Prepare for AMU pain!

[denverpilot]

It's Annual time!

Great conversation with co-owners about the current squawks... and of course that usual feeling of "hmm, what else might be found and how many AMUs will it cost?".

She hits the shop next week. Usually takes a week or a week plus a few days depending on how busy the shop is.

The "list" is pretty short and minor this year so far:

- Idle mixture seems a touch rich. Figure out if a concern and/or adjust.
- Nosewheel out of balance and losing a little air. Wobbles post-liftoff.
- Opinion on general condition of tires.
- Opinion on how best to make sure we don't get any corrosion on the belly near the tail where a small leak of battery acid from the drain traveled rearward. Specific concern is a couple of blisters on the paint and a small paint gap at a seam.
- Tach is off by at least 50 RPM as measured by 60 Hz lighting.
- AI has a minor case of the leans after extended turns. May be low vacuum, may be Instrument.
- Opinion on condition of nose strut which has a very slow leak of fluid and air. Time to do re-chrome and rebuild, or give it another year? (Mechanic is very pragmatic about these since they can act this way for years. Had to service more than once this year which is more than usual.)
- Pronounced "squeak" when right rudder applied. (Just a hint to double-check everything for binding, wear, other problems.)
- Parking brake inop. Worked until this year. Not critical, just a pet peeve.
- New plastic panel cover rubbing on right-side yoke tube. Adjust panel cover upward.
- Left-side instrument panel lights inop. Find fault. Want my nice instrument lighting back that came with replacing the panel last year.
- Inspection cover screws under vertical stab loose. Mechanic replaces a couple of them, a couple fall out every year. Request a more permanent fix.
- Have noticed a very small streak of grease behind prop on upper cowl a few times. Could be prop hub leak. Per SB info from McCauley, "deep cycle" of prop seems to have cleared it up. Prop is closing on recommended rebuild hours. Monitor and inform mechanic for opinion as to what action recommended if it continues/starts again.
- Alternator whine. Minor. Annoying but not a big deal. Just me the electronics geek being anal. Really started noticing it with new ANR headset.

Upgrades/Mods:

- Install new pax side window with built in 8x11 camera port. (yay!)
- LED landing and taxi light were on order but back ordered. If they happen to arrive on time, toss them in while the lower cowl is off anyway.
- Manual for our PS Engineering intercom seems to indicate it has 30 second audio playback ability. Feature may never have had control button installed. Investigating but not high-priority. Nice-to-have if all it takes is another button installed on the yoke.

Deferred stuff:

- Still haven't decided on avionics upgrades including certified GPS. We know we want it, we just haven't figured out which one or any of the "supporting actors" like CDI upgrades, Aspen, whatever. Not pulling the trigger yet.
(Anyone decides to sell a 430W, put us on your Christmas list. Ha!)
- Engine monitor. We'd like it, but it may make more sense to leave well enough alone for the time being. Definitely a must-have at engine overhaul eventually. If something were to come up engine-wise, might be a good time to do all the engine instrumentation and wiring harness work and get it. We're roughly 500 hours from a 1500 TBO. we know the additional data might ward off big engine bills.
- Exhaust extension. Keep crud off the belly. Again, probably not worth it just for that. Powerflow exhaust probably a good idea if exhaust components require fixes sometime. Short stack means stained belly and more scrubbing work.
- Flap gap seals were discussed last year. Couldn't really justify it. Same thing with fancy speed pants. Might pay for themselves in eight years. Ha.

DIY:

- Our sheepskins are in crappy shape. Time to replace. We also keep toying with the idea of doing an AirTex interior upgrade but time available to do it is problematic. The lovely 70s "goldenrod" interior is a turn-off compared to the nice red/white paint done in the 90s.
- Heat leak... our heater door doesn't close all the way. It might be time to fashion a seasonal way to block off the very impressive light stream of "damn that's hot" air for pilot and passenger comfort. If it was a Florida airplane we'd have all mutinied by now. New window opening helps but it'd be nice if the darn heat never found it's way to the cockpit in Summer.

Just sharing the thoughts and joys of ownership! Constructive comments and heckling, always appreciated!

