Plane down in segoville TX

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Unfortunate end to the flight,may he rest in peace.
 
Listening, it is apparent that the pilot was having some situational awareness problems. Very chilling.
 
SCCutler said:
Listening, it is apparent that the pilot was having some situational awareness problems. Very chilling.
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Just looking at the FA track made that obvious.

Folks, if the 2nd approach attempt didn't work, it really is time to go somewhere else. There are way to many 3rd+ attempts that end up looking like this.
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Just looking at the FA track made that obvious.

Folks, if the 2nd approach attempt didn't work, it really is time to go somewhere else. There are way to many 3rd+ attempts that end up looking like this.
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And they never turn out good either...:no:.......:sad:
 
Uh.... I am starting to think this ended on the pilot's terms. Sorry if that is harsh but...

15:20 "Well if you are tired of flying the airplane, we can find another airport with better weather conditions"

15:32 "climb and maintain 2000"
15:40 "climb up to 2000"

16:01 "Low alt. alert"
16:26 "Radar contact lost"

Prior, he had reported 8 hours of fuel remaining.

http://archive-server.liveatc.net/kdal/KDAL-App-Dep-North-Dec-19-2014-0000Z.mp3
 
Very sad and tragic. The controller offered to get a controller who is a pilot to help. Even offered another airport that had a 2200' ceiling.

With the LPV to RWY35 he should have been able to get below the clouds that were at 600' and with 5 miles visibility.
 
What I don't understand is why the controller asked for procedure turn inbound report to LPV RWY35. It doesn't have one.
 
yep. something doesn't add up.

We can't hear the pilot's side but based on controller responses we can infer the pilot stated he was tired of flying the plane and gone less than a minute later...

I am aware I am doing that thing where you make assumptions without having the full story and I deserve a bit of backlash for doing that but something doesn't seem right.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I am aware I am doing that thing where you make assumptions without having the full story and I deserve a bit of backlash for doing that but something doesn't seem right.
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get-theritis is insidious, you tell yourself it's okay and believe it

dual 430w, G500, GPSS w/KFC 200 - unless something was broken the aircraft could have flown the approach with the pilot just trimming the nose down (and pulling the throttle) to fly the vertical guidance

"something" was really wrong
 
Intoxicated?:confused:

The actions of the pilot just don't make sense:confused:
 
how could it be possible that after that flight he has 8 hours of fuel on board??? Something is definitely very wrong...

And I agree with those avionics (provided he knew what to do with them and they were working right, which one can assume they are based on his comms with ATC) there's no reason why this guy should have had to fly all over creation to get down safely...esp with 2200' decks...

Plane looks registered to Charles Jinks and making the assumption that he's the one flying the plane... Appears to definitely have the chops to handle the situation here:

Date of Issue: 4/8/2010
Certificate: COMMERCIAL PILOT
Ratings:
COMMERCIAL PILOT
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE
PRIVATE PRIVILEGES
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND

Limits:
ENGLISH PROFICIENT.
 
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Clark1961 said:
get-theritis is insidious, you tell yourself it's okay and believe it



dual 430w, G500, GPSS w/KFC 200 - unless something was broken the aircraft could have flown the approach with the pilot just trimming the nose down (and pulling the throttle) to fly the vertical guidance



"something" was really wrong
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I was thinking the same thing when I saw the equipment list. The FlightAware profile looks a like a pilot hand flying poorly or dealing with an equipment problem. When the controller told him to go to YAEGR and he was having problems navigating there, something was up.

If he was flying the LPV, the hardware he had on board, if functional and engaged would have easily handled the approach even he couldn't.
 
I haven't listened to the recordings yet, but is it possible it was suicide? Pilot decides to go fly a bunch of approaches and then calls it quits....literally? It has happened before.
 
Fearless Tower said:
I haven't listened to the recordings yet, but is it possible it was suicide? Pilot decides to go fly a bunch of approaches and then calls it quits....literally? It has happened before.
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Was hesitant to say it but this is my current guess

Seemed like an odd way to do it but then got to thinking if ever someone wanted to go that route, the GA plane is a smart way to go and life insurance pays out since it is not ruled as such.
 
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Pilot incapacitation seems plausible: perhaps CO, drugs, sleep deprivation, diabetic hypoglycemia, seizure, stroke, or other medical event.

The same factors that impaired the pilot's ability to fly the approach may also have undermined the pilot's judgement of whether to keep trying or to divert.
 
Someone is going to come on here and chew everyone's butt for Monday morning quarter backing....mark my words. But.....this makes me think a bit about some older folks with high blood pressure where stress could be a issue. Flying a bunch of approaches missed, trying to get home would put a lot of stress on a person. Not saying that's what happened, but something for others to think about.

God bless him and God speed.

Aaron
 
kenjr said:
how could it be possible that after that flight he has 8 hours of fuel on board??? Something is definitely very wrong...

And I agree with those avionics (provided he knew what to do with them and they were working right, which one can assume they are based on his comms with ATC) there's no reason why this guy should have had to fly all over creation to get down safely...esp with 2200' decks...

