Penn State Child Sex Abuse Scandal

I never understoood the concept of the presumption of innocence as it pertains to achieving a criminal verdict. That's a separate topic. It simply doesn't enter in to play
 
Sac Arrow said:
I never understoood the concept of the presumption of innocence as it pertains to achieving a criminal verdict. That's a separate topic. It simply doesn't enter in to play
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It's the standard because people get railroaded and this is a bit of a counter to that.
 
Henning said:
God forbid that the forum is treated the same as a cockpit. 90% of cockpit conversation has nothing at all to do with flying.

Besides, this is the generic catch all forum for pilot discussion. THIS IS THE REASON THIS BOARD WAS FORMED!!! This board came about because the AOPA board closed this type forum (actually, they closed the whole board for several months while they painted it red and Chuck started this board for a place for the people to go).

The reason you are complaining is the reason this board was formed. If you want what you asked for, the AOPA board is what you want, non aviation discussion is not allowed.
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Might have known "helmet guy" would have some dumb excuse for why a Pilots forum goes off on such stupid tangents. I think they call that forum Facebook or Twitter or dumb stuff forum. Can understand why you like this so much....
What an amazing waste of bandwidth.

"90% of cockpit conversation has nothing at all to do with flying"
Could be why you spend more time on a forum than in a cockpit.....
 
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Goofy said:
Might have known "helmet guy" would have some dumb excuse for why a Pilots forum goes off on such stupid tangents. I think they call that forum Facebook or Twitter or dumb stuff forum. Can understand why you like this so much....
What an amazing waste of bandwidth.

"90% of cockpit conversation has nothing at all to do with flying"
Could be why you spend more time on a forum than in a cockpit.....
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No excuse needed. Take a look at the official description of this section of the forum:

Hangar Talk (219 Viewing)
Open forum for discussion of any topic you like, aviation related or otherwise (but no spin zone material, see below).

Virtually all topics in this forum are permitted - so long as they are discussed in a civil manner.

NOTE: Politics and religion and any other topic likely to become highly charged must be posted in The Spin Zone. To gain access to the Spin Zone, click this link and join the Spin Zone group.
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[emphasis added]

http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=1

As far as I know, reading this thread is voluntary.

Or do you feel a need to control what other people talk about for some reason?

Here's a tip for you: Scroll to the top of this thread, open the "Thread Tools" menu, and click on "Ignore this Thread." Problem solved!
 
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So far there Goofy, YOU are the only one that has violated this forums rules, YOU.
 
Goofy said:
Might have known "helmet guy" would have some dumb excuse for why a Pilots forum goes off on such stupid tangents. I think they call that forum Facebook or Twitter or dumb stuff forum. Can understand why you like this so much....
What an amazing waste of bandwidth.

"90% of cockpit conversation has nothing at all to do with flying"
Could be why you spend more time on a forum than in a cockpit.....
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Over the line dude, way over. If anyone is gonna make fun of Henning it is me. :rofl:

Maybe you should stay on Face book. ;)
 
Geico266 said:
Over the line dude, way over. If anyone is gonna make fun of Henning it is me. :rofl:

Maybe you should stay on Face book. ;)
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Hey............ BACK OFF... the rest of us ain't through with Henning ... YET.;):D:)
 
I keep meaning to make fun of Henning. Problem is, whenever I think he is talking out his axx, turns out he's right. Very frustrating.
 
SCCutler said:
I keep meaning to make fun of Henning. Problem is, whenever I think he is talking out his axx, turns out he's right. Very frustrating.
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It does suck. Hinders me applying hate to the man.
 