(Let's see, Jesse will say to put in an Aspen and a 530W, Henning will say to buy SVT, Clark will scoff at our semi-useless non-GPSS autopilot, someone will recommend the engine monitor goes in immediately so we can watch our O-470's lovely non-even induction system as a nice set of peaks and valleys on individual cylinder temps, and Murphey will warn that doing an interior yourself will cost just as much as having someone else do it after the knee surgery a month later. Did I forget anyone? )

 

[Ted]

(Let's see, Jesse will say to put in an Aspen and a 530W, Henning will say to buy SVT, Clark will scoff at our semi-useless non-GPSS autopilot, someone will recommend the engine monitor goes in immediately so we can watch our O-470's lovely non-even induction system as a nice set of peaks and valleys on individual cylinder temps, and Murphey will warn that doing an interior yourself will cost just as much as having someone else do it after the knee surgery a month later. Did I forget anyone? )

The Aspen and 530W are a great package. That's what I'm flying in the 310, and love it. I love it enough that, somewhere down the line, I'm thinking we may get a second Aspen, and a 430W. Although realistically, one should consider the 750 or 650 if considering a 530. The Aspen is great, haven't flown with the G500. SVT is on our upgrade list as well.

The engine monitor is nifty, and I love having it. You may not care. Lots of O-470s seem to do fine without them. I wouldn't go without one on my planes, but I don't own anything with an O-470.

 

[murphey]

I have a heat leak on the pax side - the butterfly door or whatever it is doesn't close tightly. During the winter it's fine. In summer I just put aluminum tape over the opening on the floor. Works fine.

 

[N801BH]

Boy, do I love Experimentals...:wink2:

 

[denverpilot]

We seem to hear that the Aspen plus Garmin is the way to (eventually) go. Appreciate the confirmation, Ted.

I forgot one. I think during our discussion today we'll probably order and add the 3100 MGTOW STC. It's relatively cheap and allows 150 more lbs of crap/human butts to be on board for OSH camping.

It'd pay for itself in about three max-gross trips versus paying to ship the crap ahead of time.

 

[westslopeco]

Do you have a link for the Photo Window? That might be a cool thing to put in our club 182...

 

[Clark1961]

Obviously you must have an Aspen, X30W, and two axis autopilot installed before getting in that unsafe aircraft again!

That 'nough for ya?

Taking the new wingtips to the paint shop next week. Gold Medal shut down so have to get it done off-airport. Wires are pulled in and switches are in the process of being mounted. Should be done by end of next week.

 

[wabower]

Depending on the condition of the current rug, Airtex carpet is dog-simple to install when seats are removed for inspections. If your new interior will be a neutral color (as is typical for your described paint scheme) you can select the carpet color you like and then do other components in stages without excess pain. The original orange carpet in a prior Cessna 180 was pitched in a similar maneuver.

 

[poadeleted21]

Depending on the condition of the current rug, Airtex carpet is dog-simple to install when seats are removed for inspections. If your new interior will be a neutral color (as is typical for your described paint scheme) you can select the carpet color you like and then do other components in stages without excess pain. The original orange carpet in a prior Cessna 180 was pitched in a similar maneuver.

Airtex is what I went with, wouldn't do it again. Very low quality. I did my interior myself and I built the wall panels etc.. myself the only prefab I bought was the airtex carpet. I lost some weight with my interior redo, build the panels out of kydex (no new knees but I'm sure I shortened the lifespan of my current ones) I think I had 40 hours in just cutting the kydex alone. Butcher paper from home depot, cut big and be prepared to climb in and out of the plane 8 dozen times. Total cost for AirTex carpet, kydex, vinyl, sewing the vinyl by a local automotive restoration shop and (free) installation $800

From this

to this

I still have enough vinyl left over to recover the seats, Just haven't got around to it.

 

[airguy]

I have a heat leak on the pax side - the butterfly door or whatever it is doesn't close tightly. During the winter it's fine. In summer I just put aluminum tape over the opening on the floor. Works fine.

I do the same in my 172, the wife hates the heat on her feet, her side gets taped.

 

[denverpilot]

Depending on the condition of the current rug, Airtex carpet is dog-simple to install when seats are removed for inspections. If your new interior will be a neutral color (as is typical for your described paint scheme) you can select the carpet color you like and then do other components in stages without excess pain. The original orange carpet in a prior Cessna 180 was pitched in a similar maneuver.

Thanks Wayne. Appreciate the thought of saving some time while the seats are out.

Surprising the floor carpet is in better shape than that weird fabric on the seats (no tears or rips but they um... smell 35 years old and look dated - and there's sheepskins over them).

The real trouble spot is that the moulding around the pilot's side door has given up holding on so it's kinda stuffed inbetween the aluminum and the carpet to keep it from completely coming off. I've caught my foot on it a couple times getting out and then had to play the "let's squish this back into place" game.

The seats come out easily enough that they probably won't be the hardest part of the job, sadly.

