Pireps on Aspen Evolution Pro

[Jps19602002@mac.com]

Just about to take delivery on a 1990 A36 with a single Aspen Evolution Pro installed as the main AI and HSI. I am really looking forward to moving from the old sixpack to this new setup but wondering how many folks just have the 1 up configuration vs. adding the MFP for moving map. I have a WAAS 530 with XM. Also, it has been suggested to add the Synthetic Vision module. Adding the MFD and SV are expensive upgrades but are they worth it??? No new postings have been made on this subject for a number of years so I was looking for recent experience and recommendations.

 

[frfly172]

The SV can be added to the single pro. Don't have much use for it myself. Also between the 530 and Foreflight on the I pad not much need for another moving map.

 

[N747JB]

I had a single Aspen unit, with a 530W and it worked great! It took a little getting used to, but nothing too complicated. Not all the functions work with every install, I think it depends on the autopilot, on mine the flight director didn't work.

 

[asgcpa]

One of the planes I fly has an Aspen with dual 430s. Works well, but at times the altitude bug button sticks on this unit. The unit does not have SV. The Aspen is coupled to the 430 and STEC55X autopilot.

 

[C182P]

I've got the single Aspen unit in my 182, with a 430, and I'm happy with it. I don't have SV, but I recall they had a sale on it last fall, $1000 off. They seem to have sales of different types several times a year, so if you want SV but can wait, you should keep an eye out. The option is pure software so no installation reason to get it at the time the hardware is put in.

 

[Shawn]

I also have a 182 with just a single Aspen panel configuration. It is great being coupled with the 430 and auto pilot. Funny thing is that I trained in a G1000 and now that I have a partial glass panel in my own plane, I find myself relying on the steam gauges more than I reference the Aspen when just toodling around VFR!...It is cool and has some nice features, but I do not see myself expanding the system anytime soon...especially with Foreflight and a Stratus 2.

Fly with it as configured for a while then you will get a good feel what will be important to add or not for you.

 

[Marauder]

With a dual Aspen you will get the benefit of full redundancy for the PFD. If you purchase the extended MFD battery pack ($1000 to the base price), you can remove your ASI and altimeter. Been flying behind an Aspen 2000 for 1.5 years -- just awesome.

The GPSS alone is worth it. Added a whole new life to my STEC 60-2. I am waiting for the ADS-B stuff from Aspen and it will add quite a bit of capability to the MFD.

As for SV, friends who have it say it is valuable if you are flying in rocky terrain. Not as much benefit for flat landers.

As John pointed out above, your full capability will depend on what can be and what was interfaced. On my STEC, it did not have a flight director. I added the ST-670 to get this functionality (the single cue is displayed in the picture). If you do add a MFD, consider having the mod done to have AP full control added during regression. If your PFD fails, you can transfer all of your information over to the MFD and have it function as the PFD. Aspen offers a schematic option to allow your AP control to be fully transferred to a regressed MFD (making it a PFD). They will add a little relay and light setup to allow you to transfer AP control.

 

[Clark1961]

The 'kota has just the Aspen PFD along with a 430w and Century III autopilot. Adding the MFD would be nice but I have no plans to do so.

I'm based in Denver and fly to western Wyoming frequently. I added the SV and have to say that while it is nice to have the terrain warnings, the 430w also does that. The "3D" depiction on the AI isn't particularly useful most (like 99.9%) of the time. If a guy really flew down in the rocks then it might be useful (say inadvertent IMC) but seeing as how I try to maintain at least 1,000 AGL in the rocks it just doesn't do me much good.

 

[LDJones]

I occasionally fly a A36 with a single Aspen and SV. The SV is really cool, but definitely more a novelty than "must have". But I love the functionality of the Aspen.

 

[Ted]

I have had a single Aspen for 2.5 years. A second one would be nice, but is definitely lower on the priority list vs. other upgrades.

 

[dukeblue219]

I have a single Aspen PFD with dual 430W's. Some day we might add another Aspen for redundancy, but probably not just for the MFD. Between the 430's and iPads I think we have enough moving maps, and having a full set of steam gauges is kind of nice (some would have to go to fit an MFD).

We do have SV since it was pretty inexpensive when divided among three owners, and I usually turn it on, but I haven't gotten much value out of it since the extent of my IFR is usually enroute.

