Looking to become a pilot

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michael_pesek

Filing Flight Plan
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michael_pesek
Hello everyone!
I am new here and I have a few questions that I hope to get some good feed back from all of you. Let me tell you a little about myself. I have always dreamed of being a pilot but never really pursued it. I have loved flying ever since I was a kid and have always loved plains. I am now 34 and am looking for a career change. First question, is it to late to train to become a commercial pilot? I have done some research and found that there seems to be a demand for pilots. I have also seen that some of the major airlines are willing to train people from no experience. From what I have read it seems like they want you to be under 25 before your training is finished. That is why I ask at my age is it to old to start training for a career in this field. I took an introductory flight lesson which I loved and want to pursue. I have looked into getting my PPL and then possibly going to ATP flight training school. Before committing to this I want to make sure is this feasible at my age. Also what are your recommendations to pursue this career in the most cost effective and quickest route. I know it is expensive to join this field. Thats why I would love your feedback for someone that doesn't have a ton of money to pay for the school and training. I look forward to hearing from you and to help me pursue my dream. Thank you!
 
34 isn't too old at all - if it's what you want to do, go do it. That said, go get your Private. Have fun doing it. You have a lot of flying to do before you get to the point where you need to start making real decisions about your flying career. Keep us up to speed about your progress. There are some grumpy old men on this board, but most of us love to hear about it. :)

Oh, and read this thread:

https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/when-dreams-come-true-long.79490/
 
Not too old.

I wouldn't go to ATP, it's fast food training and steakhouse prices.

Look into gliders and tailwheel
 
What kind of work are you doing now.
What education do you have.
Do you have any big bills, family, mortgage.
Do you have any medical problems in your history, or any alcohol or drug related driving infractions or arrests.

You are not too old, but it can be a long, hard, and expensive road that requires commitment, hard work and determination.
 
kayoh190 said:
34 isn't too old at all - if it's what you want to do, go do it. That said, go get your Private. Have fun doing it. You have a lot of flying to do before you get to the point where you need to start making real decisions about your flying career. Keep us up to speed about your progress. There are some grumpy old men on this board, but most of us love to hear about it. :)

Oh, and read this thread:

https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/when-dreams-come-true-long.79490/
Click to expand...
Thank you and I will keep posting on my progress. Also great thread that you posted.
 
Mason said:
What kind of work are you doing now.
What education do you have.
Do you have any big bills, family, mortgage.
Do you have any medical problems in your history, or any alcohol or drug related driving infractions or arrests.

You are not too old, but it can be a long, hard, and expensive road that requires commitment, hard work and determination.
Click to expand...

Right now I am currently in retail running a store. Education is a GED with some college. No degrees. I have no big bills besides my vehicle, no family, and no mortgage. I have no medical problems in my history, and no drug or alcohol infractions or arrests. I am willing to fully commit and see it through as long as I know it is possible. I am a very hard and determined worker when I set my mind to something. I know at this age it is much harder for a career change but I am willing to sacrifice whatever it takes to make it happen.
 
If it is what you want, go for it. You can do a lot of training while still maintaining your current job and income. You may want to think about getting the degree.
 
Mason said:
If it is what you want, go for it. You can do a lot of training while still maintaining your current job and income. You may want to think about getting the degree.
Click to expand...
Not running a store.

You can do a 9-5 desk job and train at the same time, but if you try to do that with a small business, it will suffer. It requires handing off some or all of the responsibility to someone else.
 
michael_pesek said:
Hello everyone!
I am new here and I have a few questions that I hope to get some good feed back from all of you. Let me tell you a little about myself. I have always dreamed of being a pilot but never really pursued it. I have loved flying ever since I was a kid and have always loved plains. I am now 34 and am looking for a career change. First question, is it to late to train to become a commercial pilot? I have done some research and found that there seems to be a demand for pilots. I have also seen that some of the major airlines are willing to train people from no experience. From what I have read it seems like they want you to be under 25 before your training is finished. That is why I ask at my age is it to old to start training for a career in this field. I took an introductory flight lesson which I loved and want to pursue. I have looked into getting my PPL and then possibly going to ATP flight training school. Before committing to this I want to make sure is this feasible at my age. Also what are your recommendations to pursue this career in the most cost effective and quickest route. I know it is expensive to join this field. Thats why I would love your feedback for someone that doesn't have a ton of money to pay for the school and training. I look forward to hearing from you and to help me pursue my dream. Thank you!
Click to expand...