We are flying it enough that a month long "let's tear all this crap out and see how things look underneath" project as a self-done job would be an annoyance as far as down-time goes this year, but maybe it'd make a good winter project if our hangar weren't a good facsimile of a freezer box in winter.

Eventually we'll have to bite the bullet and do it sometime. Right now we're just looking forward to an Annual without too many surprises and then I need to get my *** back up to Nebraska to visit Jesse and finish the damn Instrument rating.

Maybe Gastons.

Co-owner wants to do his Instrument this summer also.

Then OSH.

By then it'll be Fall and we can revisit the interior plan.

Realistically though, unless all three of us could commit to a couple of weeks of solid work on it as a shared project, we're probably going to end up trading money for time and paying someone to do a significant part of it. I truly wish I had a month to screw around with it, as I really do enjoy that kind of work. Once.

Plus, we know we're an older non-zinc-chromated airframe and once the interior is down, the hunt for any corrosion begins in earnest while it's all visible.

Any of those evil Cessna sound-deadening plastic covered lead sheets have to get removed and the glue cleaned off, any corrosion behind them has to be worked, if found (thank goodness for a dry climate!) and then the debate over whether to zinc all the surfaces...

Once the interior comes down I've never heard of there NOT being something found that requires some TLC behind it. I've heard the joke that you pretend you didn't see it and just hurry and put the carpet back up, ha... but I couldn't do it. If we found trouble we'd have to address it.

So appreciate the thought Wayne, but we'll just have to see what this year brings for time available. Maybe we can find a young A&P who's bored who would work on it during weekdays as long as the co-owner isn't hot and heavy into his Instrument.

Bart, yours came out very nice. Thanks for the description and photos!

I'll go dig up the link on the window. It's in e-mail.

 

[murphey]

Option for interior --- I'm pleased with the AirTex interior. Pick out what you'd like for panels & such. Then order just the 4 seats. You strip the seats & sandblast/repaint them (a day at most). Then take the huge box and the seats over to the auto shop at I-25 & Evans. They'll recover the seats with the new material in a couple days for about $450.

Down the road you can do the side panels when convenient.

 

[denverpilot]

The photo window came from these folks.

http://www.glapinc.com/

For the 182, the installation is the same as replacing the window on that side, but no 182 window opening is ever exactly quite the same size, so the plexi needs trimming and the new plexi is thicker at .187" versus the Cessna plexi at .125" so the rubber U-channel is typically omitted.

With the high-wing over it and living 99% of the year in a hangar, that doesn't cause us any heartburn for future possible leaks too much, but the folks there at Great Lakes have detailed install instructions for each type of window and aircraft on the website for download. Highly recommend reading the instructions for your aircraft type and talking to them, as your mileage may vary.

Will report back if our A&P/AI or his stunt double (staff A&Ps) hate us after installing it. Cessna windows in general don't look to be much fun to replace but he's saying he knows the process well.

Says he's put a few of these in before also so he's probably learned any necessary tricks. Kinda sounds like he's looking forward to it. (Probably don't see too many through any shop really. Something different is always more fun I suppose.)

One possible gotcha, and we debated for a while on it, is that we decided to "go big" with the camera hole. Great Plains will do just about any size hole you desire and we talked about whether the larger door will be in the way once it's down and whether it'll be hitting the armrest.

In the end, we decided we wanted the larger opening anyway so it might be a little awkward for the right-seater to get it open without sliding their seat back and it might "stick out" a bit into their side/gut. Realistically it's going to be big enough that the camera person will have to be a bit careful about not scratching it up while wiggling around to get a shot.

We decided that trade-off is worth it for the larger opening. I've shot from some smaller openings in the rear windows of CAP aircraft and have to work at wiggling around significantly to get my shoulders turned and the camera lens pointed through the hole. It'd be nice if those were bigger.

So we went big. Maybe we'll regret it, but we think we'll like the larger opening. Will post photos of the completed install.

Camera strap REQUIRED with the larger opening. You can't get the body of a DSLR through CAP's photo hole. You could toss the whole camera bag through ours.

One possible side-benefit. Flour bombing competitions may have just gotten a whole lot easier! (Not that I've ever had the opportunity. Never seen one done around here, or have just missed them all. )

 

[Skylane81E]

I hate to do it but on the plastic trip pieces get Cessna parts. The available replacements all fit like crap.

 

[wabower]

FYI, a good interior shop in Tyler quoted $1,000 for new headliner and carpet several grades higher than Airtex. I also saved some money by simply removing the seat covers that were in good shape other than the seat-cushion and seat-back fabric and then re-sewing them with sheeps that were cut from the after-market covers available from the various sources. At the same time I replaced the factory-original seat-cushion foam (that had disintigrated into a bowl-shaped butt-burner) with new triple-density foam seat cushions that made a huge difference in comfort on any trip of more than a couple of hours.