 

[Piloto]

I also have a 182 with just a single Aspen panel configuration. It is great being coupled with the 430 and auto pilot. Funny thing is that I trained in a G1000 and now that I have a partial glass panel in my own plane, I find myself relying on the steam gauges more than I reference the Aspen when just toodling around VFR!...It is cool and has some nice features, but I do not see myself expanding the system anytime soon...especially with Foreflight and a Stratus 2.

Fly with it as configured for a while then you will get a good feel what will be important to add or not for you.

I agree with you on relying on the the steam gauges. If you look at most of the pictures posted on the web showing the Aspen you will noticed that you cannot tell the airspeed or the altitude on the Aspen display but you can easily read those on the steam gauges. There is no added awareness on the Aspen display from what current steam gauges provide. I have a GNS 530AW that provides more data than the Aspen. This why I am not motivated to get an Aspen display just to replace the bigger and reliable steam gauges.

José

 

[dukeblue219]

If you look at most of the pictures posted on the web showing the Aspen you will noticed that you cannot tell the airspeed or the altitude on the Aspen display but you can easily read those on the steam gauges.

?? I don't get this. I often glance at the steam gauge altimeter out of habit, but I rarely if ever check the steam gauge ASI -- my eye goes right to the digital readout on the Aspen.

There is no added awareness on the Aspen display from what current steam gauges provide. I have a GNS 530AW that provides more data than the Aspen.

Sure there is if you don't already have a very nice HSI. I find the digital AI easier to read at a glance too, but the biggest advantage to me is the HSI overlaid on a moving map.

Having other information on there available at a glance, like calculated windspeed and direction, is a bonus on top of that.

 

[Jaybird180]

I occasionally fly a A36 with a single Aspen and SV. The SV is really cool, but definitely more a novelty than "must have". But I love the functionality of the Aspen.

Henning will be along soon to tell everyone how wonderful SV is.

 

[jesse]

There is no added awareness on the Aspen display from what current steam gauges provide.

I'm not so sure of that. Do you have a steam gauge with an air data computer? Do your steam gauges display fixes on them? Steam gauge have an altitude alert? Minimum alert? All the v speeds available on an Aspen displayed on your steam gauges? I could go on..and on..and on..

 

[rbridges]

I'd like to go that route at some point. I'd love to get rid of my vacuum pump and all the gauges that rely on it. From what I've read, the aspen units are pretty dependable. I realize that you need to have 2 individual units for redundancy, but besides replacing the batteries, I haven't seen too many people complain about them.

 

[Piloto]

?? I don't get this. I often glance at the steam gauge altimeter out of habit, but I rarely if ever check the steam gauge ASI -- my eye goes right to the digital readout on the Aspen.




Sure there is if you don't already have a very nice HSI. I find the digital AI easier to read at a glance too, but the biggest advantage to me is the HSI overlaid on a moving map.

Having other information on there available at a glance, like calculated windspeed and direction, is a bonus on top of that.

Here is what I have in front of me besides the 530AW. No need to even lift my hands off the yoke to touch screen on the 560. Very handy on a turbulent approach. Also noticed that on the Aspens the VSI is not as visible as on steam gauges. VSI is a most function on twins for when you lose an engine, you want to make sure you have a positive climb rate.

José

 

[jesse]

is a most function on twins for when you lose an engine, you want to make sure you have a positive climb rate.

The fastest way to determine that is by looking at the altimeter.

 

[Piloto]

The fastest way to determine that is by looking at the altimeter.

You are right because on John's twin N747JB (picture above) there is no VSI but an altimeter. And no matter how much I zoom in on the picture I cannot read the altitude on the Aspen but clearly on the steam altimeter at 2300ft. Futhermore I know the picture was taken in-flight just looking at the steam airspeed indicator but not at the Aspen. What I cannot tell if the plane was is in level flight or in a dive. Can you?

José

 

[Ted]

You are right because on John's twin N747JB (picture above) there is no VSI but an altimeter. And no matter how much I zoom in on the picture I cannot read the altitude on the Aspen but clearly on the steam altimeter at 2300ft. Futhermore I know the picture was taken in-flight just looking at the steam airspeed indicator but not at the Aspen. What I cannot tell if the plane was is in level flight or in a dive. Can you?