Never too late, per se, to find a job you love. I know someone who entered the industry in his late 30's early 40's after 09/11 and subsequent furloughs. I lost touch with him but he's either a senior guy with a regional or moved to a major when he was last mentioned in conversation. My advice is for flying in the US, and seeking employment with US based operators and airlines.

The most cost effective route: Be able to immerse yourself in it. Fly often. 2-3 times a week, particularly in the early stages. You spend less time and money "relearning" and "remastering" things when you have less downtime between lessons. When you say you dont have a lot of money, I must say that folks who are unable to sustain this tempo typically end up taking more time, flying more hours and spending even more money when its stretched out because of funding problems. So be cognizant of your limitations.

For private, you dont get much of a break on required training hours between formal flight schools (part 141) and not so formal schools (part 61). For instrument and commercial, there may be a benefit to going the formal route (and pretty much required if you are going to use GI Bill). Many pilots take the route of becoming a flight instructor to build time and experience. In this scenario you get paid a little, build time, and dont have to pay for the plane. Others go to work towing banners, air tours or shrimp spotting or whatever other menial job they can find until they have the minimum hours to get employed at a regional airline or charter/fractional operation. Airline jobs, even for the copilot for a commuter, are going to require you to meet ATP minimums (1500 hrs, and have some multiengine experience). It will take a few years of working low level wage flying jobs to get a slightly more higher low level wage flying job in the airline environment. From there, seniority rules, and you can upgrade as openings and seniority allow. I've had friends tell me they can upgrade at a regional from copilot to captain in 6 mos to a year if they choose to, and after a year or two of captain in a multi turbine commuter, they are eligible to apply for the major airlines as a copilot (where they start over on the seniority thing all over again but make living wages). I am not aware of any major airlines in the US taking people off the street with zero experience and training them to be pilots. Overseas, perhaps, but here, not so much.

One friend of mine has stayed copilot at the regional over the years, and is the most senior guy in the right seat, and has the pick of his schedule and a wonderful quality of life. The tradeoff is pay but he lives on the cheap. He has told me if he went captain his seniority with the company would move him up the list a bit, if I understood him right.

So not to sound like a debbie downer but you have to make an informed decision if you are going to do this. You will be spending a lot of money up front, then living at subsistence wages for several years after, all the while working your way up the food chain. You could be at a major airline in 5-10 years. Mandatory retirement at 60-65 provided you do not have any medical issues crop up before hand. Finally, before you spend any money on all this, its best to see if you are eligible for an FAA medical or require a waiver. Certain things are disqualifying, such as use of ADHD or most antidepressant medications.

Edit: just read all the other threads.. If you are physically fit and have mechanical aptitude, would you consider starting in construction trades if that is an option near you? You will make more as a brand new helper than you typically will in retail (at least in the petrochemical field you would). It will be hard, physical work, but you can advance, make more money as your skills improve and be able to invest that in flying. Its an option for someone without a lot of college education to fall back on.
 
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No, it's not too late. I don't know of anyone who will pay you to train you. You will spend a lot of your own money to get the certificates, ratings and hours. I wish you well.
 
Where about are you located? I would put the attainable goal of a private pilot's license 1st on the docket, then build on that as feasible.

I've never subscribed to the thought of 'waiting for things to happen', one has to MAKE things happen(not that you implied you'd be 'waiting').

To get the ball rolling, look for a local private pilot ground school course, touch base with a local flight school or FBO with planes, instructors, and 'intro flights'. You can also get at least a years free student membership at AOPA's online site.
 
Yes go get your private to discover what it's all about. As mentioned, try to fly at least twice a week to keep from repeating previous material and lessons. You're not too old for a professional pilot career at all. When I was a regional we had pilots in their 50s-60s, and even the majors have hired pilots in their 60s (I know Delta has). The Regionals are finding it more difficult to find new pilots right now and the majors still have a ton a applications. But in the very near future I think the majors are going to be feeling a shortage as well due to the tremendous amount of pilots retiring in the next 10-15 years. There's also government flying jobs, charter (Part 135), and corporate flying. Also military but they have high requirements including a college degree. Here's a great deal. Get in an ANG oe Reserve outfit, get your private, and they may be able to get you a pilot slot. I've had a few students to so and a couple are flying F-16s now. Gucci on here (POA) flys KC10s I think for the New Joisey ANG.

