Path from 0 hours to Jet?

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Flyer9966

Filing Flight Plan
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What is a good path to get from 0 hours to private jet in your own aircraft? What airplanes would you buy if you had the means to purchase whatever aircraft you wanted? (Also, I really don't want to buy a single engine piston if I don't have to. I would like to start out with a single-engine turboprop i.e. P-12, Cessna Denali, etc. Is this possible? And I want to get into a pressurized cabin as soon as possible)
 
Dying to see where this one is going

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Is this not a valid question? If not, why?
 
Thanks RyanB, well I've gotten a good settlement from Microsoft. I can afford it within reason. I don't intend on buying a Gulfstream 650, but I could afford a Citation Mustang. I think my second aircraft will be a King Air C90, but I'm wondering what to use as a first airplane???
 
Well you should probably go find a way to start taking lessons in a smaller single engine piston aircraft like a 172/182/sr20 or whatever. Get your private, cfi, commercial, etc. Get a job with a little (part 135) regional making about $35k a year building hours. After you have a couple thousand hours, you can land a gig flying that type of stuff.
 
Thanks ktup-flyer. Yes I intend on using single-engine and multi piston for training up to a Commercial, but what after that? And I'm asking because I want to do this in my OWN AIRCRAFT. I don't need a "gig". Thanks for your reply though.
 
Flyer9966 said:
Thanks ktup-flyer. Yes I intend on using single-engine and multi piston for training up to a Commercial, but what after that? And I'm asking because I want to do this in my OWN AIRCRAFT. I don't need a "gig". Thanks for your reply though.
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Oh, I intend on learning/getting certifications in rented aircraft like most people.
 
Why would you buy an interim plane? Get PPL and instrument rating in a 152 then buy the Mustang or Vision and get a type rating. The transaction costs of buying interim planes are pointless if you know your goal and can afford it now.
 
rpadula said:
Ask Thurmon Munson. :(

(Too soon?)
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Its been awhile since I have read his story, but I thought he was regarded as a pretty good pilot. Wasnt someone else flying and got him low and slow on final? Cant remember. I know he was up front but I can't recall how they got into that situation.
 
Flyer9966 said:
Oh, I intend on learning/getting certifications in rented aircraft like most people.
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Why? If you have the money and interest in Jet ownership then buy one and learn in that. I know plenty of Jet pilots that have never flown in a trainer smaller than a T6 Texan II.
 
Your own plane? Cash. Overhaul cost on a mustang is more than most of the planes people on here own. Just know what you're getting into...
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
Its been awhile since I have read his story, but I thought he was regarded as a pretty good pilot. Wasnt someone else flying and got him low and slow on final? Cant remember. I know he was up front but I can't recall how they got into that situation.
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He was piloting the Citation. Had two passengers along that survived. Both pilots. One was an instructor, but this was not a training flight.
The Citation was his 4rth airplane in 18 months and he only had about 35 hours in it.
Got too slow on a touch and go circuit, late with the gear, no flaps, below the glide slope and couldn't spool up the engines fast enough to arrest the descent.
 
If you are gonna do a full time accelerated zero to hero program at a flight school no sense in buying a trainer or a single. Get through all the ratings in the rentals then step right into your King Air.

Buying a single only makes sense in your case if you are taking your time on all the ratings with an independent CFI and you enjoy flipping planes.

And if you are new to the game and really have the money to burn be willing to bet King Air is where you ultimately wind up. Jet ownership operating costs rarely makes financial sense for an individual short of some of the newer light sport jets on the market.
 
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I've asked a similar question to more experienced folks at the Classic Jet Aircraft Association (they fly jet warbirds such as the L-39 Albatros). To get an L-39 type rating (it's technically a LOA, not a type rating), you need 1000 hours. When I had 60 hours, I asked them what experience they recommended I get before flying a Jet warbird. I took notes on their advice, and I'll share it here. Of course, get your PPL first, in a normal plane such as a Cessna 172 or Piper Arrow. Here was their advice:


* Get an instrument (IFR) rating first. Get used to flying "in the system." This covers a lot of ground.

* Get complex time (complex = retractable gear, flaps, and constant-speed prop). Get time in bigger and faster aircraft.

* Get 500 hours of retract time before moving to the L-39 (putting the gear down should be second nature). If possible, get a multiengine rating.

* Get aerobatic lessons to get comfortable - start with a Citabria or something slower, then move to something like an Extra. (this step won't apply to business jets such as the Citation, although some upset training is probably a good idea).


I'm currently on this path. I just passed 400 hours, got my instrument rating last year. I'm flying a fairly fast single engine piston (a Columbia 400). This plane is "slippery", which means it's actually hard to slow down while you're descending from cruising altitude to your destination. Sometimes I have to start descending over 35 miles away from the destination airport. You have to plan your descents in advance. In fact, you have to plan everything in advance, because things move fast. In a jet, everything moves even faster. If I could afford it, I'd move up to a single engine turboprop. But I'll probably have to stick with the Columbia, which means I won't get the 500 hours of retract time they recommended. I'll have to get some retract time in something else, maybe a 182RG or who knows what.