José

Looks like level flight. the Aspen's VSI isn't displayed in the picture, and it's hidden when not functioning. The Aspen's altitude tapes are very easy to see move. The picture doesn't provide the same perspective as sitting left seat flying.

 

[jesse]

Looks like level flight. the Aspen's VSI isn't displayed in the picture, and it's hidden when not functioning. The Aspen's altitude tapes are very easy to see move. The picture doesn't provide the same perspective as sitting left seat flying.

Might be a slight pink trend line down. But like you say, it's not hard to figure out when you're flying with the thing.

 

[Piloto]

Might be a slight pink trend line down. But like you say, it's not hard to figure out when you're flying with the thing.

On John's twin how can you tell the climb performance. You just time the altitude change vs time? Minimum climb performance is required at some airports in South America at high elevations surrounded by mountains like Quito, Ecuador. A high temp day and at gross weight can significantly affect climb performance to the point of needing to circle before leaving the valley. Having a VSI eliminates guessing your climb performance.

José

 

[jesse]

On John's twin how can you tell the climb performance. You just time the altitude change vs time? Minimum climb performance is required at some airports in South America at high elevations surrounded by mountains like Quito, Ecuador. A high temp day and at gross weight can significantly affect climb performance to the point of needing to circle before leaving the valley. Having a VSI eliminates guessing your climb performance.

José

The aspen has a vsi.

 

[Piloto]

The aspen has a vsi.

Neither on John's or Marauder pictures I saw a VSI. How do you manage your descent rate when your G530 or GTN 750 calls for VSR (Vertical Speed Required) to reach a proper altitude?

José

 

[hindsight2020]

Frankly, the reason I'd like an AHRS driven PFD is not for the fancy bells and alerts, but for the compass slaving and non-mechanical gyro attitude instrumentation. That's it. I'm sick and tired of cross-checking with that stupid whiskey compass, perennially cockeyed mechanical AIs and corresponding error/constant overhaul. The eHSI functionality, being an easy (free) software driven add-on to the slaved DG electronic presentation, is nice too on the PFDs.

I wouldn't care one iota if airspeed or altitude information is displayed in my PFD. All the navigation/performance info I need I can get from the 430 display. Steam gauge airspeed and altitude presentations have proven cheap and reliable in my flying experience. My bone to pick is with mechanical gyros, which I personally feel make my flight into IMC more hazardous than behind an EFIS.

My hope is that by the time primary non-commercial rolls around, aspen will ship their PFD with an experimental re-badge and corresponding discounted price, and I'll gladly install it in my Arrow. I actually prefer the vertical rectangle setup of the aspen PFD into the existing 6-pack panel, rather than the dynon or garmin TV screen sized unit architecture. I'm a minimalist that way.

 

[Marauder]

Neither on John's or Marauder pictures I saw a VSI. How do you manage your descent rate when your G530 or GTN 750 calls for VSR (Vertical Speed Required) to reach a proper altitude?



José

José - the Aspens do have both an analog and digital depiction VSI. It is located on the HSI and only shows up when you climb or descend. When I removed the steam VSI from the panel I thought I would miss it. I haven't. In fact, I like the precision the Aspen digital display provides.

Here is a lousy picture of mine showing 160 FPM (right side of HSI).

Just one additional comment on these units. Before dismissing them as being a novelty, fly behind one. As a long time steam gauge guy, the transformation to "glass" has been an incredible experience. The wealth of pertinent information and the capability of setting parameters, like target altitudes add a lot of value to managing the flight.

 

[Piloto]

José - the Aspens do have both an analog and digital depiction VSI. It is located on the HSI and only shows up when you climb or descend. When I removed the steam VSI from the panel I thought I would miss it. I haven't. In fact, I like the precision the Aspen digital display provides.

Here is a lousy picture of mine showing 160 FPM (right side of HSI).

Just one additional comment on these units. Before dismissing them as being a novelty, fly behind one. As a long time steam gauge guy, the transformation to "glass" has been an incredible experience. The wealth of pertinent information and the capability of setting parameters, like target altitudes add a lot of value to managing the flight.

Thanks for the info. The Aspen VSI presentation can be mistaken by a traditional HSI G/S indication. Normally on modern displays like the G1000 the VSI indication is presented to the right of the altitude tape.