Good luck!
 
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Go for it. Make sure you can get a first class medical before you pour any money into training.
 
If you enjoy teaching, becoming a CFI can be lucrative and open doors into aviation careers. You're not too old if you are healthy. I was 42 when I got my private pilot license.
 
One thing nobody has addressed. OP has no degree, not even high school. My experience is that this may very well be a show stopper. Even corporate jobs may require a degree in something. Just a thought.
 
ronnieh said:
One thing nobody has addressed. OP has no degree, not even high school. My experience is that this may very well be a show stopper. Even corporate jobs may require a degree in something. Just a thought.
Click to expand...
True. The regionals won't care if you don't have a degree but if you want to be competitive at a major airline you'll want to have at least a Bachelor's.
 
ronnieh said:
One thing nobody has addressed. OP has no degree, not even high school. My experience is that this may very well be a show stopper. Even corporate jobs may require a degree in something. Just a thought.
Click to expand...

True now, but if this "pilot shortage" gets to that point they'll drop the requirement. Back in the early 60s United actually took people off the street and put them thru their ratings. Different now with the 1500 hour requirement (airlines) whereas corporate is who you know, and if a flight department knows you and wants you, you're in. As Jordane says, if you want to be competitive employees desire a degree.
 
Mason said:
If it is what you want, go for it. You can do a lot of training while still maintaining your current job and income. You may want to think about getting the degree.
Click to expand...

What kind of degree do they like you to have and in what area?
 
Doggtyred said:
Never too late, per se, to find a job you love. I know someone who entered the industry in his late 30's early 40's after 09/11 and subsequent furloughs. I lost touch with him but he's either a senior guy with a regional or moved to a major when he was last mentioned in conversation. My advice is for flying in the US, and seeking employment with US based operators and airlines.

The most cost effective route: Be able to immerse yourself in it. Fly often. 2-3 times a week, particularly in the early stages. You spend less time and money "relearning" and "remastering" things when you have less downtime between lessons. When you say you dont have a lot of money, I must say that folks who are unable to sustain this tempo typically end up taking more time, flying more hours and spending even more money when its stretched out because of funding problems. So be cognizant of your limitations.

For private, you dont get much of a break on required training hours between formal flight schools (part 141) and not so formal schools (part 61). For instrument and commercial, there may be a benefit to going the formal route (and pretty much required if you are going to use GI Bill). Many pilots take the route of becoming a flight instructor to build time and experience. In this scenario you get paid a little, build time, and dont have to pay for the plane. Others go to work towing banners, air tours or shrimp spotting or whatever other menial job they can find until they have the minimum hours to get employed at a regional airline or charter/fractional operation. Airline jobs, even for the copilot for a commuter, are going to require you to meet ATP minimums (1500 hrs, and have some multiengine experience). It will take a few years of working low level wage flying jobs to get a slightly more higher low level wage flying job in the airline environment. From there, seniority rules, and you can upgrade as openings and seniority allow. I've had friends tell me they can upgrade at a regional from copilot to captain in 6 mos to a year if they choose to, and after a year or two of captain in a multi turbine commuter, they are eligible to apply for the major airlines as a copilot (where they start over on the seniority thing all over again but make living wages). I am not aware of any major airlines in the US taking people off the street with zero experience and training them to be pilots. Overseas, perhaps, but here, not so much.

One friend of mine has stayed copilot at the regional over the years, and is the most senior guy in the right seat, and has the pick of his schedule and a wonderful quality of life. The tradeoff is pay but he lives on the cheap. He has told me if he went captain his seniority with the company would move him up the list a bit, if I understood him right.

So not to sound like a debbie downer but you have to make an informed decision if you are going to do this. You will be spending a lot of money up front, then living at subsistence wages for several years after, all the while working your way up the food chain. You could be at a major airline in 5-10 years. Mandatory retirement at 60-65 provided you do not have any medical issues crop up before hand. Finally, before you spend any money on all this, its best to see if you are eligible for an FAA medical or require a waiver. Certain things are disqualifying, such as use of ADHD or most antidepressant medications.

Edit: just read all the other threads.. If you are physically fit and have mechanical aptitude, would you consider starting in construction trades if that is an option near you? You will make more as a brand new helper than you typically will in retail (at least in the petrochemical field you would). It will be hard, physical work, but you can advance, make more money as your skills improve and be able to invest that in flying. Its an option for someone without a lot of college education to fall back on.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for all the information. I greatly appreciate everyones input and recommendations. Many things to consider
 
sourdough44 said:
Where about are you located? I would put the attainable goal of a private pilot's license 1st on the docket, then build on that as feasible.

