inhofe's son's accident, just a 30,000 foot overview of the MU-2.

Prayers to family and friends.

'Gimp
 
Wow so sad a family tradition and sounds like he has the experienced and knowledge and still die somehow with a twin and everything
 
Condolences to the senator and his family.
 
I flew right seat in one quite a bit with a good friend who flew it for a corporation. He had a lot of time in a lot of different type twins and a Learjet. He claimed the MU2 was the best airplane he ever flew due to its versatility, speed, etc. he went to school to become familiar with it and said in an emergency( single engine) you did things differently that you would in another type but if you were familiar with this it was a wonderful airplane. He further stated that it was not an airplane " to trifle with as it would bite you quickly "and you had to stay ahead of it. It sure had a small cockpit, not made for a 6 footer.
 
ABC reporting they he declared before crashing per other pilots interviews at the airport. FAA not confirming but that's normal.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
I flew right seat in one quite a bit with a good friend who flew it for a corporation. He had a lot of time in a lot of different type twins and a Learjet. He claimed the MU2 was the best airplane he ever flew due to its versatility, speed, etc. he went to school to become familiar with it and said in an emergency( single engine) you did things differently that you would in another type but if you were familiar with this it was a wonderful airplane. He further stated that it was not an airplane " to trifle with as it would bite you quickly "and you had to stay ahead of it. It sure had a small cockpit, not made for a 6 footer.
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It is because the airplane doesn't have ailerons, it has spoilers. You lose an engine in one, and do what you have done for every other airplane you have ever flown, you will die.
 
I was involved in management of a program the Air Force had (and I think still has) that leased MU-2s and used them as 'ducks' to train GCI radar controllers at Tyndall AFB. The Air Force liked the MU-2 because it could go 250knots, which was about the slowest speed the radars could handle in training mode. In training mode the radar computers scaled up the speed to make the system behave as if the airplane was going 2 or 3 times faster than reality. The F-117 guys also flew MU-2s when the program was black.

IMHO the MU-2 and the Lear 35 (the two airplanes I worked with) need to be flown by pilots trained and capable of working at a professional level.

The MU-2 Rice Rocket flies 'different' for a number of reasons, one of the differences being that it uses spoilers for roll control instead of ailerons. This causes pro-verse yaw among other 'different' things.

We flew thousands of hours with no accidents, although there was one 'incident' in which an MU-2 threw a prop blade through the fuselage.
 
RV10flyer said:
N856JT.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N856JT
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He flew right over top of our airport and crashed 2 miles further away. We have a MU2 on the field, so it is possible to land here. I don't know if he could have landed with one engine gone, though. It looks as if he bought the plane in September. Maybe still learning to control it well.
 
The TV video shows that the airframe is mostly consumed in the fire.
Being the family member of a powerful Senator there will be a 200% push by the NTSB to investigate - same as with John Kennedy - but I don't see much of anything left for them to find. They can determine if the remaining engine was producing power at impact. The intensity of the fire shows significant fuel was remaining in the tanks.
One engine has a feathered prop. Looks like the left engine to me.

Fate is the Hunter.
 
Too much airplane for the deceased. Nothing to see here.
 
Inverted said:
Are you aware of his qualifications? Certificates and ratings? Hours? Time in type?

The Mu-2 is a pussycat. It just doesn't behave like a normal aircraft.
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COMMERCIAL PILOT
Date of Issue: 8/11/2009
Certificate: COMMERCIAL PILOT
Ratings:
COMMERCIAL PILOT
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE

Limits:
ENGLISH PROFICIENT.

FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
Date of Issue: 2/21/2012
Certificate: FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
Ratings:
FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE

Limits:
VALID ONLY WHEN ACCOMPANIED BY PILOT CERTIFICATE NO. . EXPIRES: 28 FEB 2014.
 
In some ways I am glad we could not afford anymore of an airplane. I am also glad I flew 5.8 hrs of transition training. I wonder if he did his?
 
RV10flyer said:
I am also glad I flew 5.8 hrs of transition training. I wonder if he did his?
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Can someone get into an MU-2 these days without it? I thought the type training for the MU-2 was now an FAA requirement.

One of the interesting things about the MU-2 is that a while back when the accident record was so atrocious, they compared the US safety record with Europe and found that the US was the only place where the fatal accident rate was so high. The difference was that in Europe, you needed a type rating to fly it. I recall reading recently that the FAA had finally implemented a similar requirement for some form of specific type training.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Can someone get into an MU-2 these days without it? I thought the type training for the MU-2 was now an FAA requirement.
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You can't even touch the yoke if you dont have the transition training or you are flying with one of the approved training providers.
 
weilke said:
You can't even touch the yoke if you dont have the transition training or you are flying with one of the approved training providers.
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That is what I thought. I've heard that once that requirement was put in place, the accident rate fell off dramatically.
 