I find the Aspen display too small for what it tries to convey. In fact I get more info on the Aera 560 unit than on the Aspen. I think the Aspen is a good option if you need to replace your ADI/HSI and keep the traditional steam gauges. One thing I like about the 560 and vacuum gyros is that in the event of total electrical failure (e.g. master battery relay) I still have a backup GPS and gyros. Batteries on the Aspen will not provide power for the GPS. Without GPS or electrical power how you are going to fly to the closest airport or destination.

José

 

[dukeblue219]

Thanks for the info. The Aspen VSI presentation can be mistaken by a traditional HSI G/S indication. Normally on modern displays like the G1000 the VSI indication is presented to the right of the altitude tape.

How is it mistaken for a glideslope? It says "670 FPM" or "-500 FPM" in block letters. Are you looking at the smaller tape down below by the HSI and missing the indicator above it (which is right below the altitude tape)?

I find the Aspen display too small for what it tries to convey.

Agreed.

In fact I get more info on the Aera 560 unit than on the Aspen.

Does the Aera give you airspeed? Attitude? Integration with your 430/530 and autopilot (Aspen will drive your GPSS)?

I think the Aspen is a good option if you need to replace your ADI/HSI and keep the traditional steam gauges.

Agreed, absolutely.

One thing I like about the 560 and vacuum gyros is that in the event of total electrical failure (e.g. master battery relay) I still have a backup GPS and gyros. Batteries on the Aspen will not provide power for the GPS. Without GPS or electrical power how you are going to fly to the closest airport or destination.

The same way you would if you had an "old fashioned" plane. Yes, a battery powered GPS like a 560 would be a huge advantage in that case, as would the iPad I fly with. No reason you can't supplement your Aspen with something like an Aera or iPad, and I think most/many pilots do.

Oh, and the backup battery on the Aspen absolutely does power a GPS. You won't have your 430 running of course, but the Aspen has its own internal GPS for just such an emergency. You don't navigate with it normally, but it kicks in in an emergency.

 

[N747JB]

The Aspen is a good unit and a great add to many airplanes! If cost isn't an issue, I'd go with the G500-G600. Better, larger displays, but they require a data subscription. The Aspen does cram a lot of info into a fairly small space, but it is designed to fit the holes left by the AI and DG or HSI, not the design the panel around it. I've had both, I prefer the G600, but for the money an Aspen is a great unit and I would certainly consider it for my 182.

 

[Piloto]

Notice on this picture
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/00/Horizontal_situation_indicator-en.svg

That a traditional HSI G/S indication is on the same location as the Aspen VSI. Without a label indicating VSI like on the HSI indicating G/S it is possible to assume that it is some form of G/S indication. The text block above does not imply that the tape below is for VSI.

During a power or GPS failure (panel mounted) the Aspen will not tell which way to go but the Aera will.

José

 

[Fearless Tower]

I find the Aspen display too small for what it tries to convey. In fact I get more info on the Aera 560 unit than on the Aspen. I think the Aspen is a good option if you need to replace your ADI/HSI and keep the traditional steam gauges. One thing I like about the 560 and vacuum gyros is that in the event of total electrical failure (e.g. master battery relay) I still have a backup GPS and gyros. Batteries on the Aspen will not provide power for the GPS. Without GPS or electrical power how you are going to fly to the closest airport or destination.

I have to ask: have you actually flown behind an Aspen PFD, or are you simply basing your comments off of internet photos?

 

[Ted]

During a power or GPS failure (panel mounted) the Aspen will not tell which way to go but the Aera will.

Not true. If the panel GPS fails, the Aspen will give you the continued current route. It won't give you a nearest airport, but it will allow you to continue on your 7600 course.

You seem to have no knowledge or experience with the Aspen given the number of things you've said that are completely incorrect, but just don't like it.

 

[Ted]

I have to ask: have you actually flown behind an Aspen PFD, or are you simply basing your comments off of internet photos?

This is the internet. Anyone who actually knows what they're talking about or has experience is automatically discredited. Only the ignorant are experts!

 

[dukeblue219]

During a power or GPS failure (panel mounted) the Aspen will not tell which way to go but the Aera will.

