Lost comm on VFR flight following?

lionclaw

lionclaw

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Andy
Today I requested/received VFR flight following while flying past KEVV on my way back to Dayton. Around 40mi past Evansville I found that I could no longer receive Evansville (probably out of range). They hadn't terminated FF, or passed me off yet (if they did, I couldn't hear).

I requested cancellation of FF (no response), and switched back to 1200 a few minutes later.

So my question is, was this the right thing to do? If radio comm is lost due to range, is any followup required, or does one just resume VFR flight/squak?
 
In my area, both radar and radio coverage may be spotty for anyone flying below 10k or 12k. The normal procedure is to keep the code and hope the next segment is more lucky (need to know who's responsible for the airspace though, which may be tricky). At arrival, go 1200 at the spot they would normally cancel, if you still haven't regained the comm and land at an uncontrolled field, otherwise keep the squak as usual.
 
zaitcev said:
In my area, both radar and radio coverage may be spotty for anyone flying below 10k or 12k. The normal procedure is to keep the code and hope the next segment is more lucky (need to know who's responsible for the airspace though, which may be tricky). At arrival, go 1200 at the spot they would normally cancel, if you still haven't regained the comm and land at an uncontrolled field, otherwise keep the squak as usual.
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They usually dump me when they know I'm going into an area/altitude they won't be able to see/hear me at. The lone exception is crossing the border into Canada, they'll tell me to stay on the radio and keep my squawk code even though I'm going out of radar coverage. I wouldn't recommend squawking VFR during a border crossing. I lost radio comm once on FF near the seattle area (PTT went TU), I was outside of the Bravo, I just kept my squawk code, stayed out of areas that required radio communications and landed at my destination then punched in 1200 before we took off again.
 
I just talked to some center controllers a couple days ago, and this question came up.

Once you switch to 1200, you will stop being a datablock on their scope. They'll still see you, but you will be just another VFR return. They DID say that is not the preferred method of cancelling FF - they really want you to tell them to cancel rather than just dump them by going to 1200.
 
Happened to me. Squawked 7600 for a minute. Went back to original code, stayed on it, assigned heading and altitude until I descended at my destination. I set the transponder to standby while changing to and from 7600 to make sure I wouldn't squawk an emergency code.
 
This is more just lost radio coverage, rather than a true lost comms (i.e. your comms died, your headset or audio panel died, etc.).

A lot of times, if you're listening to 121.5 on your #2 radio, they will try to get ahold of you to give you the new frequency if you don't get handed off. Otherwise, you can look on your charts to try to find one, or broadcast on 121.5 asking for help to find a frequency.
 
Several times I have lost 2 way while recieving FF on a VFR flight. Never was attempt to re establish comms via guard.

In each case what I did was to make a call or two on known freqs (then wait). Then, switch to next freq. No answer, announce in the blind no reception but keep assigned squawk.
 
Richard said:
Several times I have lost 2 way while recieving FF on a VFR flight. Never was attempt to re establish comms via guard.
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It's probably only happened to me once or twice VFR. But I've also only lost comms VFR once or twice. I'm IFR most of the time, and they do it IFR significantly more.

In each case what I did was to make a call or two on known freqs (then wait). Then, switch to next freq. No answer, announce in the blind no reception but keep assigned squawk.
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Which works if you know the frequencies, but in this case, the OP might not have known the frequencies. But as I mentioned, the AFD or charts can help there.
 
Best bet is to try to get a frequency that can relay a call, whether it be FSS, a nearby tower or RCO or another light overhead. Dropping unexpectedly off radar can be stressful for the controller who, unless he knows the reason (such as spotty coverage in that area) may suspect the worst. Even as another aircraft flying along, a controller repeatedly trying to reach someone who's been using FF but disappeared, sounds scary. And sometimes thinking the worst is justified.
 
Around these parts they try and contact you a few times, and then they make a presumptive transmission for cancelling you. Now, if they are expecting to lose radio contact they give you the next frequency and the time to try it. Squawking 7600 is essentially discouraged for VFR traffic unless you need light signals or plan to enter a Bravo. Cruising with 7600 as VFR they can lose track of who you are and they have to guess where you are going and may even move/hold other traffic.
 
I would imagine they still see your transponder code well after they lose your Comm. I stay on the code if I can pick up another APP frequency, but if I am in the middle of nowhere, I just switch to 1200 if I can't reach them.
 
First, there's nothing wrong with what you did. And flying off the edge of scope isn't the same as dropping off the scope within their area of coverage -- controllers are supposed to notice the latter and react to it, as that means you may have gone down (even VFR). Remember that as long as you retain the last assigned squawk, ATC (even the next sector) will still know who you are, so if you think you've flown out of the airspace of the controller with whom you were communicating, keep squawking your assigned code and try a freq for the next sector/facility (or even Guard - 121.5) to try to hook up again with ATC.
 
Ron Levy said:
First, there's nothing wrong with what you did. And flying off the edge of scope isn't the same as dropping off the scope within their area of coverage -- controllers are supposed to notice the latter and react to it, as that means you may have gone down (even VFR). Remember that as long as you retain the last assigned squawk, ATC (even the next sector) will still know who you are, so if you think you've flown out of the airspace of the controller with whom you were communicating, keep squawking your assigned code and try a freq for the next sector/facility (or even Guard - 121.5) to try to hook up again with ATC.
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Not necessarily. If the flight has been entered into the NAS computer those facilities that interface with the host ARTCC computer will know. If the flight has only been entered into the ARTS computer only those in that TRACON will know.
 
Whenever that happens to me, I call a nearby airport tower and get the apropriate new center freq and check back in with center.
 
7600 is a bad idea VFR. What are you trying to tell them? That you've lost comms? Since you are VFR, that isn't relevant to anybody.

Go to 1200. I wouldn't stay on my code for long either. I'm sure it's somewhat annoying when a plane on some non-1200 code just flies through your sector without a handoff.
 
7600 is a bad idea VFR. What are you trying to tell them? That you've lost comms? Since you are VFR, that isn't relevant to anybody.
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Talked to the controller after I reset my radio a half dozen times. He had no problem with a short 7600 squawk.

Go to 1200. I wouldn't stay on my code for long either. I'm sure it's somewhat annoying when a plane on some non-1200 code just flies through your sector without a handoff.
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The controller was very specific that I should continue to squawk my assigned code until I got to my intended destination.

I have a friend that is a TRACON supervisor and flight instructor. I'll give him a call and see what he says. This stuff really ought to be in the AIM.
 
You didn't say if you could hear other aircraft or not. If you can get one of the jets to relay that works. 121.5 works also. Had this on my student long XC except it was a radio issue. I could hear and ended up using the ident button to communicate with them (they would ask a question and indicate to ident if that's what I wanted).
 
Anthony said:
I stay on the code if I can pick up another APP frequency, but if I am in the middle of nowhere, I just switch to 1200 if I can't reach them.
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^^^^^ That

It happens sometimes flying from Harrisburg Approach west sector. At lower altitudes they'll hand you off to JST just west of Blue Mountain. But there's no way JST can hear you below 5,000. So I either climb or squawk 1200 and maintain altitude or descend.

This is Traffic Advisories we're talking about here. IFR Lost Comms are a whole 'nuther thing and doesn't apply in this case. It seems a few posters are confusing the two.
 
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