Sac Arrow said:
I dunno Ted, you are arguably the fairest juror that may exist. Examine the evidence, determine what is fact, then arrive at the verdict. Everyone deserves that process.
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Everskyward said:
I think he was saying he decided the guy was guilty before the trial which is not what a juror is supposed to do.
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Sac Arrow said:
True, actually Ted doesnt strike me as such but that is a very interesting insight. One wonders if that form of prejudice is a positive or a negative.
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Mari is correct - I had already decided that the person was guilty. That excludes me from the jury automatically based on the rules. I would have gone in presuming he was guilty, and need to see proof of his innocence. I wasn't alone in my feeling. I spoke with several other jurors who dismissed themselves later on in the question process, one of whom was a former coworker. He said that the more they talked about the case in vague terms, the more convinced he became that the guy was guilty.

Positive or negative, depends on what the goal is. If the goal is justice, potentially positive. If it's innocent until proven guilty (which doesn't always mean justice), then negative.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Mari is correct - I had already decided that the person was guilty. That excludes me from the jury automatically based on the rules. I would have gone in presuming he was guilty, and need to see proof of his innocence. I wasn't alone in my feeling. I spoke with several other jurors who dismissed themselves later on in the question process, one of whom was a former coworker. He said that the more they talked about the case in vague terms, the more convinced he became that the guy was guilty.

Positive or negative, depends on what the goal is. If the goal is justice, potentially positive. If it's innocent until proven guilty (which doesn't always mean justice), then negative.
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Well, you recused yourself. A lot of people wouldn't do that other than to escape jury duty.
 
Sac Arrow said:
Well, you recused yourself. A lot of people wouldn't do that other than to escape jury duty.
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Very true. I actually was rather interested in getting to be on a trial, especially for a major crime like that. But, I wasn't going to do it unless I knew going in I'd be unbiased.

If it were a murder trial, it'd probably be different. I've had several friends who've been raped, so I suppose that crime hits home a bit closer. While I do have one friend who was murdered, that was a bit different than a "standard" murder (Virginia Tech shootings).
 
Here's to the start of many, many, looong nights up against the wall of the booty house with a towel stuffed in his mouth.
 
I bet we'll see a Class Action suit in civil court against Penn State from the victims. Justifiable no doubt. The University is trying to settle with the victims to avoid just that.

STATE COLLEGE, Pa. - Penn State University wants to "privately, expeditiously and fairly" compensate and address the concerns of victims abused by Jerry Sandusky, and it plans to reach out to their lawyers soon with more information, the school said in a statement Friday.
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I just hope that they don't use PA tax dollars for the settlements. This needs to come from the University, and the individuals that looked the other way.

http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/160102635.html
 
Anthony said:
I bet we'll see a Class Action suit in civil court against Penn State from the victims. Justifiable no doubt. The University is trying to settle with the victims to avoid just that.



I just hope that they don't use PA tax dollars for the settlements. This needs to come from the University, and the individuals that looked the other way.

http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/160102635.html
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Notice the first word is "privately"? They want to sweep this under the rug, and are only concerned about the image of the football program. Disgusting.
 
Umm privacy protects the victims too. I'm not standing for the folks who covered this up, but the settlements between the university and the families are nobody else's business unless they're paid with public money OR the family chooses to make it publicly.

This sort of tragedy, like other intensely painful and personal events, is not entertainment or marketing fodder.
 
TMetzinger said:
Umm privacy protects the victims too. I'm not standing for the folks who covered this up, but the settlements between the university and the families are nobody else's business unless they're paid with public money OR the family chooses to make it publicly.

This sort of tragedy, like other intensely painful and personal events, is not entertainment or marketing fodder.
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I agree, the victims need to be protected, but this is a public school. All funds paid out, all programs paid for by the school need to be made public. The names of the victims are public knowledge now due to the trial. They are not being widely distributed to protect them.
 
TMetzinger said:
Umm privacy protects the victims too. I'm not standing for the folks who covered this up, but the settlements between the university and the families are nobody else's business unless they're paid with public money OR the family chooses to make it publicly.

This sort of tragedy, like other intensely painful and personal events, is not entertainment or marketing fodder.
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I think you could argue it's 'anti-marketing fodder'. I have no numbers but I'd suspect PennStates enrollments are WAY down.
 