So I guess you could something like:

1. Cessna 172 - get your PPL, and your IFR ticket in this. Rent.
2. Buy a Columbia or a Cirrus, or something comparable. Range: $300k (used) - $900k (new)
3. Get a single engine turboprop (Meridian, Pilatus PC-12, TBM-850, Denali, depending on how much you want to spend). Range: I'm not speaking from experience, but probably $1M - $5M, depending on year & options. Do you need a toilet? That costs more. Check out http://philip.greenspun.com/flying/ - he has some good, straightforward reviews of several of these planes (and others).
4. Get a jet.

You may be able to skip step 2, but it will require more training on the next step if you want to be safe.

Have fun along the way. Maybe get some mountain training, or gliders, or tailwheel.
 
With serious money but still doable for mortals I'd be looking at a pressurized Meridian (PA-46-500TP) or similar. With really unlimited funds, a C-130 would make a great flying motorhome. Neither would be good for someone with zero hours.
 
I flew a fixed gear Saratoga for 600ish hours in 10 years, 400 hours in a 310 over 18 months, and in the last 12 months have put about 200 on a Conquest.

I believe I could get a type rating and competently fly a Citation single pilot. I could also get insured.
 
Insurance is probably going to be your problem. I could only get $1mm smooth my first year in the twin and $2mm the first year in the turbine. Second year was much more reasonable and I could way up the coverage.
 
Hey thanks for the replies everyone. Mtuomi, I need to get some hours behind me and get a Commercial incl. Mutli. before I know what to buy. I hope to jump into a King Air C90 after training in one for a while. The flight academy I'm thinking about going to has 3 of them. Anyway, lots to think about!
 
Flyer9966 said:
The flight academy I'm thinking about going to has 3 of them. Anyway, lots to think about!
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One facility that can take care of all the training from zero hours to PPL, IA, CPL, Multi, and Multi Turbine is US Aviation Academy at KDTO. There are likely many others across the country, but this is one I am familiar with, and is very active and financially stable.

But Step Zero in this process should be obtaining your initial Medical Certificate. If you're all good there, then you can proceed to training. But if there is something in your medical history that prevents you from obtaining the Medical easy peasy, you'll have to work on addressing that before you submit your application to the FAA.

Keep us informed of your progress.
 
Hey guys I make about 5 mil an hour and just bought this G650...anyone know how to start this thing up?
 
James_Dean said:
I believe I could get a type rating and competently fly a Citation single pilot. I could also get insured.
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No doubt. If you're competent in the Conquest, the Citation will feel like a vacation.
 
Flyer9966 said:
Is this not a valid question? If not, why?
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Call and aviation insurance broker and ask these questions. Even if you are deep pockets you may have to self-insure if your first aircraft is a turbo-prop and your second a jet with less than 1000 hours in your logbook. You will also hit a wall if you do not have an instrument rating even in the turbo-prop.

The standard route is to start in a trainer like a Cessna 172 and fly non complex, lower performance planes for a couple of hundred hours. Get your instrument ticket in the trainer also. Then get your turbo-prop and fly that for another 500 to 1000 hours. Then go for the jet. Not only will you be safer but you will be able to buy insurance too.
 
@Flyer9966 -- You'll have to excuse some of these folks.... We get way more than our share of trolls and your initial question is in that category. Thus their unfriendly attitude and responses.

Training in your own aircraft is something many beginning pilots aspire to do and is often a good idea. Training in your own business jet? Still possible, but the costs outside of operating it are gonna be pretty steep until you accumulate the experience needed to get those costs down.

Also, at this juncture, you also have a big case of "you don't know what you don't know". You say you want to own/fly a business jet, and have stated a few models. But beyond that, there is still much to be learned on the specifics of those models to tell if the one you are looking at is worth owning, or is it gonna be off the line in the maintenance shop for most of the year.

Start like we all did by thinking "small". Train in the affordable C152's and C172's. Then make connections, friends, and more as you progress. Continue to add to the knowledge bank. Fly as often as you can to build hours and experience.

Then you'll have eaten into that big "you don't know what you don't know" mountain and will have a better idea of what aircraft will fit your needs, mission, and budget.
 
AggieMike88 said:
Training in your own business jet?Still possible, but the costs outside of operating it are gonna be pretty steep until you accumulate the experience needed to get those costs down.
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How are you going to fly solo?
 
CC268 said:
Hey guys I make about 5 mil an hour and just bought this G650...anyone know how to start this thing up?
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It
James_Dean said:
I flew a fixed gear Saratoga for 600ish hours in 10 years, 400 hours in a 310 over 18 months, and in the last 12 months have put about 200 on a Conquest.

I believe I could get a type rating and competently fly a Citation single pilot. I could also get insured.
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Already jonesin' for a Citation aren't you :)

In the boating world that is called '2 foot itis'
 
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