We've had good luck with the after-market plastic trim pieces, although their "final trimming required" sticker should probably be in capital letters followed by several !!!

Thanks Wayne. Appreciate the thought of saving some time while the seats are out.

Surprising the floor carpet is in better shape than that weird fabric on the seats (no tears or rips but they um... smell 35 years old and look dated - and there's sheepskins over them).

The real trouble spot is that the moulding around the pilot's side door has given up holding on so it's kinda stuffed inbetween the aluminum and the carpet to keep it from completely coming off. I've caught my foot on it a couple times getting out and then had to play the "let's squish this back into place" game.

The seats come out easily enough that they probably won't be the hardest part of the job, sadly.

We are flying it enough that a month long "let's tear all this crap out and see how things look underneath" project as a self-done job would be an annoyance as far as down-time goes this year, but maybe it'd make a good winter project if our hangar weren't a good facsimile of a freezer box in winter.

Eventually we'll have to bite the bullet and do it sometime. Right now we're just looking forward to an Annual without too many surprises and then I need to get my *** back up to Nebraska to visit Jesse and finish the damn Instrument rating.

Maybe Gastons.

Co-owner wants to do his Instrument this summer also.

Then OSH.

By then it'll be Fall and we can revisit the interior plan.

Realistically though, unless all three of us could commit to a couple of weeks of solid work on it as a shared project, we're probably going to end up trading money for time and paying someone to do a significant part of it. I truly wish I had a month to screw around with it, as I really do enjoy that kind of work. Once.

Plus, we know we're an older non-zinc-chromated airframe and once the interior is down, the hunt for any corrosion begins in earnest while it's all visible.

Any of those evil Cessna sound-deadening plastic covered lead sheets have to get removed and the glue cleaned off, any corrosion behind them has to be worked, if found (thank goodness for a dry climate!) and then the debate over whether to zinc all the surfaces...

Once the interior comes down I've never heard of there NOT being something found that requires some TLC behind it. I've heard the joke that you pretend you didn't see it and just hurry and put the carpet back up, ha... but I couldn't do it. If we found trouble we'd have to address it.

So appreciate the thought Wayne, but we'll just have to see what this year brings for time available. Maybe we can find a young A&P who's bored who would work on it during weekdays as long as the co-owner isn't hot and heavy into his Instrument.

Bart, yours came out very nice. Thanks for the description and photos!

I'll go dig up the link on the window. It's in e-mail.

 

[gismo]

- AI has a minor case of the leans after extended turns. May be low vacuum, may be Instrument.

This may be "normal" behavior. If you make a constant bank turn of exactly 360° (or any multiple of that) precession should cancel the erection force resulting in an accurate wings level indication immediately after the turn. But if you don't finish on the heading you started with the cancellation is incomplete and there will be some error in the roll indication. A turn of 180° generates the most error and varying the bank during the turn has a similar but smaller effect IIRC.

Manual for our PS Engineering intercom seems to indicate it has 30 second audio playback ability. Feature may never have had control button installed. Investigating but not high-priority. Nice-to-have if all it takes is another button installed on the yoke.

Most if not all of the PS Engineering audio panels with audio recording/playback provide a means to activate playback using a combination of buttons on the unit's front panel. For example on my PMA8000 I can initiate playback by pressing the Com1 or Com2 receive button for one second. You may be able to verify that the playback function exists and is working with the method appropriate to your audio panel. I'm pretty certain that if the feature exists it can also be activated via an external button.

 

[denverpilot]

Thanks for all the info guys. Will post more info on the Annual as it progresses. This year the new job is a long way from the shop so I don't know if I'll get to stop in at lunch and peek like I usually did in previous years.

 

[murphey]

Thanks for all the info guys. Will post more info on the Annual as it progresses. This year the new job is a long way from the shop so I don't know if I'll get to stop in at lunch and peek like I usually did in previous years.

Which shop is doing the annual?

 

[Dan Thomas]

I hate to do it but on the plastic trip pieces get Cessna parts. The available replacements all fit like crap.

You would be referring to the Plane Plastics stuff. They make theirs thicker, but I think they took their molds from the Cessna panels and making them thicker means the inside dimensions got smaller, so they don't fit well over the doors and doorposts and so on.

