Magnetic Bearing To the station

SixPapaCharlie

SixPapaCharlie

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Why are they telling me "MH+RB=MB" when the needle points to the station?

The needle should be pointing to the MB. No math required correct?

I got the test questions right on the first go round but this time, I gotsa know the WHY? Ya feelin me?
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Why are they telling me "MH+RB=MB" when the needle points to the station?

The needle should be pointing to the MB. No math required correct?

I got the test questions right on the first go round but this time, I gotsa know the WHY? Ya feelin me?
Click to expand...

I assume this is regarding ADF/NDB...
Say you are headed due north (assume all directions magnetic), and the station is due east of your position. In this case the ADF needle will point to your 3 o'clock. If your ADF bezel is set so that north is up, then the needle will indicate "090" and all is correct, since that's the magnetic bearing of the station.
But, if you are headed due east, toward the station, everything else being the same, the needle will point straight up, to your 12 o'clock position, and will therefore indicate "360" or "000", which is *not* the magnetic bearing to the station.
So in this case you can either turn the bezel to match your heading (090), in which case the needle will correctly indicate 090, or just mentally add: "I am headed toward the station, and am at 090 heading, therefore the station is at 090 magnetic bearing from me."
Bottom line: unless the bezel is automatically kept at your current heading, you either need to manually rotate it, or mentally correct for it (i.e. rotate it in your head).
 
Ok, You're right, I got it.
Fixed vs movable variations.

Thank you.
 
Relative bearing is in relation to degrees off the nose of the airplane. If the station is at your 3 o'clock, the relative bearing is 090. The magnetic heading is just that, your magnetic heading. Say you are going directly east(mag heading of 090), and the station is directly to your right(090 degrees from your nose), the magnetic bearing to the station would be 180. You would have to go south to get to the station.
 
Gucci Pilot said:
Relative bearing is in relation to degrees off the nose of the airplane. If the station is at your 3 o'clock, the relative bearing is 090. The magnetic heading is just that, your magnetic heading. Say you are going directly east(mag heading of 090), and the station is directly to your right(090 degrees from your nose), the magnetic bearing to the station would be 180. You would have to go south to get to the station.
Click to expand...

Ok, and on movable card version of the ADF in your last scenario, the needle would be pointing to 180 and read directly and in the fixed variation of the ADF, the same scenario, the needle would be pointing to 90

In both cases the MB would be 180 just that one would require the calc vs read directly.
 
Who the hell uses an NDB these days anyway? Wait, are there any still in service?
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Why are they telling me "MH+RB=MB" when the needle points to the station?

The needle should be pointing to the MB. No math required correct?

I got the test questions right on the first go round but this time, I gotsa know the WHY? Ya feelin me?
Click to expand...

Don't chase the needle. Pick a heading.

Real ADF needles bounce around quite a bit.
 
Unit74 said:
Who the hell uses an NDB these days anyway? Wait, are there any still in service?
Click to expand...

Well, they are pretty useful for finding an ELT. Or, something very much like them.

Not that you need to do that just to be an instrument pilot.

FYI, there may not be many NDBs around (though there ARE some and they may be a backup if your nav receiver blows up), but you can also use AM radio stations.
 
MAKG1 said:
Don't chase the needle. Pick a heading.

Real ADF needles bounce around quite a bit.
Click to expand...

Noted.

We had one in our plane but I never touched it.
I am flying a cardinal on Sun that has one. I will fire it up and pay attention to the behavior.

Thanks.
 
There used to be some questions about which quadrant the plane is, based on the ADF indicator and DG. Those are worth working. See if you can work them ALL (assuming they still have them).
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Why are they telling me "MH+RB=MB" when the needle points to the station?

The needle should be pointing to the MB. No math required correct?

I got the test questions right on the first go round but this time, I gotsa know the WHY? Ya feelin me?
Click to expand...

Good news! My spy at ASA, who attends meetings with the test writers along with the Kings, Gleim, et al tells me that NDB questions will disappear from the next bunch of tests. Can you hang out until February?

Bob Gardner
 
Once you fly with one, it can be fun at first. The new wore off of it in 2 flights for me. The next time I sort of flew with one just for the heck of it, was not actually an ADF, but I used the bearing pointer on the G1000 and it acts like one pointing to a VOR.
 
Unit74;1669658[B said:
]Who the hell uses an NDB these days anyway?[/B] Wait, are there any still in service?
Click to expand...


Listening to ball games during flight...;)
 
all those replies and not a single one gave the correct answer - first, apply the relative bearing grease prior to departure...
 
bobmrg said:
Good news! My spy at ASA, who attends meetings with the test writers along with the Kings, Gleim, et al tells me that NDB questions will disappear from the next bunch of tests. Can you hang out until February?

Bob Gardner
Click to expand...


Yes! I will probably take the written around April depending on what else I have going on.

What else can I skip? because I have way too much information in my head about LORAN
 
Clark1961 said:
all those replies and not a single one gave the correct answer - first, apply the relative bearing grease prior to departure...
Click to expand...

Don't forget to apply the relative ground speed and track into the Relativity Bearing correction.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Ok, and on movable card version of the ADF in your last scenario, the needle would be pointing to 180 and read directly and in the fixed variation of the ADF, the same scenario, the needle would be pointing to 90

In both cases the MB would be 180 just that one would require the calc vs read directly.
Click to expand...

correct
 
Henning said:
Don't forget to apply the relative ground speed and track into the Relativity Bearing correction.
Click to expand...

yabut relativity only is a factor as one approaches the speed of beer
 
I have officially logged an NDB approach to mins.

