Putting the cart before the horse

T

Tim Abbott

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Feb 6, 2010
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W. Newbury, MA
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Tim Abbott
I love surfing ASO.com/controller.com and who doesn't?

Got me to thinking about owning my own. Those that do own, what did you look for in your first purchase?

Here's what I've been thinking, Cessna 182 w/ the Peterson conversion. Living in Mass doesn't really put me in a location for a lot of bush-type flying, but the low stall speeds equal safety to me.

Piper Cherokee 180/235, like the look and payload of these planes. The price on most is very reasonable.

The high end would be a C206 or a Piper Saratoga fixed gear most likely, the payload is what attracts me to these two.

Nothing like thinking big! :yesnod:

Tim
 
I'll be the first to say it. What's your mission? You want enough airplane to accomplish it, and not so much airplane that you can't afford to fly it. The time is right to buy, aircraft are very inexpensive right now. The time is lousy to sell, though.
 
Mission, and Bankroll.....

Before you buy, consider the real expenses beyond the airplane itself: Then take them and break it down into cost per hour of flight time. Mission includes you goal for ownership, how many passengers / cargo / extras you plan to carry / your certifications as a pilot (complex endorsement???)

Time and Condition of/on Airframe and Engine is just a starting point
Pre-Buy Inspection and Airworthiness
Nav-Comm Equipment - Need for Panel Upgrades?
Insurance - Aircaft plus your experience plus locale
Maintenance (Ask me how much this is!)
Surprises (happen all the time!)
Ownership taxes and fees depending on the state in which you register the plane
 
Tim Abbott said:
I love surfing ASO.com/controller.com and who doesn't?

Got me to thinking about owning my own. Those that do own, what did you look for in your first purchase?

Here's what I've been thinking, Cessna 182 w/ the Peterson conversion. Living in Mass doesn't really put me in a location for a lot of bush-type flying, but the low stall speeds equal safety to me.

Piper Cherokee 180/235, like the look and payload of these planes. The price on most is very reasonable.

The high end would be a C206 or a Piper Saratoga fixed gear most likely, the payload is what attracts me to these two.

Nothing like thinking big! :yesnod:

Tim
Click to expand...

Except for you living in Mass., you'd be the perfect airplane ownership partner for me. That's exactly the set of aircraft I'd be looking at. Have fun buying!
 
Mission: would like to transport rescue dogs, but will be for personal use mostly, $100 hamburger type stuff, fly-ins, etc. That could change of course.

I've been trying to determine what insurance costs are, but lets say I purchase a Cherokee 180 @ 100 hours, I honestly have no clue about insurance.

Panel, I'd be hoping to find something with a least a Garmin 430, I'm fairly proficient after using it in the sim for so long.

If I register it in Mass, I'm guessing that I'm gonna pay through the nose like everything else in this crazy state, I'm originally from NH so I can appreciate the Live Free or Die State much more now!

TW-Sorry to see you're so far away! I haven't thought too much about a partner, but that doesn't seem like a bad idea, the instructor I went up with the other day has a 1/3 share in a Baron...not too shabby :)

Tim
 
If you're transporting dogs, a Piper Cherokee Six or Lance would be terrific; that big door on the left side makes loading a breeze, and you can pull out all of the back seats for LOTS of kennel storage.
 
Tim Abbott said:
Mission: would like to transport rescue dogs, but will be for personal use mostly, $100 hamburger type stuff, fly-ins, etc. That could change of course.

I've been trying to determine what insurance costs are, but lets say I purchase a Cherokee 180 @ 100 hours, I honestly have no clue about insurance.

Panel, I'd be hoping to find something with a least a Garmin 430, I'm fairly proficient after using it in the sim for so long.

If I register it in Mass, I'm guessing that I'm gonna pay through the nose like everything else in this crazy state, I'm originally from NH so I can appreciate the Live Free or Die State much more now!

TW-Sorry to see you're so far away! I haven't thought too much about a partner, but that doesn't seem like a bad idea, the instructor I went up with the other day has a 1/3 share in a Baron...not too shabby :)

Tim
Click to expand...


Actually there is no aircraft sales tax in MA. I know you're shocked right... :D

Back in 2002 MA decided to exempt it. I purchased the Trinidad back in June of 2009 and there was no sales tax for registering it in MA.