There's another, better idea: fiberglass interior panels. UV and low temps don't bother them so much and they can be easily repaired. Tougher stuff, too. http://www.selkirk-aviation.com/170.html

Dan

 

[Skylane81E]

You would be referring to the Plane Plastics stuff. They make theirs thicker, but I think they took their molds from the Cessna panels and making them thicker means the inside dimensions got smaller, so they don't fit well over the doors and doorposts and so on.

There's another, better idea: fiberglass interior panels. UV and low temps don't bother them so much and they can be easily repaired. Tougher stuff, too. http://www.selkirk-aviation.com/170.html

Dan

Indeed I am, a week plus to do a plane plastic interior the labor cost made the Cessna parts look cheap by comparison

 

[denverpilot]

Which shop is doing the annual?

Mountain Air. Greg's been working on the airplane since before he started his business, looking back through the logs. Former owner was in Boulder and flew over to BJC for close to a decade.

We've also used Arapahoe Aero and John does good work too, but the habit to continue Annuals with Greg is because of his availability to answer questions, etc. But John's good about that too.

Example: John did the bladder tank replacement since obviously we were grounded at APA when the left tank gave up the ghost and did the "Cessna blue smurf barf" all down the left side of the aircraft one night.

John also handled a cowl flap extension repair this year just because it seemed silly to shuttle the aircraft across town for that one.

Greg has been excellent when something small has come up or something needs tweaked after a more major repair also. Fly up there after a phone call to make sure he's available and taxi over and he'll come out and pop the cowl or climb under the panel and fix it on the spot. John's shop is a little more formal and will want a reservation and will send someone over to tug the airplane from the hangar to the shop and back if we drop off the keys.

I think generally we kinda like mixing the two. If someone's missing something the general feel is that the other shop might catch it. Can't say that we've actually seen that happen yet, though.

I can't say we've really ever run into a "bad" shop yet in the Metro area.

You guys obviously have the most laid back deal for owner-assist out there at FTG than anywhere else in town. More of a "community" feel out there vs all-business. You also have better hangar rates and cheaper fuel. We just can't give up the convenience of 10 minutes from two of our houses.

Here's the really interesting one: Greg bills immediately. John's shop is often months behind. That has had us all scratching our heads for a long time. Also makes budgeting a little weird. We prepare to pay the bill and sit on the cash waiting for an invoice.

Sometimes the logbook stickers are delayed that long too, which really isn't 100% kosher.

We thought it was "just the luck of the draw" on timing until it happened more than once and I confirmed it with a Cirrus owner at APA in casual conversation one day.

I honestly don't know why, but it's been consistent for as long as the co-owners have owned the LLC. They bought 79M three years before I joined.

And having had the airplane in two different shops in Nebraska, I can say literally that I haven't yet seen a bad shop in Nebraska yet either!

I have a friend in AZ who says no matter what we're paying, his guy down there will beat everyone's pricing. He's also REALLY sharp. I've chatted with him on the phone a few times for opinions on things and I'd love to visit him and do an owner-assisted Annual. I can tell I'd learn a ton. We discussed me flying the aircraft down there and doing that last year, but there's a little nervousness about possibly finding something that would take time and the aircraft being stuck down there and the fact that the other co-owners haven't met the guy. I can vouch for him and my friend all I want, it still might not "feel" right for everyone. And everyone happy I a co-ownership is worth a few bucks, at the end of the day.

If it weren't a co-ownership, I'd be making an annual pilgrimage to see this guy in Phoenix. He's "retired", only takes new customers on referrals, and loves to get owners hands dirty and show them things. Need more like him. Everywhere. Not really realistic though.

 

[steingar]

My transponder just failed it's check (at annual my mechanic saw it was overdue for its certification). Well, it's busted, and that will likely push the cost my annual up over the $4K mark for a Cherokee.

 

[wabower]

Local guy is quite reasonable on rebuild charges if you want a quote.

My transponder just failed it's check (at annual my mechanic saw it was overdue for its certification). Well, it's busted, and that will likely push the cost my annual up over the $4K mark for a Cherokee.

 

[Skylane81E]

What type of transponder?

 

[steingar]

What type of transponder?

A broken one.

 

[Ted]

The transponder in the 310 is having a few minor issues. In looking at it, it ended up making more sense to throw in a new GTX327. It's a Collins transponder, and a diode is dead, which I'm told is difficult to find. I'm sure some places have them. Of course, it's a 30-year-old transponder as well, so it doesn't owe us anything.

If your transponder is going to be a pain to repair, may want to consider a GTX327. Our quote is about $2k installed.

 

[steingar]

If your transponder is going to be a pain to repair, may want to consider a GTX327. Our quote is about $2k installed.