This is simply incorrect. If a power failure takes out your primary NAVCOMs, the Aspen will continue to run with its built-in GPS.

An Aspen is not for everyone -- I don't mind one bit if you choose not to install one in your plane. But the arguments you're making against it are either minor, are based on internet photos (like claiming that you cannot read the altimeter or ASI), or are based on wrong information (that the Aspen does not have its own GPS for electrical failure).

 

[Marauder]

Knowing José from the Mooney site, I take his comments with a grain of salt. Ask him his thoughts on ADS-B.

The reality is that the Aspen units do a pretty good job of providing the information needed in flight. But just like every other tool, you need to know how to use it.

As others pointed out above, the Aspen units do provide a lot more than meets the eye. If you have a GPS Nav failure, the unit will keep the current flight plan from the navigator in memory and you can continue to use it - including if you lose all electrical power! (You can shut down the MFD and power it up later if the PFD battery gets low and put it into reversion mode and transfer the PFD data over). You can't change it, but you have the Aspen GPS backup engaged and following the original GPS flightplan.

As for the VSI being confused for a glideslope... The vertical and horizontal elements of a precision approach are not displayed on the HSI. They are displayed on the AI. I find this absolutely logical and a great way to present the information. I can load my target altitude for the segment I am flying, the min for the approach and have the precision indicators all as my primary focus for the approach.

This flyer from Aspen shows what a precision approach would look like - complete with the VSI showing a descent.

http://www.dev.aspenavionics.com/pdfs/Evolution-2000-package-product-sheet.pdf

 

[Piloto]

I do appreciate your comments on the Aspen on my comments. I do see value on the Aspen product but not enough for me to justify buying one. I went to the Controller.com website to see how many Mooneys M20J like mine are equipped with the Aspen. Out of a listing of 27 today I could not find a single one with the Aspen equipment. But the majority had the G430, G530 and engine analyzers. Some had TKS de-icing, long range tanks active TCAS systems and Stormscope. These are items that are more expensive than the Aspen products. My assessment is that it looks that the majority are happy with the steam gauges just like me.

José

 

[MAKG1]

I fly behind Aspens once in a while. Sometimes on airplanes where it ought not to make sense, like two 172Ns.

The second 172 long had a Garmin 430. The HSI crapped out. The owner opted to replace the HSI with a one-panel Evolution, rather than another HSI. I'll suggest that it makes sense in that situation, but not so obviously for replacing working avionics.

I'm not a fan for VFR. They are small enough that they require refocusing the eyes on very small type, and then focusing on distant objects for "see and avoid," very frequently. They are eye magnets. IFR would be another story, as they would greatly reduce the scan area. It's the frequent change between far and near that I object to, plus a bit too much heads down time in VMC.

That 172 really is over-equipped. It's in pretty nice shape for a 35 year old aircraft, though.

The first 172 has no GPS. I don't understand why anyone would install an Evolution without a GPS, as most of the functionality goes away and it's essentially a really nice AI, ASI, TC and altimeter. I guess the reduced scan area in IMC still applies, but these days most of the approaches are GPS and DME units tend to go TU and never get fixed.

 

[hindsight2020]

I see they have three software variants of this unit: Pilot, Pro and VFR. The brochure wasn't very clear on the substantive differences, other than the Pro having EHSI software functionality and dual GPS receiver¿?

The VFR PFD retails for 5AMUs which is about half as the Pro PFD, and around one AMU under the Pilot PFD. What exactly are the substantive differences between the three?

 

[Piloto]

Just about to take delivery on a 1990 A36 with a single Aspen Evolution Pro installed as the main AI and HSI. I am really looking forward to moving from the old sixpack to this new setup but wondering how many folks just have the 1 up configuration vs. adding the MFP for moving map. I have a WAAS 530 with XM. Also, it has been suggested to add the Synthetic Vision module. Adding the MFD and SV are expensive upgrades but are they worth it??? No new postings have been made on this subject for a number of years so I was looking for recent experience and recommendations.

I think you are going to have a better view on a 30" windshield than on a 3" SV Aspen display.

José

 

[dukeblue219]

I think you are going to have a better view on a 30" windshield than on a 3" SV Aspen display.

José

Yeah, which is why SV is basically an IFR tool... (or inadvertent IMC I suppose)