Piper cherokee 140 fair price??

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Zach Smith

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zach
Found a cherokee 140 not exactly what I think I want but the price seems right at 24k ifr good til September of 2021. 3558 ttaf and 1550 smoh on O320. My goal is to travel weekends back home 200 miles 1 way. I'm still completing ppl but at 10k in rental fees. I just think I'd be money ahead long term. Open to hearing thoughts. Thanks in advance 20200620_213003_2.jpg 20200620_213054_2.jpg
 
That seems like a fair price based on what little info you’ve supplied.
 
What all would you like to know? Keep in mind idk much and would like all the help I can get on the correct questions to ask
 
What is the time on the engine? Corrosion is ok? No damage?
 
Go for it. Don't skimp on the pre-purchase inspection. Make sure the inspector isn't friends with the seller.
 
Plane is out of state about 500 miles from me. So I will be making calls Monday to find someone to prebuy it
 
It's probably obvious, but check on ADS-B, if that's something you'll need.
 
Gotta love those shotgun panels :rolleyes1::rolleyes1:
 
Are all the avionics usable? If oil samples were taken over a period of time, get copies. Spend the $5 with the FAA and get the history - 337s, etc. Log books - can you get copies to review in advance? If the current owner will not provide the logbooks during the pre-buy, run away. Run away really fast!
 
He has all airframe logs as well as engine logs since new. Told me to just let him know as soon as I have something setup for a prebuy and he will give inspector access to hanger as well as all logs
 
Shotgun panel is one with scattered instruments, not arranged in a standard six pack.
 
Yeah, that is something that bothers me but again. My plan is to save some more money over the next 6 months and just finish certification and upgrade.
 
Good advice already given, and very fair price assuming no issues. Looks almost exactly like my plane..looked twice to make sure someone hadn't listed it without checking with me! We moved the instruments around to a standard six pack configuration..it's not horrible to do/have done.
 
Are you going to try to fly it before you buy it?
I would certainly recommend it.
A pre-buy won't pick up things like trim not working or rigging being way off.
I flew a Cub last week that had a great pre-buy. In the air the trim didn't work at all, and you had to fly the plane with 3 inches of right deflection on the stick to make it fly straight.
 
Caveat, I am not an A&P. I did own a '74 140 for 18 years and got a lot of enjoyment out of flying it and wrenching on it (under appropriate A&P supervision) - ok, one thing I hated was replacing the p-lead.

What year is it? 150hp engine? Does it have the mogas STC?

Have you flown a 140 before? did you like it?

Does it have the old bowtie yoke? in other words, check on the status of the repetitive ADs (I'm assuming ADs complied with otherwise)

Useful load? (be aware of the forward CG limit, not just max weight, my 140 was a bit nose-heavy).
 
Zach Smith said:
Yeah, that is something that bothers me but again. My plan is to save some more money over the next 6 months and just finish certification and upgrade.
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If your plan is to save money this is a bad idea, you can't own a plane cheaper than renting one. The break even point on most plane ownership is about 50 hr a year anything less your better off renting.
 
brien23 said:
500hr top on a 1558hr major sounds like a local overhaul, you don't want this one.
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Without knowing the background on why the top was done, that's just mere speculation.

Example: Did an unsuspecting owner use a mechanic who inspected the engine and told him "Gee, those compressions are low (68-70), you better let me remove those cylinders and have them repaired". Or was it an owner who decided on his own he wanted the cylinders repaired?

We don't know with the information provided. Unfortunately in GA most mechanics place very minimal signoffs in the logbooks that don't tell a complete story.
 
brien23 said:
you can't own a plane cheaper than renting one
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While this is true if you add in fuel/oil insurance, hanger/tie down costs, etc. One can certainly own a plane cheaper than renting when the rental fee equals one monthly payment. This is why I bought my plane to finish my PPL. Rental was $135 + $50 for the instructor per hour. As everyone knows, you don't always fly just an hour in training and you don't do it just once per month.
 
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For the price, worth investigating further. It could make a nice 1- or 2-paasenger plane for traveling or commuting. The avionics and Narco "audio" panel are a bit dated, and you need to consider if or how ADS-B compliance has been addressed. But if the installed avionics work, it's usable. Pre-owned engines are always a crap shoot. It depends on how well the prior owner(s) took care of it, how often it was flown, and what the quality of the last OH was. This engine could be one you could safely run past TBO with its recent top, or the top could have been an expensive bandaid for a worn engine. Hence do a good prenbuy to understand what you are getting. Have your mechanic go through the logbooks, too. Sometimes they harbor hidden stories, like prop strikes (prop replaced for no obvious reason), ground loops (wing repairs), etc. Cherokees are pretty simple to maintain and operate. First time I flew one in training I decided I really liked low wing aircfraft.

