Oh no I did it again

I def second the removal of one of the middle row seats as shown in the pics. A fairly common setup that increases comfort and baggage room for a 2+2 or even 4 adult mission. I personally would prefer to remove the left middle one, but right middle works just as well as long as the pilot is ok with limited recline on a long flight.
 
So, as an owner of a plane with a driver's side door.....how can there be that many openings in the fuselage, but no door for the pilot in command?
 
pburger said:
Piper had a brochure showing the plane by a lake with a jet-ski that was supposedly put in the back of the plane. My buddy used to have a Lance, and it was very roomy and comfortable.
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There was an ad back in the 80s of them putting an upright piano in one and flying off.
 
Makes me wish for a Saratoga.
 
Badass, cowman. Congrats!
 
Congrats!

Now you REALLY have to come pick me up.

ps...hope you don't mind the right seat ;)
 
Eric Lehto said:
So, as an owner of a plane with a driver's side door.....how can there be that many openings in the fuselage, but no door for the pilot in command?
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It's one of many derivatives of the original 1961 Cherokee 160. Which only had one cabin door on the RH side.

Cessna got it right with two doors. But then screwed up royally and put the wing in the wrong place. ;)
 
GRG55 said:
Cessna got it right with two doors. But then screwed up royally and put the wing in the wrong place. ;)
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Beech got the right number of doors and the wing location, but then screwed up royally by making it slow. ;)
 
2FB2FD98-9853-4CB8-87AF-5F8D42B04F0C.jpeg
Hey a question for you guys.... plane has this sticker on it. Previos owner said he’s gotten it because he went to Canada a lot.... do I need to renew/update/remove or do anything with that sticker?
 
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Unless you plan to leave the country with the plane then Id take it off. Otherwise file for a new one.
 
simtech said:
Unless you plan to leave the country with the plane then Id take it off. Otherwise file for a new one.
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Correct. I got the 2018 sticker for my Arrow and then never used it. I have to decide between buying a 2019 sticker or taking the old one off. Expired stickers bug me.
 
I want one!

What's the useful load actually look like for a Lance? I've never really looked at them before. How's it compare to the other similar 6-seat players?
 
Holy crap @cowman !!! That's freakin' awesome.

I can't begin to express how jealous I am. I need one of those babies.
 
Nice plane! My friend just bought a Turbo T-tail Lance II and it's a beast! You can fly with the baggage doors off, up to 140 kts, so it will be used as a photo plane. I'd never flown any Lances, but I can say that flying the t-tail is strange. The elevator doesn't become effective until about 70, and when landing, it always seems to run out of authority just as you touch down. In other words, you can't hold the nose up at all once you touch down. I think I wore out the electric trim button on the yoke!

I do like the t-tail for photography, since it gets it out of my way, but your plane looks so much better!
 
mkosmo said:
What's the useful load actually look like for a Lance? I've never really looked at them before. How's it compare to the other similar 6-seat players?
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1380# +/- Take out rear and middle seats, it goes up. With full fuel, subtract 588 for 98 gallons. Still leaves a lot of hauling capacity.
 
SWOdaile said:
1380# +/- Take out rear and middle seats, it goes up. With full fuel, subtract 588 for 98 gallons. Still leaves a lot of hauling capacity.
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Wow! 792 full-fuel useful still makes for a decent 2-4 person airplane (depending on how well fed we are) on a long haul.
 
Lowflynjack said:
Nice plane! My friend just bought a Turbo T-tail Lance II and it's a beast! You can fly with the baggage doors off, up to 140 kts, so it will be used as a photo plane. I'd never flown any Lances, but I can say that flying the t-tail is strange. The elevator doesn't become effective until about 70, and when landing, it always seems to run out of authority just as you touch down. In other words, you can't hold the nose up at all once you touch down. I do like the t-tail for photography, since it gets it out of my way, but your plane looks so much better!
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True about the T-tail up to a point. I don't think of it as strange, but maybe it's because I'm used to it. It does require some awareness, but I think the benefits are worth the trade offs. It's a really smooth ride and a joy to fly.
 
SWOdaile said:
True about the T-tail up to a point. I don't think of it as strange, but maybe it's because I'm used to it. It does require some awareness, but I think the benefits are worth the trade offs. It's a really smooth ride and a joy to fly.
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Different is the word I should have used! Took me a few landings to get used to. It does seem to lower the value when comparing it to a similar plane without the t-tail, which is why my friend was able to afford one! They seem to be really nice planes.
 
Lowflynjack said:
Different is the word I should have used! Took me a few landings to get used to. It does seem to lower the value when comparing it to a similar plane without the t-tail, which is why my friend was able to afford one! They seem to be really nice planes.
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People keep talking about the t tail discount, I don't see it. Turbo discount yes, but NA t-tails go for as much as straight tails in my almost two year look of the type.

Great airplane, it's a stretch arrow after all. :D

SWOdaile said:
1380# +/- Take out rear and middle seats, it goes up. With full fuel, subtract 588 for 98 gallons. Still leaves a lot of hauling capacity.
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Slight nit pick. 4 of those gallons are unusable, so they're part of the empty weight of the aircraft. They're not part of the useful load.
 
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Been flying a T-Tail Lance for 7 years now, and love it.
Had a recent experience I felt I should share.
While doing my commercial training, I had to abort a couple of take-offs. Heavy with fuel and two full sized people in the cockpit, the CG was at about 86 inches which should have been fine as it’s well within the envelope. BUT it just would not rotate at the airspeeds the book calls for, so I had the shop check the stabilator rigging. The T-Tails are famously “nose heavy”, but I just felt like I wasn’t getting full travel on the stabilator. Sure enough, the mechanic found that the rigging had been set to “neutral” pitch by aligning the stabilator with the faring at the top of the t-tail which is apparently WRONG. This had the travel stopping a full 2 inches before it should have!
After re-rigging correctly by using the rails under the front seats as the reference plane, ITS A TOTALLY DIFF AIRPLANE! Rotates at 66-70 on short and soft field take offs per the book! and it leaps into the air at 80 on a normal take off with zero flaps! I can even hold the nose off longer on roll out!
I suppose it’s still a bit heavier on the nose than others except when it’s doing what it was really designed for - flying loaded down hauling people and stuff!
Makes me wonder how much of its reputation for diminished elevator authority is actually a result of bad rigging? If you have a PA32-300RT, it could be worth having the stabilator rigging checked by someone who can do it per the mfg specs.
It’s a great travel plane, and instrument platform.
 
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