So it looks like he just bought the plane a couple of months ago, not sure how much he flew it (after the flight from SLC to TUL the only thing FlightAware shows is the final flight), and had an engine failure in a plane that's known for not acting like the planes he'd likely been flying for the past 30 years (we don't know if he had previous MU-2 time and if so how much).

What's to say that any of the stone throwers would've done better? Anyone? Because I'm not about to say I would've done better.
 
Fearless Tower said:
That is what I thought. I've heard that once that requirement was put in place, the accident rate fell off dramatically.
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Since the SFAR 108 training requirements have kicked in, the accident record of the Mu2 has been the same or better than that of of the King Air and Cheyenne.

You can't even sit right-seat with someone without the training:

those who act as pilot-in-command, act as second-in-command, or other persons who
manipulate the controls while under the su-
pervision of a pilot-in-command.
 
Let's say you went to school, flew the MU2 both in flight and in the sim for 20 hours? Your previous single-twin time is around 1000 hours in stuff like a 310 or a baron. Flying is not your occupation but rather a hobby. After reading all the reports on proper training in the MU2, would you then elect to fly it solo without say a safety pilot with you? I sure would not! Especially if I had a lot of bread on the hip.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Let's say you went to school, flew the MU2 both in flight and in the sim for 20 hours? Your previous single-twin time is around 1000 hours in stuff like a 310 or a baron. Flying is not your occupation but rather a hobby. After reading all the reports on proper training in the MU2, would you then elect to fly it solo without say a safety pilot with you? I sure would not! Especially if I had a lot of bread on the hip.
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I seem to recall Dave saying when he bought the King Air this was part of his thought process. It would be part of mine, too.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Let's say you went to school, flew the MU2 both in flight and in the sim for 20 hours? Your previous single-twin time is around 1000 hours in stuff like a 310 or a baron. Flying is not your occupation but rather a hobby. After reading all the reports on proper training in the MU2, would you then elect to fly it solo without say a safety pilot with you? I sure would not! Especially if I had a lot of bread on the hip.
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Never underestimate ego.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
What's to say that any of the stone throwers would've done better? Anyone? Because I'm not about to say I would've done better.
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It is all about denial. Weak pilots have to trash the dead as being stupid or they wouldn't have the courage to fly. He was one of us but after his fatal crash we mentally toss him out of the ingroup so his accident doesn't apply to anything we do. Must have been a drunk or a rich brat with no skills.:rolleyes:
 
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Jimmy cooper said:
Let's say you went to school, flew the MU2 both in flight and in the sim for 20 hours? Your previous single-twin time is around 1000 hours in stuff like a 310 or a baron. Flying is not your occupation but rather a hobby. After reading all the reports on proper training in the MU2, would you then elect to fly it solo without say a safety pilot with you? I sure would not! Especially if I had a lot of bread on the hip.
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All the training programs I am aware of are mostly in-plane.

The problem with taking along a safety pilot is that there are not that many SFAR 108 current pilots floating around who have time to do this. Most of them have day-jobs towing targets for the military or shipping plastic bags with biological materials every night.
 
ClimbnSink said:
It is all about denial. Weak pilots have to trash the dead as being stupid or they wouldn't have the courage to fly. He was one of us but after his fatal crash we mentally toss him out of the ingroup so his accident doesn't apply to anything we do. Must have been a drunk or a rich brat with no skills.:rolleyes:
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That's the best way I've heard it put.

You MU boys can expect your premiums to go up I bet. :rolleyes2:
 
Dr. O said:
The TV video shows that the airframe is mostly consumed in the fire.
Being the family member of a powerful Senator there will be a 200% push by the NTSB to investigate - same as with John Kennedy - but I don't see much of anything left for them to find. They can determine if the remaining engine was producing power at impact. The intensity of the fire shows significant fuel was remaining in the tanks.
One engine has a feathered prop. Looks like the left engine to me.

Fate is the Hunter.
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The family member may be a powerful senator, but in this instance, the family member is also a pilot and PRESUMABLY doesn't live in a vacuum, and knows something of the issues surrounding emergency operations in that airframe.
 
" if you are a rather low time multi engine pilot and have an engine out in this airplane, you will have your hands full" . This is Frank Boarmans view of the MU2. He owned three and had over 3500 hours in them. Borman trained on them yearly, etc. I personally was facinated when I flew in one. When it starts down the runway I immed. Knew it was the major leagues. To me, Totally different from a commander 1000. I can certainly see why anyone would want one.
 
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