The person in all of this I would least like to be...

That assistant coach who walked in on him in the shower and then did nothing. Right now I'd be having a really hard time living with myself. The right response would have been to bust that POS over the head with the closest heavy blunt object and proceed from there.
 
Alexb2000 said:
The person in all of this I would least like to be...

That assistant coach who walked in on him in the shower and then did nothing. Right now I'd be having a really hard time living with myself. The right response would have been to bust that POS over the head with the closest heavy blunt object and proceed from there.
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I have to agree. Now the correct response for Sandusky is to quietly hang himself in his cell. Actually, he should have done himself in while he was at home awaiting trial, it's bad enough that he molested all these kids, but he also made them relive it in court, makes him an even bigger POS if that's possible. :mad2: He'll get to shower with older boys now! I bet they keep him out of the general population at whatever prison he ends up in, for HIS PROTECTION.:mad2::mad2:
 
A lot of people are staying that he is going to get it in prison, but let's face it, that is what he is in prison for. He will probably find a big strong boyfriend and live happily ever after.
 
From what I've heard rape is about 'power'. If true then logic would follow that a rapist would especially hate to be raped.
 
Geico266 said:
Notice the first word is "privately"? They want to sweep this under the rug, and are only concerned about the image of the football program. Disgusting.
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Yes, they want to mitigate the damage to their ability to generate revenue from alumni donations, footbal proceeds, tv deals, etc. They want to put this behind them as quickly as possible also because of what may come out about other Penn State staff enabling Sandusky's behavior.

I hope that whomever knew about this or did enable his behavior pays the price they deserve.
 
cavmedic said:
He was awarded protective custody... So much for riding *****.
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Solitary is worse for most people which is what 'protective custody' is in most prisons. The question is what facility he ends up in, I doubt he ends up in a Supermax.
 
Why? Isn't supermax where you put folks like this? Murders and rapists. What's worse? Oh yeah, child murderer and child rapist.
 
Supermax is where you put very very violent folks... Child molesters generally just get plain old solitary confinement.
 
Captain said:
Why? Isn't supermax where you put folks like this? Murders and rapists. What's worse? Oh yeah, child murderer and child rapist.
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No, not at all. The system isn't set up that way. It's about the violence levels, especially those you exhibit while inside the system. You don't typically get a Supermax cell for what you did outside, you get a Supermax cell for what you do inside, like killing other inmates and having a generally violent disposition towards the staff or leading a criminal enterprise from inside.

You can be a serial killer in minimum security as long as you aren't demonstrating high risk tendencies.

Supermax is about the security of the facility and it's a high cost way of doing things, prisons are now a booming 'for profit' business.
 
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Henning said:
No, not at all. The system isn't set up that way. It's about the violence levels, especially those you exhibit while inside the system. You don't typically get a Supermax cell for what you did outside, you get a Supermax cell for what you do inside, like killing other inmates and having a generally violent disposition towards the staff or leading a criminal enterprise from inside.

You can be a serial killer in minimum security as long as you aren't demonstrating high risk tendencies.

Supermax is about the security of the facility and it's a high cost way of doing things, prisons are now a booming 'for profit' business.
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The Supermax concept is crazy IMO. Why not just put someone that bad to death? Oh, that's right, money. How about a medically induced comma instead? We could line them up like rows of corn, no fuss no muss. The next cash crop.

Stepping back and looking at the logic of putting a 20 year old in a Supermax facility for the next 60-80 years just boggles the mind.
 
Alexb2000 said:
The Supermax concept is crazy IMO. Why not just put someone that bad to death? Oh, that's right, money. How about a medically induced comma instead? We could line them up like rows of corn, no fuss no muss. The next cash crop.

Stepping back and looking at the logic of putting a 20 year old in a Supermax facility for the next 60-80 years just boggles the mind.
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Yet probably a better deal than whatever happened to that hypothetical 20 year old inmate's victim.

So why is the Supermax concept crazy?
 
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