Messy adolescent history of mental illness, is a medical even something i can think about?

[help]

I am 20 in a non aviation job with the end goal of becoming an airline pilot however after looking into getting a medical… I don’t have much hope considering my history and how strict the FAA is.

The first time I had a psych stay that happened because I actually had ideations (12 y/o) however my illness was largely because of my environment including things like divorce, moving, and overall abuse/neglect which was a lot for me as a kid. While in middle/high school, every time I had an anxiety attack, they would send me to get a hospital eval. I’ve experienced so many incompetent mandatory reporters that have forced me to get an eval even when there was no mention of harm.

After that I dealt with depression, eventually turning into anxiety and this has been what I’ve accepted and treated with doctors over the years, which I believe doesn’t completely disqualify me yet. This I am willing to fight for.

Everything else is clearly hospital ******** and I didn’t realize how bad this could **** me up. Because of being forced into an eval by the school, I was going in and out of the ward til 16 y/o even if I genuinely wasn’t suicidal. Hospital said after that first admission, it was automatic entry due to risk no matter what my family or I told the hospital. The problem comes from the insane diagnoses they gave me. One 2 week stay could have up to five diagnoses as I would be given a handwritten copy from the psychiatrist of the discharge report. From anxiety, depression(major, persistent), ptsd, borderline, ocd, adhd, odd, ednos, psychosis, and god knows what else is actually on my record. I’ve been given meds for psychosis and adhd despite me actually not having either. My mental health has also significantly improved since I’ve become more independent as an adult and I have never acted like I had anything more than depression+anxiety. I will be getting a report from each hospital I stayed at soon, but will there really be absolutely nothing I can do about these ridiculous diagnoses if they do show up on my record? These are all illnesses i’ve never truly had and I have no interest in lying about it either.

 

[dbahn]

Don't worry about lying about anything. It wouldn't do any good except to get you into even deeper trouble,when records are requested and provided. Your own assessment of what you did and didn't have for a diagnosis is completely useless to the FAA. You will have to prove that you are squeaky clean mentally, which can be a daunting task considering that it's highly likely that one or more of those diagnoses are actually accurate, or were at the time. And even if they were not accurate, you have to have evidence that they weren't, and that can be challenging.

 

[help]

Don't worry about lying about anything. It wouldn't do any good except to get you into even deeper trouble,when records are requested and provided. Your own assessment of what you did and didn't have for a diagnosis is completely useless to the FAA. You will have to prove that you are squeaky clean mentally, which can be a daunting task considering that it's highly likely that one or more of those diagnoses are actually accurate, or were at the time. And even if they were not accurate, you have to have evidence that they weren't, and that can be challenging.

So it is possible to prove that I’ve recovered now? I’m aware that the depression/anxiety + suicidal ideation is what i’ve always been diagnosed with outside of the psych ward, only one of these other disorders even been mentioned as a possible diagnosis for me which was ptsd. I doubt the original doctor will remove the diagnoses but couldn’t a new psychiatrist say it’s not accurate or that i’ve gone into remission?

 

[Half Fast]

.....but couldn’t a new psychiatrist say it’s not accurate or that i’ve gone into remission?

It would have to be an FAA-approved ("HIMS") psychiatrist, not just anybody. And lots and lots of testing will be involved.

The biggest problem will be the suicidal ideation.

Anything is possible, but with what you've described you're probably looking at years and years plus many thousands of dollars to make it possible. You need expert help.

Paging @lbfjrmd @bbchien @WingmanMed

 

[dbahn]

So it is possible to prove that I’ve recovered now?

The basic underlying problem is that while it's fairly easy to prove that you DO have something, it's fairly hard to prove that you DON"T have something that was once present but now is not. In order to proceed, the FAA will request all of your records and can simply deny you if they don't get what they ask for.

 

[bbchien]

No consideration from FAA until age 26. In the interim they expect to see:

No meds
No “events”
Successful life test documented 3 deep by 3 Erwin’s clearly “in a position to know”

Institutional psychiatry thinks men who were severe enough to need the mental hospital aren’t a good risk.

 

[mryan75]

Everything else is clearly hospital ******** and I didn’t realize how bad this could **** me up.

With all due respect, and I truly wish you the absolute best, this isn’t a one time questionable diagnosis. Multiple stays, sometimes extended periods, a consistent history of mental illness, I would worry about your life rather than getting a medical. Take care of yourself, please.

