Plane prices; The sky is falling.....

[thepetrostate]

Even now?

We just bought a second plane, a '48 Ercoupe, with two friends. My total outlay: $6,000.

That's less than I paid for a MOTORCYCLE in 1988.

Aircraft ownership CAN be affordable. To claim otherwise is simply wrong. And it's a fantastic time to buy.

You apparently don't understand what an elitist comment this is.

 

[thepetrostate]

That's why I financed my plane with an aircraft loan. If things go south, they can take the plane, but not your house. Its worth the slightly higher interest rate to me.

Double check to make sure that you aren't wholly and personally liable, including your house. I have rarely seen non-recourse financing for the typical GA plane owner.

 

[sba55]

I think the price of all planes is still headed down slightly. Which is bad for me, cause I'm trying to sell one now. No one aircraft will be spared, but I think that just like the auto market, some niche planes will suffer less than others. IMO the IO-520/540/550 CI, 300HP gas gulpers will be affected. The C150, with an O-200, or the Aeronca with a C-90 will be less affected.

I wouldn't worry about it. The big engines are as or more efficient as the smaller engines. This is especially true since most larger planes tend to have better fuel flow/egt related instrumentation and are easier to lean with precision. I doubt that I could ever fly a 172 with the kind of MPGs I'm used to seeing from the Bonanza, and even if I could, I'd be going a lot slower. 170/11.9gph is still over 14mpg. Can't beat that in a 172. The DA40s get close, but even those admittedly very fuel efficient airplanes don't save more than a gallon an hour, if that. On my recent trip to Gaston's, I averaged 13.9 gph. That's with all the high speed passes (which, at 27 gph, are pretty expensive ), and WOT and 168KTAS. I don't think that figure would have been better in any other SE GA airplane I can think of.

I read a study somewhere that compared the fuel efficiency of a IO550 against a 520. The 550 came out ahead. I've noticed a similar trend for the 360 vs. the 520, as well.

All that said, I think it's about the airplane, not the engine. Bonanzas really haven't been deprecating much. 182s are another question. Any airplane that's not designed to go fast will probably deprecate quite a bit.

-Felix

 

[flyingcheesehead]

All that said, I think it's about the airplane, not the engine. Bonanzas really haven't been deprecating much. 182s are another question. Any airplane that's not designed to go fast will probably deprecate quite a bit.

*cough* Look back at the OP...

I just had a sad journey though ebay single engine planes for sale. It was disheartening. There's a beautiful '56 Bonanza on there for less than $30k, BIN for $38k. A nice clean Navion bidding $15k now, and not much action.

If you are in the market for a plane, or know a couple of guys that are, now or very soon is the time to strike. I didn't even look at the twin engine section. Too depressing.

Hopefully I'll be able to buy a plane sometime relatively soon. What scares me is, I don't think the downward price slide is going to stop. There's a lot of old airplanes out there, but there aren't a whole lot of new pilots. As that trend continues, prices will continue to fall, and unfortunately I think that in another 30-40 years there will be a lot of entire types that aren't flying any more.

As for the twins, I've followed the Twin Comanche market for a long time. They usually go *up* in price when fuel prices go up, simply because they're one of the most efficient twins ever built (probably THE most efficient, before the Diamond TwinStar came out). This time, however, they're tanking with everything else. I watched a plane for several months, starting in about September or so, that was very well equipped, modern panel, etc. and would have sold for $120K just a couple of years ago, even if it DIDN'T have de-ice (it did, pretty rare for a PA30/39). The price kept going down, and down, and down. The last listed price was $74,900 and I'm pretty sure it went for less than that when it finally sold in May (9 months after I started watching it)! Ouch.

My timing for my purchase could not have been much worse, could it?

I wouldn't worry about it if I were you - You got an absolutely beautiful airplane. Even if you decided to sell today, yours would be one of the ones that would sell fairly quickly. Besides, I think the price slide started before you bought anyway.

But I ain't sellin' ennyhoo.

And that's the key - It's just like stocks. You haven't really lost the money until you sell!

 

[wanttaja]

I've had a "Fly Babies for Sale" section on my Fly Baby web page for about ten years. Normally, they take a while to sell...single-seat airplanes don't appeal to that many people.

But in the last year or so, they're selling MUCH more quickly. I'm aware of at least two that changed hands just in the last couple of months.

Guess there's something about "$25/hour for gas" that attracts folks, these days....

Ron Wanttaja

 

[Bill]

Hopefully I'll be able to buy a plane sometime relatively soon. What scares me is, I don't think the downward price slide is going to stop. There's a lot of old airplanes out there, but there aren't a whole lot of new pilots. As that trend continues, prices will continue to fall, and unfortunately I think that in another 30-40 years there will be a lot of entire types that aren't flying any more.

I was talking with my neighbor about the housing market, he thinks it will get much worse. As all the baby boomers start leaving this world, who is going to buy all these homes?

Look at who owns most of the aircraft, the same thing is going to happen :-(

 

[timwinters]

Unless your CPA is a pilot, that's not the type of info they keep up with...

I really don't think that's an excuse. My CPA notified me of this provision earlier this year and she knows nothing about flying. A good CPA should be familiar with nearly all the tax laws that affect you not just the ones that are akin to their hobbies.

As all the baby boomers start leaving this world, who is going to buy all these homes?

The 100 million people who are here now who weren't here in the late 60s. I don't foresee the population of this country going down anytime soon and, that being the case, when the last baby boomers dies it really won't affect much.

I can remember when the media "threw a big party" back in 1967 (or so) when the country passed 200m. We passed 300m in 2006. It's predicted that we'll pass 400m about 2040. I think there will be plenty of folks around to buy those houses.

 

[mikea]

I was talking with my neighbor about the housing market, he thinks it will get much worse. As all the baby boomers start leaving this world, who is going to buy all these homes?

We aren't going anywhere. We have to live to 99 so youse youngsters pay 50% of your paycheck in FICA deductions to support us.

AND GET OFF MY LAWN!