For my grandchildren, ya know.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Yes! I will probably take the written around April depending on what else I have going on.

What else can I skip? because I have way too much information in my head about LORAN
Click to expand...

I think that Loran is going away as well. The test writers have done some real soul searching recently, goaded by the reps of the different publishers.

Bob
 
I can see LORAN going away, but there are still quite a few airplanes flying that have an ADF installed and maintaining an NDB really isn't all that expensive. All of us can't necessarily afford to install a 430W. I am still motoring around with a VOR w/ GS, an ADF and a handheld GPS. Affording Avgas is hard enough :).
 
somorris said:
I can see LORAN going away, but there are still quite a few airplanes flying that have an ADF installed and maintaining an NDB really isn't all that expensive. All of us can't necessarily afford to install a 430W. I am still motoring around with a VOR w/ GS, an ADF and a handheld GPS. Affording Avgas is hard enough :).
Click to expand...

foreflight?
 
somorris said:
I can see LORAN going away, but there are still quite a few airplanes flying that have an ADF installed and maintaining an NDB really isn't all that expensive. All of us can't necessarily afford to install a 430W. I am still motoring around with a VOR w/ GS, an ADF and a handheld GPS. Affording Avgas is hard enough :).
Click to expand...

Loosing Loran C was the biggest mistake the guvmint made in the last 5 years... I had one in my Warrior ( King 8001-01) 30 years ago... It was deadly accurate and always worked....
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
foreflight?
Click to expand...

When it works, and the sun isn't too bright, it's fine.

Assuming it always works is not a good idea.

Curiously, there seem to be a number of near-current GPS outages over tens of thousands of square miles speckled around the East Coast at the moment. I'm used to seeing these around the southwest. Example:

!GPS 01/028 (KZDC A0014/15) ZDC NAV (CSG4 GPS 15-01) GPS (INCLUDING WAAS,GBAS, AND ADS-B) MAY NOT BE AVAILABLE WITHIN A 335NM RADIUS CENTERED AT 300500N0800500W (OMN 056071) FL400-UNL DECREASING IN AREA WITH A DECREASE IN ALTITUDE DEFINED AS: 285NM RADIUS AT FL250, 220NM RADIUS AT 10000FT, 182NM RADIUS AT 4000FT AGL, 139NM RADIUS AT 50FT AGL. 1501171500-1501172300
Click to expand...

If that bites you, none of your other GPS toys will work, either. Over business hours tomorrow.

And, to be blunt, only a fool would bet their life on an iPad. That's what it means to fly an instrument approach depending on its GPS. It's nice for holding plates, but use something else to fly the approach. Like an ADF or VOR or actual certified GPS. Even better, have more than one. Leaving the legalities aside for the moment, it's a toy.
 
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MAKG1 said:
Art Bell and reality in the same sentence?

Not in this universe.
Click to expand...

Did you miss the period? That is that dot between 'Art Bell' and 'Reality'. What that little dot does is separates sentences. So, as you can now see, they are not I the same sentence. YAY!!! Can you tell me how to get, how to get to Sesame Street...:rofl:
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Yes! I will probably take the written around April depending on what else I have going on.

What else can I skip? because I have way too much information in my head about LORAN
Click to expand...

Good news/bad news. LORAN questions have been withdrawn. That's the good news. Kinda bad news is that the gummint has finally seen the light, recognized that other nations around the world are going to eLoran (accuracy equivalent to GPS) and is getting on board.

Having been CO of two Loran stations back in the day, I know and appreciate its capabilities as a backup to GPS: low frequency vs high frequency; space-based vs earth-based. The Commandant of the Coast Guard was reacting to political pressure when he shut the system down in 2010....now the infrastructure must be rebuilt.

Bob Gardner
 
bobmrg said:
Good news/bad news. LORAN questions have been withdrawn. That's the good news. Kinda bad news is that the gummint has finally seen the light, recognized that other nations around the world are going to eLoran (accuracy equivalent to GPS) and is getting on board.

Having been CO of two Loran stations back in the day, I know and appreciate its capabilities as a backup to GPS: low frequency vs high frequency; space-based vs earth-based. The Commandant of the Coast Guard was reacting to political pressure when he shut the system down in 2010....now the infrastructure must be rebuilt.

Bob Gardner
Click to expand...


Hmmm..
Must the the first mistake the guvmint ever made...:mad2::mad2::mad2::rolleyes:
 
N801BH said:
Hmmm..
Must the the first mistake the guvmint ever made...:mad2::mad2::mad2::rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Sheesh! It's haters like you that make it impossible to be a politician these days. Don't you know that decommissioning the LORAN sites prior to building the eLORAN system is part of a secret, long range, multi-agency plan to fight terrorism? Now stop being negative and give total support and recognition to the wisdom of the leaders in your government!
 
Clark1961 said:
Sheesh! It's haters like you that make it impossible to be a politician these days. Don't you know that decommissioning the LORAN sites prior to building the eLORAN system is part of a secret, long range, multi-agency plan to fight terrorism? Now stop being negative and give total support and recognition to the wisdom of the leaders in your government!
Click to expand...

I am sorry...... You are right......:redface::redface::redface::redface::redface::redface:...

Decommissioning the LoranC network was for the children, wasn't it...:dunno:;)
 
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