Mooney M20J. Hints? Thoughts?

I don't find the Mooney too difficult to land. I can't speak from experience, but I've been told that other airplanes are more tolerant to a lack of precision in flying. The Mooney isn't tolerant at all.

If I'm landing with full flaps I'm trying to cross the threshold at 70 kts. In high crosswinds or if I can tolerate a higher airspeed I'll land with the intermediate flap setting and 80 kts on short final- my plane doesn't tend to float as much carrying a couple extra kts with intermediate flaps as with full flaps.

The only thing I haven't seen in this thread is giving the plane a little back pressure on the take off roll. Between ~40 kts and Vr the plane can start bouncing a little on the nose wheel. The take off roll will be smoother with a little back pressure on the yoke to remove some weight off the nose wheel.
 
The M20J's are very nice

biggest mistakes - coming in too hot and landing flat and/or locking up tires
 
smccray said:
The only thing I haven't seen in this thread is giving the plane a little back pressure on the take off roll. Between ~40 kts and Vr the plane can start bouncing a little on the nose wheel. The take off roll will be smoother with a little back pressure on the yoke to remove some weight off the nose wheel.
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You are very right on your observation. The nose wheel bouncing is more prone on wavy runways. It can lead to a prop strike if you do not lift the nose. For wavy runways I just don't use any flaps at all. The ground run is a little longer but for sure no bouncing. The rotation is very smooth with no trim required after lift off.

José
 
smccray said:
I don't find the Mooney too difficult to land. I can't speak from experience, but I've been told that other airplanes are more tolerant to a lack of precision in flying. The Mooney isn't tolerant at all.

If I'm landing with full flaps I'm trying to cross the threshold at 70 kts. In high crosswinds or if I can tolerate a higher airspeed I'll land with the intermediate flap setting and 80 kts on short final- my plane doesn't tend to float as much carrying a couple extra kts with intermediate flaps as with full flaps.

The only thing I haven't seen in this thread is giving the plane a little back pressure on the take off roll. Between ~40 kts and Vr the plane can start bouncing a little on the nose wheel. The take off roll will be smoother with a little back pressure on the yoke to remove some weight off the nose wheel.
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The M20J I had the opportunity to fly would wheelbarrow if you didn't take the weight off the nose.
 
wabower said:
Some of them had the factory-installed wing-leveler that required the pilot to depress a button on the yoke in order to maneuver. The standing joke at the time was that the controls were so heavy that the pilot was never sure whether the button was pushed.
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The C, D, E and F, but not the J.
 
The thing I like about the J is that the electric trim and the flap motors operate at exactly the right speed to allow you to cancel out the flap induced nose up/down pitch simply by holding the trim while the flaps are moving.

I loved my J. It was my first plane. Wish it had been my last.
 
Really old mooneys with shock biscuits that have petrified will benefit from their replacement. Once I learned to slow down, I had very little difficulty landing the various mooneys I flew. They would "thud" more than others due to the difference in the shock absorption methods IF you stopped flying before the wheels touched, but if you managed your energy well they'd roll on quite nicely.
 
My J is certified in kts, so I'll use those units.
Bruce is right. With proper speed control, say 65 kts, over the threshold the plane can consistently be landed smoothly. I've used 1/2 flaps in real gusty or strong crosswind conditions with a little more speed to good result. I have never dumped the flaps after touching down. I may try it, but I've never found it necessary.

I've gone back and forth with using TO (1/2) flaps and no flaps on take off. The no flaps does seem to help the nose wheel bounce.

My suggestion to the new Mooney pilot is to experiment a little. As long as you're spring loaded to go around the first bounce you will learn soon enough what works and what doesn't.
 
Lance F said:
As long as you're spring loaded to go around the first bounce you will learn soon enough what works and what doesn't.
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This is an excellent point. A J is NOT the airplane you want to try salvaging a porpoise until you have a bit of experience in it. The combination of slick airfoil, short gear and shock absorbers make it easier to find yourself on the wrong end of pilot induced oscillations than any other aircraft I know of.
 
Turns out it's a M20F but the numbers are close... I've done a fair amount of experimenting with it. I also found a 232 pg PDF called Training Manual, Mooney pilot proficiency program and have read the apropos parts. Gives good info for flying it by the numbers. I have noticed that it's hard to slow it down from 160 to 120 coming into the airport environment, but I've figured it out.
At this DA it doesn't really float much but then our airspeed is exactly between 75 and 80 crossing the fence too.
I've had the owner and the new to complex plane of any sort practice go arounds at altitude just to get the feel of it.

Other than it being difficult to get in and out of and the fact that it has TERRIBLE ventilation up front I'm liking it ok.
Sure is nice to be able to get where you're going faster
 
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