I almost owned a Cherokee 140 as my first plane...made an offer on a nice one that was attractively priced, did a test flight, scheduled a pre-buy, and the seller backed out. I wound up with a nice Grumman AA-1A instead.
 
It does have adsb out. I've been training in a 172 however I flew a 180 cherokee yesterday and it flew way different. Not sure if its because I'm not familiar with it but a little nose heavy it seemed now I'm a few inexperienced person just my opinion
 
I had my A&P rearrange my panel so the instruments are in the normal positions relative to each other rather than the shotgun arrangement. It makes it easier to move back and forth to airplanes with the standard six-pack.

Speaking of which, you can buy this shirt from our EAA store on CafePress.

Six Pack.png
 
Zach Smith said:
It does have adsb out. I've been training in a 172 however I flew a 180 cherokee yesterday and it flew way different. Not sure if its because I'm not familiar with it but a little nose heavy it seemed now I'm a few inexperienced person just my opinion
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Most Cherokee newbies have a hard time landing properly nose high. You almost have to have the yoke in your belly to gently land nose-high. Like most low wings, they can float a bit in ground effect if your approach speed is too fast. I found the Cherokees easier to land because of the generous ground effect cushion than the 152s and 172s I trained in. Fly by the POH numbers and they are as easy as any light single. The only thing I didn't like about the cherokees is the split windshield. I was really spoiled by the bubble canopy in the AA-1A.
 
You schubs worry about shotgun panels way too much. Usually when you own an airplane you don’t go out and rent other people’s airplanes, you fly your own. You quickly get used to whatever you have. My Cherokee had a standard 6 pack. My Mooney not so much. Didn’t really notice.
 
Lot of time on the engine, but it's cheap. Go for it as long as the prebuy comes back clean. Throw an iPad and ADS-B in in there, and you'll have a good time builder.
 
The top photo is the original shotgun panel of my '63 C172D. Below it is the same airplane with an upgraded panel in the standard six-pack configuration. I had learned to fly in a 1963 172D in 1964 and thought the non-standard panel would be OK. Soon after I bought it, I decided it wasn't working and upgraded the panel. This was in the 2000 - 2002 timeframe, and the new panel made a world of difference.

N2686U Old New Panel.JPG
 
All this talk about owning and scattered panels but nobody mentions the fact that he is looking to do a 200 mile trip one way.

In a Cherokee 140 or 151 that is a two hour trip minimum.


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k9medic said:
All this talk about owning and scattered panels but nobody mentions the fact that he is looking to do a 200 mile trip one way.

In a Cherokee 140 or 151 that is a two hour trip minimum.
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That's certainly a good use of 2 hours, a very good use... isn't it?
 
k9medic said:
All this talk about owning and scattered panels but nobody mentions the fact that he is looking to do a 200 mile trip one way.

In a Cherokee 140 or 151 that is a two hour trip minimum.


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Or a 3+ hour trip driving.
 
If it looks good, go for it...$24K to own an airplane is fantastic, and 200 mile trips are perfect for a 100kt airplane...I plan 2-3 hour legs, so you’re non-stop to get home.

If you do buy, just be prepared for a major expense right away. My Arrow was 1300 SMOH when I bought it, prebuy was good, and it ran great for three months. A large case crack developed and I suddenly had a huge expense in front of me that I thought I’d have a few years to save up for.
 
k9medic said:
All this talk about owning and scattered panels but nobody mentions the fact that he is looking to do a 200 mile trip one way.

In a Cherokee 140 or 151 that is a two hour trip minimum.
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There are a lot of us here with airplanes having cruise speeds similar to a Cherokee 140 that make two hour flights all the time and consider it much faster, less fatiguing, and a lot more fun than taking twice as long to drive in unpredictable traffic.
 
Doc Holliday said:
Without knowing the background on why the top was done, that's just mere speculation.

Example: Did an unsuspecting owner use a mechanic who inspected the engine and told him "Gee, those compressions are low (68-70), you better let me remove those cylinders and have them repaired". Or was it an owner who decided on his own he wanted the cylinders repaired?

We don't know with the information provided. Unfortunately in GA most mechanics place very minimal signoffs in the logbooks that don't tell a complete story.
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speculation seems to be his specialty, based on the helicopter thread...
 
I guess I'm just pessimistic about flying only 200 miles. A 3 hour drive versus a 200 mile flight at 100kts is a wash when you calculate the time to drive to the airport and to preflight.

In my mind it's hardly worth the time. I'm not discounting that it might be fun and worth the experience.

Stan Cooper said:
There are a lot of us here with airplanes having cruise speeds similar to a Cherokee 140 that make two hour flights all the time and consider it much faster, less fatiguing, and a lot more fun than taking twice as long to drive in unpredictable traffic.
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