Plane looks registered to Charles Jinks and making the assumption that he's the one flying the plane... Appears to definitely have the chops to handle the situation here:

Date of Issue: 4/8/2010
Certificate: COMMERCIAL PILOT
Ratings:
COMMERCIAL PILOT
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE
PRIVATE PRIVILEGES
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND

Limits:
ENGLISH PROFICIENT.
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We're operating that the PF was Mr. Jinks. That could be in error and the PF was someone else not as proficient a pilot in general nor familiar with the aircraft systems.


None the less, this is an important reminder to me that if after making a 2nd missed approach at my primary destination, it's time to determine a better alternative and start working a plan with the controllers.
 
Tired of flying the airplane.. that makes me think of:

Resignation

Everyone has a limit, and at some point, each of us will recognize that we have reached it and resign ourselves to the consequences. We say, "There's nothing more I can do," or "I can't do that." This resignation becomes hazardous when a pilot gives up when faced with difficult situations. Those with a hazardous resignation attitude believe that they have little control over their own destiny-that fate or bad luck is the cause of their misfortune.
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Aaronk25 said:
Someone is going to come on here and chew everyone's butt for Mondaymorning quarter[]backing[.] [M]ark my words.
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"Monday-morning quarterbacking" refers to retroactive advice about what someone should have done differently. Here, the only such advice has been that after a few disoriented missed approaches, the pilot should have diverted to nearby VMC. That's so obviously correct that I can't imagine why you're confident that someone will come here and "chew everyone's butt" for that assessment.

But[,] this makes me think a bit about some older folks with high blood pressure where stress could be a issue. Flying a bunch of approaches missed, trying to get home would put a lot of stress on a person. Not saying that's what happened, but something for others to think about.
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While some sort of medical incapacitation is plausible (see earlier posts), there's no apparent basis for speculating about one specific medical problem. Why that one in particular?
 
AggieMike88 said:
None the less, this is an important reminder to me that if after making a 2nd missed approach at my primary destination, it's time to determine a better alternative and start working a plan with the controllers.
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Did the pilot go missed more than once? I'm not familiar with the approaches there but all the maneuvering to the south looks like he didn't really get started on the final approach but once.
 
Controller mentions at least 4 misses and then sets him up for another
 
might have just been referring to the waypoint though.
He kept trying to set him up for Yeager and the guy kept not getting it.
 
I am a very low time pilot, so I may be way off here. Why not fly it to the runway? After 5 misses, the avionics in the airplane could take you to the threshold. Could it not? Your chances are better than zero even if you break out at 100 feet. I am not speaking as knowing, I am asking, in an extreme situation, wouldn't you just fly it in?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
mikeinbama said:
I am a very low time pilot, so I may be way off here. Why not fly it to the runway? After 5 misses, the avionics in the airplane could take you to the threshold. Could it not? Your chances are better than zero even if you break out at 100 feet. I am not speaking as knowing, I am asking, in an extreme situation, wouldn't you just fly it in?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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That's a good question to ask.
And that is also why I speculate that something was wrong emotionally, chemically, or medically with the pilot

His best option was to do what ATC asked and fly to Denton where it was broken at 2200. Nothing he did is logical at this point.
My Friday Morning QB opinion is that he planned to not land.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
His best option was to do what ATC asked and fly to Denton where it was broken at 2200.
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Even if it was lower than BKN 2200, DTO has that MASLR setup for RWY 18 that the tower can really crank up to super bright. Nearly as bright as that monster TV at TMS.

One VFR night coming back from Tulsa, it was on a medium intensity and easily spotted as I was passing KGLE.

So as the QB'ing is trying to figure out, there are still many "why did this happen" questions to be answered here
 
Fearless Tower said:
I haven't listened to the recordings yet, but is it possible it was suicide? Pilot decides to go fly a bunch of approaches and then calls it quits....literally? It has happened before.
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To me..... it is looking more and more like this is a good possibility..:redface:
 
mikeinbama said:
I am a very low time pilot, so I may be way off here. Why not fly it to the runway? After 5 misses, the avionics in the airplane could take you to the threshold. Could it not? Your chances are better than zero even if you break out at 100 feet. I am not speaking as knowing, I am asking, in an extreme situation, wouldn't you just fly it in?
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The pilot may not have known how to set up the approaches and couple the autopilot. Review of the Flightaware track shows some "snaking" after departure and then it looks like he finally got into tracking mode. In other words I think he was in heading mode initially and switch to tracking mode after a couple heading corrections.

None of his approaches indicate autopilot use. Did the autopilot fail? Did the pilot not trust his ability to use the autopilot?

Lots of possibilities and probably no answers. Just a reminder to everyone that when an outside observer suggests doing something different 'cause you failed four times, well, maybe ya better listen.

Of course a better lesson to learn is to ask for help when you need it: where's the nearest VMC? ATC has always been helpful when I have asked for help with regard to weather (routing, not so much help :) ). I do take the time to explain why I'm asking them (faster radar updates, visibility problems at twilight, etc).
 
JasonM said:
Any chance it was Ice? What were the temps aloft?
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driving around like a blind drunk because of ice? maybe...anything is possible - none of the ATC tapes linked here had a mention of ice
 
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