Ours has been in service about 600 hours. I don't even remember what it is, sorry. The repair estimates are well south of that, so I told them to fix it.

 

[Skylane81E]

Ours has been in service about 600 hours. I don't even remember what it is, sorry. The repair estimates are well south of that, so I told them to fix it.

excellent. In reality ~4K for an annual with a tango-uniform transponder isn't horrible.

 

[steingar]

excellent. In reality ~4K for an annual with a tango-uniform transponder isn't horrible.

I keep telling myself that...

In truth, I've had a lot of trouble with that transponder not giving the right code, so I'm not all that surprised. My airplane partner never saw it and thought I was nuts. At least I get a little vindication.

What do you guys charge for an inspection of a PA28-140 over there?

 

[Skylane81E]

$65 an hr, no flat rate.

BUT I can tell you that 12hrs or less would suffice, one of the more recent ones I completed was about 10hrs plus discrepancies.

 

[steingar]

$65 an hr, no flat rate.

BUT I can tell you that 12hrs or less would suffice, one of the more recent ones I completed was about 10hrs plus discrepancies.

Maybe I'll bring it to you next time and stick around to help. Let me guess, that costs extra!

 

[Skylane81E]

It did the last time, but that is because it took me longer to answer the owners questions than to have just done the work.

One reason we don't flat rate, you save me time you save money but if you make me take longer...

We'd be happy to have ya, and will even be a little closer to you next year.

FWIW I've got two 140s in for annual right now.

 

[denverpilot]

Whelen LED landing and taxi light on back order arrived from Texas this morning so I delivered them across town to Mountain Air. They'll be installed next week.

Chatted with Greg. His flight school (Rocky Mountain Flight School) sounds like its busy and doing well. Same with the shop. Busy. Wasn't an open spot to put an airplane in any of the multiple hangars. Makes me happy that someone's doing okay in Aviation!

Engine and wing inspections and stuff under the floor are done. Seats and carpet are still out, buttoning up cabin next week.

Squawk list isn't started yet, they were focusing on the inspection. Window installation likewise. Good to have the inspection and any "gotchas" out of the way first.

Compression came up on our low cylinder (#2). Lowest is now 74 and highest is 78 (#1). Always good news. Greg confirmed that "fly the hell out of it" is the best way to treat an O-470.

Right main gear tire is just about dead as expected. He was concerned it won't last the Summer if T&G/lots of landings are made. He joked, "Tires are cheap, props are expensive!" and confirmed that if a tire goes it'd probably beat up the wheel pants bad.

Previous owner had paid the big bucks for Goodyear Flight IIIs and they lasted a long time. Greg's recommendation was replacement while she's at his shop. He says he's been getting similar service life out of Condor tires in the 600x6 for half the price. Offered a nice deal on them that I won't go into but it's a great price.

Thoughts from the peanut gallery on the Condor tires? Probably just go with his offer but always interested in other thoughts.

Nose-gear tire is good "for another 600 hours". He's going to take a close look at bearings and balance it since its wobbling at takeoff pretty good.

Carpet when it's out in a pile sure looks shabby. He said he's had good service and fit from the Airtex carpets in the 182. (He was careful to say in the 182 so that might indirectly say something.) Didn't recommend fancy carpet in it. "It's an airplane." Of course he says it's our call. (He's always very good about that. Tell ya his opinion but it's your airplane...)

Seats and tracks did fine on the new Cessna instructions/AD for inspection. I took a close look and even their paint is in pretty good shape for 36 year old seats. No busted seat pan straps, etc. Mechanically good. Getting them recovered if we do that anytime soon should be a cinch.

I got to get a good look back down the tail too and around the engine compartment. All looks good. I'm a neat freak so I kinda wanted to grab rags and clean the firewall good, but I'd probavly get funny looks at 16:30 on a Friday near closing time! Can see where we've dribbled oil down the dipstick and baked it on various things, which drives me nuts, but nothing wrong with that.

Corrosion just isn't much of a problem in our ultra-dry climate. Not a sign of it anywhere.

Man I never noticed what a cavern a 182 is with everything taken out! Big.

So, looks like we'll have a happy Annual this year. No surprises yet. (Knock on my wooden head.) Another week to do the window, go through squawks, and button her up for the trip home to KAPA. One of the other co-owners has his schedule set up for that late next week.

Oh... he tempted me with a Garmin 430W for $8K installed. Not including CDI upgrade needed. And just as good a price (higher of course) on the new touch-screen model with new CDI. Sigh. Haha. Maybe... later. (I'm close to cracking open the piggy bank on avionics toys but ... patience...)