I've never subscribed to the thought of 'waiting for things to happen', one has to MAKE things happen(not that you implied you'd be 'waiting').

To get the ball rolling, look for a local private pilot ground school course, touch base with a local flight school or FBO with planes, instructors, and 'intro flights'. You can also get at least a years free student membership at AOPA's online site.
Click to expand...

I am located in the Sacramento area of CA. I did sign up for the AOPA site and that has a bunch of great information
 
michael_pesek said:
How do I do that?
Click to expand...
How bout you show some initiative and google it a bit... this is relatively low hanging fruit. You should be able to identify what an FAA first class medical is, and where to get one, in a few short clicks. People dont get the career you are looking for handed to them. They work for it. There are at least two appropriate physicians (senior AME's) in Sacramento.
 
To get your medical, https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/get/
Find an AME (Aviation Medical Examiner) near you using https://www.faa.gov/pilots/amelocator/. I would make an appointment to do a consult with them unless absolutely nothing has ever happened to you medically. Even little things can be big in aviation. Yes, you will pay for that consult.
When you're ready, fill out your application using https://medxpress.faa.gov/

This article is from November, but it should give you an idea about the degree of the pilot shortage. It's a good time to be doing this. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...p-hiring-on-start-from-scratch-pilot-training

Call around to some different airlines' HR departments and tell them what you want and ask them how to get there with them. That will help you understand your path. Understand, there are numerous ratings you have to get as well as hours to accumulate.

The minimum hours and many people go over these:
40 hours total time - Private Pilot
+50 total hours cross country - Instrument rating
250 hours total time - Commercial Rating
After Commercial, optional Instructor Rating. Bonus is that you log the hours you fly with a student while teaching.
1500 hours total time - Airline Transport PIlot

Somewhere in there you need a multi-engine rating as well.

Each hour will be between $65 up to $300+ depending on the type of airplane. Ouch, yes the math stinks. This is why there's a pilot shortage and why JetBlue experimented with training from scratch.

A lot to digest in there
 
This is not a career to consider if you have little or no money. Just getting the PPL, will cost at least $10,000. And it only gets more expensive from there.

Watch these:

 
Doggtyred said:
How bout you show some initiative and google it a bit... this is relatively low hanging fruit. You should be able to identify what an FAA first class medical is, and where to get one, in a few short clicks. People dont get the career you are looking for handed to them. They work for it. There are at least two appropriate physicians (senior AME's) in Sacramento.
Click to expand...

Sorry. I will look into it.
 
bflynn said:
To get your medical, https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/get/
Find an AME (Aviation Medical Examiner) near you using https://www.faa.gov/pilots/amelocator/. I would make an appointment to do a consult with them unless absolutely nothing has ever happened to you medically. Even little things can be big in aviation. Yes, you will pay for that consult.
When you're ready, fill out your application using https://medxpress.faa.gov/

This article is from November, but it should give you an idea about the degree of the pilot shortage. It's a good time to be doing this. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...p-hiring-on-start-from-scratch-pilot-training

Call around to some different airlines' HR departments and tell them what you want and ask them how to get there with them. That will help you understand your path. Understand, there are numerous ratings you have to get as well as hours to accumulate.

The minimum hours and many people go over these:
40 hours total time - Private Pilot
+50 total hours cross country - Instrument rating
250 hours total time - Commercial Rating
After Commercial, optional Instructor Rating. Bonus is that you log the hours you fly with a student while teaching.
1500 hours total time - Airline Transport PIlot

Somewhere in there you need a multi-engine rating as well.

Each hour will be between $65 up to $300+ depending on the type of airplane. Ouch, yes the math stinks. This is why there's a pilot shortage and why JetBlue experimented with training from scratch.

A lot to digest in there
Click to expand...
Thank you for the info.! I will make some calls
 
Yeah, just FYI, one is supposed to check with local pilots about a nearby AME to get a medical from. Some being much more pilot friendly than others. I guess if one is 25 yrs old & top gun material it's doesn't matter who you go to.

To me that's the preferred way over just checking who's near on the FAA site.
 
If you have any questions about ATP, let me know! I've almost completed their program and can answer most of your questions.
 
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