Runway Incursions.

ksandrew

ksandrew

Pre-takeoff checklist
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ksandrew
The FAA has stated that many runway incursions are caused by pilots getting confused. And they are going to fix it.

Life is a barrel of fun.

Ken
 
RalphInCA said:
What the heck does that striping mean?
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The standard taxi line gets extra side markers as you approach an runway hold back line. Sort of a "warning", that along with flashing wigwag lights and soon to be red stop lights.

A lot of incursions happen when a pilot may approach a hold short line at an angle. He may stop with his nose behind the line, but his wing may be over. Oops! So now taxi ways are created to approach straight on if they can.
 
I checked the FAA runway incursion data base, and every single incursion that I saw was at a towered airport. The solution seems obvious.
 
I got some taxi instructions a couple weeks ago and I was like WTF, over?

It was something to the affect spit out like, " taxi ramp mike mike two bravo 3 bravo hold short 25Right contact ground point 9 once clear and hold short 36left"

I told them I have no idea what you want me to do. The controller then said it long hand slow and I was able to write it down which made a bit more sense but I was still confused about the taxi instructions. And he acted like I should completely understand what he just said as if I was Cap'n Sully.

No wonder incursions happen.
 
Unit74 said:
I got some taxi instructions a couple weeks ago and I was like WTF, over?

It was something to the affect spit out like, " taxi ramp mike mike two bravo 3 bravo hold short 25Right contact ground point 9 once clear and hold short 36left"

I told them I have no idea what you want me to do. The controller then said it long hand slow and I was able to write it down which made a bit more sense but I was still confused about the taxi instructions. And he acted like I should completely understand what he just said as if I was Cap'n Sully.

No wonder incursions happen.
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:lol: I've had that happen a few times, I would just respond with newbie to the airport, progressive taxi PLEASE?
 
I've had to ask for progressive at an airport I'd been to several times before. They threw me off when they gave me a rwy I hadn't used in the past and an exit that was unfamiliar. I knew where I wanted to go, but not how to get there. They ran off all the instructions, and I had dropped my taxi diagram under the seat. D'oh!
 
Unit74 said:
I got some taxi instructions a couple weeks ago and I was like WTF, over?

It was something to the affect spit out like, " taxi ramp mike mike two bravo 3 bravo hold short 25Right contact ground point 9 once clear and hold short 36left"

I told them I have no idea what you want me to do. The controller then said it long hand slow and I was able to write it down which made a bit more sense but I was still confused about the taxi instructions. And he acted like I should completely understand what he just said as if I was Cap'n Sully.

No wonder incursions happen.
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For this purpose, have a note pad out, much like getting an IFR departure clearance.

Write down M M2 B3 B hold 25R 121.9 hold 36L (though it's not very likely you'll get two hold short instructions at once -- "cross 25R" is quite likely, though).

Then locate the four mentioned taxiways and the runways on your taxi diagram. Make sure you know where the "ramp" is.

This happens frequently at complex airports, and it isn't always necessary for them to be busy (e.g., Concord, CA can have some really hairy taxi instructions). Ask for progressives if there is any doubt, but do it in addition to your homework, not instead. If Ground gets distracted, it's your certificate on the line, not theirs.

Even at Palo Alto, which is about as simple as a towered airport gets, we've been getting taxi instructions like "Taxi 31 via H Z M" since the parallel (Z) got restriped. If the airport has a taxiway diagram, make sure you have it on you.
 
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Any airport in unfamiliar with I'll have a pen and paper ready to copy instructions. You can also brief the taxi plan that way you have an idea of what to do once you get on the ground.
 
Yeah how are you supposed to hold short of 25R and then contact ground once clear? That part confused me. The rest wasn't so bad.
 
MAKG1 said:
For this purpose, have a note pad out, much like getting an IFR departure clearance.

Write down M M2 B3 B hold 25R 121.9 hold 36L (though it's not very likely you'll get two hold short instructions at once -- "cross 25R" is quite likely, though).

Then locate the four mentioned taxiways and the runways on your taxi diagram. Make sure you know where the "ramp" is.

This happens frequently at complex airports, and it isn't always necessary for them to be busy (e.g., Concord, CA can have some really hairy taxi instructions). Ask for progressives if there is any doubt, but do it in addition to your homework, not instead. If Ground gets distracted, it's your certificate on the line, not theirs.

Even at Palo Alto, which is about as simple as a towered airport gets, we've been getting taxi instructions like "Taxi 31 via H Z M" since the parallel (Z) got restriped. If the airport has a taxiway diagram, make sure you have it on you.
Click to expand...

Flying out of KCHD in the morning, it's always the same message from ground. "Bugsmasher 1234, taxi via alpha - delta, runway 4L" I respond back, "Taxi via alpha - delta, runway 4L, bugsmasher 1234". Even though I know what's always coming, I always write it down. Well... I always wrote it down until Saturday.

On Saturday, I decided I didn't need to have my pen and paper ready. Then I got a different call back from ground. It wasn't even complicated, but because it wasn't what I was expecting, I totally missed it. "Bugsmasher 1234, taxi via Alpha - Hotel, hold short 4L..." They were moving all departing traffic to 4R.

It wasn't complicated at all, but I totally wasn't expecting it, and I wasn't ready to write, so I missed it. I picked up my pen and radioed back. "Please repeat taxi instructions". Ground repeated the instructions, I wrote them all down, and then taxied per the instructions.

Lesson learned - Don't get complacent. Always be ready to write down taxi instructions. Just because they are usually the same, doesn't mean they are always the same.
 
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