That's all the news from sunny, amazingly non-windy for Springtime KBJC. Oh, other than they're doing demolition on the old control tower. Kinda sad about that. But progress is good.

 

[Gary]

Thoughts from the peanut gallery on the Condor tires? Probably just go with his offer but always interested in other thoughts.

Have used them before with good results, a cost-effective solution. Just replaced all three on the Cherokee, thought I'd try the Dresser Monster re-treads. They are certainly "beefer" than the old Condors. Interestingly enough, the re-treads are Condors. Guess I'll find out how they work. Did buy the Air-Stop tubes, they are great!

Gary

 

[N801BH]

Have used them before with good results, a cost-effective solution. Just replaced all three on the Cherokee, thought I'd try the Dresser Monster re-treads. They are certainly "beefer" than the old Condors. Interestingly enough, the re-treads are Condors. Guess I'll find out how they work. Did buy the Air-Stop tubes, they are great!

Gary

+1....... Desser Monsters and Airstops......


Nate, save to old tire for a core to ship to them...

 

[Skylane81E]

We use tem other flight school, the ones that have been installed on the advanced trainers that don't wear out the tires as quickly seem t not hold up to dry rot as well as more expensive tires, but for the price difference cost is still lower with the condors.

 

[Tom-D]

It's Annual time!

Great conversation with co-owners about the current squawks... and of course that usual feeling of "hmm, what else might be found and how many AMUs will it cost?".

She hits the shop next week. Usually takes a week or a week plus a few days depending on how busy the shop is.

The "list" is pretty short and minor this year so far:

- Idle mixture seems a touch rich. Figure out if a concern and/or adjust.
- Nosewheel out of balance and losing a little air. Wobbles post-liftoff.
- Opinion on general condition of tires.
- Opinion on how best to make sure we don't get any corrosion on the belly near the tail where a small leak of battery acid from the drain traveled rearward. Specific concern is a couple of blisters on the paint and a small paint gap at a seam.
- Tach is off by at least 50 RPM as measured by 60 Hz lighting.
- AI has a minor case of the leans after extended turns. May be low vacuum, may be Instrument.
- Opinion on condition of nose strut which has a very slow leak of fluid and air. Time to do re-chrome and rebuild, or give it another year? (Mechanic is very pragmatic about these since they can act this way for years. Had to service more than once this year which is more than usual.)
- Pronounced "squeak" when right rudder applied. (Just a hint to double-check everything for binding, wear, other problems.)
- Parking brake inop. Worked until this year. Not critical, just a pet peeve.
- New plastic panel cover rubbing on right-side yoke tube. Adjust panel cover upward.
- Left-side instrument panel lights inop. Find fault. Want my nice instrument lighting back that came with replacing the panel last year.
- Inspection cover screws under vertical stab loose. Mechanic replaces a couple of them, a couple fall out every year. Request a more permanent fix.
- Have noticed a very small streak of grease behind prop on upper cowl a few times. Could be prop hub leak. Per SB info from McCauley, "deep cycle" of prop seems to have cleared it up. Prop is closing on recommended rebuild hours. Monitor and inform mechanic for opinion as to what action recommended if it continues/starts again.
- Alternator whine. Minor. Annoying but not a big deal. Just me the electronics geek being anal. Really started noticing it with new ANR headset.

Upgrades/Mods:

- Install new pax side window with built in 8x11 camera port. (yay!)
- LED landing and taxi light were on order but back ordered. If they happen to arrive on time, toss them in while the lower cowl is off anyway.
- Manual for our PS Engineering intercom seems to indicate it has 30 second audio playback ability. Feature may never have had control button installed. Investigating but not high-priority. Nice-to-have if all it takes is another button installed on the yoke.

Deferred stuff:

- Still haven't decided on avionics upgrades including certified GPS. We know we want it, we just haven't figured out which one or any of the "supporting actors" like CDI upgrades, Aspen, whatever. Not pulling the trigger yet.
(Anyone decides to sell a 430W, put us on your Christmas list. Ha!)
- Engine monitor. We'd like it, but it may make more sense to leave well enough alone for the time being. Definitely a must-have at engine overhaul eventually. If something were to come up engine-wise, might be a good time to do all the engine instrumentation and wiring harness work and get it. We're roughly 500 hours from a 1500 TBO. we know the additional data might ward off big engine bills.
- Exhaust extension. Keep crud off the belly. Again, probably not worth it just for that. Powerflow exhaust probably a good idea if exhaust components require fixes sometime. Short stack means stained belly and more scrubbing work.
- Flap gap seals were discussed last year. Couldn't really justify it. Same thing with fancy speed pants. Might pay for themselves in eight years. Ha.