 

[a little hopeless]

With all due respect, and I truly wish you the absolute best, this isn’t a one time questionable diagnosis. Multiple stays, sometimes extended periods, a consistent history of mental illness, I would worry about your life rather than getting a medical. Take care of yourself, please.

I understand how bad the multiple stays look but I was constantly being sent for the smallest reasons that didn’t require an entire stay. I felt terrible each time I felt I knew I didn’t need it because I was forced to take a bed from someone who possibly did. The schools I attended did a terrible job with their judgement, often assuming that I was in danger to myself when I gave no indication of such other than needing space outside the classroom to calm down. My family and friends would say I have a good judgement of knowing what level of help I need when I do. I admit the first time was a genuine call for help when I was 12 and had no resources, but after that I sought out proper treatment and never got to that point where I felt in danger to myself again. At this point, I had no control over the hospital’s decisions to keep admitting me. Staff would harass my mother and I during intake calling us liars or believed I was deceiving them. This is why I feel so frustrated with my situation.

 

[a little hopeless]

No consideration from FAA until age 26. In the interim they expect to see:

No meds
No “events”
Successful life test documented 3 deep by 3 Erwin’s clearly “in a position to know”

Institutional psychiatry thinks men who were severe enough to need the mental hospital aren’t a good risk.

Honestly i’m willing to wait. Becoming independent has been the huge light at the end of the tunnel that I needed. By the time i’m 26, I don’t think it will affect me enough to reoccur at all as i’ll be long gone from the problem (family) by then. Do you think it will be better if I also have history documenting improvement addressing whatever illnesses come up in my files until then?

 

[RadialGal]

There are no "places outside the classroom," in the sky. You can't find a quiet place or safe space or anything like that when the turds hit the turbine. You've got to play it as it lays. This industry may not be for you.

 

[Jameskerr3]

waivers are seldom granted for psychosis, schizophrenia, personality disorders manifested by over acts.. But I did read an appeal of a guy who got his 2nd class after the ntsb full board agreed he had psychosis. he submitted psych reports. 27 years later..

 

[Jameskerr3]

waivers are seldom granted for psychosis, schizophrenia, personality disorders manifested by over acts.. But I did read an appeal of a guy who got his 2nd class after the ntsb full board agreed he had psychosis. he submitted psych reports. 27 years later..

the administrator seemed to abandon the diagnosis of psychosis. But still he was at first permanently disqualified. it was of course a 2nd class special issuance granted- started 1971 final denied- 1998 may granted.

 

[Half Fast]

I was constantly being sent for the smallest reasons that didn’t require an entire stay.

The schools I attended did a terrible job with their judgement, often assuming that I was in danger to myself when I gave no indication of such other than needing space outside the classroom to calm down.

I had no control over the hospital’s decisions to keep admitting me. Staff would harass my mother and I during intake calling us liars or believed I was deceiving them.

You're in the middle of all this and probably can't see it as others might. Frankly, these statements above seem to say that everybody else, including health care professionals, is wrong about your conditions and you're the only one who's right. That's exactly what we should expect from someone who's judgement is impaired. Bear in mind that a pilot is required to personally assess his own fitness to fly before every flight, and an objective observer might conclude you're not presently capable of doing that.

In any case, the FAA's job isn't to put you into the cockpit, it's to keep anyone who might be unsafe out of the cockpit. Your own opinion of your condition is immaterial as far as the FAA is concerned, and only opinions from psychiatrists who are acceptable to the FAA will matter.

I admit the first time was a genuine call for help when I was 12 and had no resources, but after that I sought out proper treatment and never got to that point where I felt in danger to myself again.

What you've said here is that proper treatment is necessary to prevent you from harming yourself. That's a condition that isn't allowed in the cockpit, period, hard stop. Even if you're being treated it will be unacceptable, as a person might stop taking meds on their own. It's not uncommon for a person to begin feeling better, decide they're cured, and stop treatment. Such a person might think something like this:

My mental health has also significantly improved since I’ve become more independent as an adult and I have never acted like I had anything more than depression+anxiety.

See what I mean?

These are all illnesses i’ve never truly had and I have no interest in lying about it either.

But your statements above contradict this. How do you know you've never had these illnesses? After all, you have said that prior to treatment you wanted to harm yourself. You've said you had (have?) depression+anxiety.

Dr. Bruce Chien, who posted above, is an expert in difficult cases like yours and he has a good understanding of just what would be necessary for you to get a medical. Seek his advice and follow it. If Bruce decides a medical will be a near possibility, take his word for it.

You have a loooong and expensive path ahead of you.