This article, while not specifically about the exemption, refers to it down near the bottom http://www.eagletribune.com/punews/local_story_100000636.html

There are plenty of other links I found referring to it as well with a quick google search.

Hope this helps.

Also feel free to contact a couple of different insurance companies (AOPA, Avemco, to name a couple) and get some free quotes on the aircraft you're considering. That'll give you a better idea.
 
If you're going to transport rescue dogs, make sure you can get a dog crate into and out of the plane, and have a good place to set it in the plane where you can get the crate door open and dogs in and out of the crate.

BTDT.
 
Ron Levy said:
If you're going to transport rescue dogs, make sure you can get a dog crate into and out of the plane, and have a good place to set it in the plane where you can get the crate door open and dogs in and out of the crate.

BTDT.
Click to expand...
Having transported some rather large dogs in my 172, I can say that you can get a pretty large crate into the back without taking out the seat. We have carried 1 large, 1 medium, and 1 small at the same time. With the seat out, you could get a couple of large crates in.

However, I would recommend a low-wing if you are thinking about doing a lot with dogs because they can much more easily step onto a wing and then jump down than they can use a strut step when trying to get into or out of a plane.:yikes: Suddenly, they have 16 legs, all flailing.

No joke, I'm trying to figure out some sort of doggy ramp/ladder. When faced with a larger dog, it would be so much easier to let them out of their crate and onto the ramp and then taking the empty crate out of the plane than it is to try to move the crate with 100 lb of anxious dog pacing inside the crate as we carry it out.:frown3:
 
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I bet you could build or have someone build a collapsable type ramp that would work for you. Something simple with a hinge.

Tim
 
Tim Abbott said:
I love surfing ASO.com/controller.com and who doesn't?

Got me to thinking about owning my own. Those that do own, what did you look for in your first purchase?

Here's what I've been thinking, Cessna 182 w/ the Peterson conversion. Living in Mass doesn't really put me in a location for a lot of bush-type flying, but the low stall speeds equal safety to me.

Piper Cherokee 180/235, like the look and payload of these planes. The price on most is very reasonable.

The high end would be a C206 or a Piper Saratoga fixed gear most likely, the payload is what attracts me to these two.



Nothing like thinking big! :yesnod:

Tim
Click to expand...

I certainly like what you are looking at. I didn't look at the C206 or Toga because I was a new pilot and didn't need the seats. The 182/235 I think are great choices for a first purchase...or the only purchase in my case.

Justin
 
Low stall speed doesn't mean much, at least when compared with the already low-enough stall speed of a regular C182 (58 mph or 50 knots) - If you have the Peterson kit, you'll just need to fly slower on landing to keep from banging it up. Plus, the Peterson kit means more maintenance, higher fuel costs, etc... Plus, it'll be a lot harder to find one that already has the avionics you want, so you'll be spending more on the panel... Basically, don't get the Peterson version unless you NEED it.

However, a stock C182 is a darn nice bird. I fly one. I've had it to 35 or so states, I've had it to all three coasts (east, west, gulf) from Wisconsin, I've landed it everywhere from gravel strips in the mountains to runway 4R at Chicago Midway. I've got plenty of solo time in it, but I've also taken 4 good-size adults and bags for the weekend and still had 4 hours of fuel on board (and yes, I was within legal W&B limits). In fact, it's almost impossible to load it outside the CG envelope. It's also comfortable enough that I've done a couple of days in the 1000-nm range with only a single fuel stop. It's not particularly sexy, but it fulfills such a wide range of missions, it's quite possibly the best all-around airplane in existence.

The Cherokee 235 is OK, but it's still got the same smallish Cherokee cabin - I find the C182 to be MUCH more comfortable. The 6-seat Pipers are nice, but I get the impression you're a low-time pilot, so the insurance is going to be pretty painful the first year or two with those extra two seats.
 
Thanks Quagmire, appreciate the thoughts on the Peterson kit.

The 6 six seat Pipers are the well at the limit of what I could afford I think, and would maybe even need a partner.

I have kept coming back to the C182 because as you outlined, there isn't much it can't do.

Food for thought!

Tim
 
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