DIY:

- Our sheepskins are in crappy shape. Time to replace. We also keep toying with the idea of doing an AirTex interior upgrade but time available to do it is problematic. The lovely 70s "goldenrod" interior is a turn-off compared to the nice red/white paint done in the 90s.
- Heat leak... our heater door doesn't close all the way. It might be time to fashion a seasonal way to block off the very impressive light stream of "damn that's hot" air for pilot and passenger comfort. If it was a Florida airplane we'd have all mutinied by now. New window opening helps but it'd be nice if the darn heat never found it's way to the cockpit in Summer.

Just sharing the thoughts and joys of ownership! Constructive comments and heckling, always appreciated!

(Let's see, Jesse will say to put in an Aspen and a 530W, Henning will say to buy SVT, Clark will scoff at our semi-useless non-GPSS autopilot, someone will recommend the engine monitor goes in immediately so we can watch our O-470's lovely non-even induction system as a nice set of peaks and valleys on individual cylinder temps, and Murphey will warn that doing an interior yourself will cost just as much as having someone else do it after the knee surgery a month later. Did I forget anyone? )

Another owner believing in the 13th month maintenance period.

 

[denverpilot]

Another owner believing in the 13th month maintenance period.

We discuss things as they come up. If something's worth doing between Annuals, the aircraft goes in immediately. Nothing on the list given here was.

We had other items done throughout the year, including nose strut in LNK while I was there (nice shop, nice folks) in December and some other stuff as needed at KAPA. Last year that included one of the bladder tanks. No big deal. If someone says it needs to be done, we don't argue about it. We don't ground the aircraft for minor stuff though, either.

And yes, the aircraft usually goes in at the end of the month and comes out in the next. But we never gain a full month from that nor expect to. Downtime is downtime and it takes whatever it takes.

With a list of deferred items we expect about two weeks of downtime around Annual and then anything that comes up that's serious within the year.

If it takes longer than two, we're fine with that too. No expectation (like some) that our visit to our favorite shop will be short if there's a list of squawks. This year's list is slightly longer than any other year's.

Not sure what your expectation is, Tom. Fly it across town every time a screw is loose? Put it in the local shop?

Most of that list was wish list items. Out of the must-check items, which one bothers you or triggered the 13 month comment? I'm curious.

 

[Tom-D]

We discuss things as they come up. If something's worth doing between Annuals, the aircraft goes in immediately. Nothing on the list given here was.

We had other items done throughout the year, including nose strut in LNK while I was there (nice shop, nice folks) in December and some other stuff as needed at KAPA. Last year that included one of the bladder tanks. No big deal. If someone says it needs to be done, we don't argue about it. We don't ground the aircraft for minor stuff though, either.

And yes, the aircraft usually goes in at the end of the month and comes out in the next. But we never gain a full month from that nor expect to. Downtime is downtime and it takes whatever it takes.

With a list of deferred items we expect about two weeks of downtime around Annual and then anything that comes up that's serious within the year.

If it takes longer than two, we're fine with that too. No expectation (like some) that our visit to our favorite shop will be short if there's a list of squawks. This year's list is slightly longer than any other year's.

Not sure what your expectation is, Tom. Fly it across town every time a screw is loose? Put it in the local shop?

Most of that list was wish list items. Out of the must-check items, which one bothers you or triggered the 13 month comment? I'm curious.

If it is a maintenance period why call it an annual?

 

[hindsight2020]

Yep, between this thread and the latest philosophical discussion I had this week with the AP while rejecting 3 AMU in PMA parts and labor off non-airworthiness-related items in the proposed estimate while the warrior is on annual, I'm pretty much sold. I don't need the back seats or the FAA. Going experimental hopefully by the end of the year.

I work for a living, I can't give that kind of charity away for the legal permission to loaf along at 100 Gknots. I recognize most of the folks with ">2 on board" mission profiles are about screwed out of options, but for my mission (90% solo 10% female pax) it just doesn't make any sense to keep sponsoring this insanity. It's not about price tags, it's about value. I'm finally convinced I can get much better value out of my hard earned liquid by operating ex-AB, even after accounting for a higher initial capital outlay, which was the item that kept me from making the psychological jump. I tell ya though, as I watch that simple warrior give me reliable but expensive service and wondering in what salvage yard it's gonna end up in due time, it dawns on me our Country's GA needs 'owner-maintenance experimental' like a fat kid needs a treadmill-powered XBOX.

BTW congrats OP on being satisfied with your annual experience. We all need good news every now and then!