Logging safety pilot time

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Blueangel

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I am helping out a few pilot friends who are finishing up their IR and have flown as safety pilot. How would I log this time and would it be worth it to do so?

So far it has been a lot of fun and really show me the value of the instrument rating.
 
I believe that you could log all the time that your friend is under the hood so long as your appropriately rated. IE..in a C-182RG? You will need private with complex and high performance. In a 172? All you will need is your private. I would log PIC and remark that I was serving as Safety Pilot for So and So in the remarks section

Have Fun!!
 
Blueangel said:
I am helping out a few pilot friends who are finishing up their IR and have flown as safety pilot. How would I log this time and would it be worth it to do so?

So far it has been a lot of fun and really show me the value of the instrument rating.
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You can log it as Pilot in Command time ONLY if you are acting as legal PIC of the flight. To do so you must be current and qualified in every way to be PIC of that flight. And although not an FAR type requirement, if you are doing so in someone elses airplane, make sure you are covered insurance wise. That isn't necessarily an automatic thing.

If you can't or don't want to log it as PIC, you are entitled to log it as Second in Command time. Keep in mind that in either case you are acting as a required crew member and must have a current medical.

You certainly don't HAVE to log it at all, but hours are hours, if you need them.

There seems to be a contingent of people who will automatically say to log it as PIC. That isn't necessarily appropriate or even legal in a lot of cases. But if you follow the guidelines I mentioned above, you shouldn't run afoul of the FAA if your logbook were ever audited.
 
flyinhood said:
I believe that you could log all the time that your friend is under the hood so long as your appropriately rated.
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True so far

IE..in a C-182RG? You will need private with complex and high performance.
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Only if you are actually acting as PIC in that type aircraft. If you are acting as SIC, you don't need the endorsements.

I would log PIC and remark that I was serving as Safety Pilot for So and So in the remarks section
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You have to be careful doing that because you have to ACTUALLY be acting as PIC in order to log it as such. If you weren't legal to act as PIC or for some other reason chose not to, then you can log it as SIC time.

Have Fun!!
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Yeah, that.
 
peerlesscowboy said:
I never log safety pilot time, with over 6000 hrs tt why bother?
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Well, some people might need the extra hour or two for ratings and such. Besides, if one is legally entitled to it, why not.

In the end it is a personal preference.
 
Hang on.....we can't consider Greg's correct answers above to be REALLY correct until Ron chimes in quoting chapter, verse, and pseudo legal Latin to make it an official answer. :nono:
 
The pilot flying under the hood might also want to include your name as "safety pilot" in their remarks section for when / if their logs get audited (check ride), it will be apparent to the DPE how the instrument time was flown (ie. not under the hood with my wife in the right seat but an actual legal safety pilot).
 
flyinhood said:
The pilot flying under the hood might also want to include your name as "safety pilot" in their remarks section for when / if their logs get audited (check ride), it will be apparent to the DPE how the instrument time was flown (ie. not under the hood with my wife in the right seat but an actual legal safety pilot).
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That is actually a logging requirement.
 
MikeELP said:
Hang on.....we can't consider Greg's correct answers above to be REALLY correct until Ron chimes in quoting chapter, verse, and pseudo legal Latin to make it an official answer. :nono:
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LOL. I almost included something to that effect in my post.
 
Under what circumstance is SIC time helpful other than something cool in your logbook? I flew safety pilot with my buddy in his Mooney, I am not endorsed for complex, so I didn't log anything, what is the benefit to me to log SIC? Yeah, I know I can look it up, but I would then miss out on all the sarcastic answers and that would be no fun at all.
 
mikeinbama said:
Under what circumstance is SIC time helpful other than something cool in your logbook? I flew safety pilot with my buddy in his Mooney, I am not endorsed for complex, so I didn't log anything, what is the benefit to me to log SIC? Yeah, I know I can look it up, but I would then miss out on all the sarcastic answers and that would be no fun at all.
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Flying as a safety pilot ,is not the same as second in command time.
 
mikeinbama said:
Under what circumstance is SIC time helpful other than something cool in your logbook? I flew safety pilot with my buddy in his Mooney, I am not endorsed for complex, so I didn't log anything, what is the benefit to me to log SIC? Yeah, I know I can look it up, but I would then miss out on all the sarcastic answers and that would be no fun at all.
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Counts as "Total Time" for things like your Commercial rating.
 
mikeinbama said:
Under what circumstance is SIC time helpful other than something cool in your logbook? I flew safety pilot with my buddy in his Mooney, I am not endorsed for complex, so I didn't log anything, what is the benefit to me to log SIC? Yeah, I know I can look it up, but I would then miss out on all the sarcastic answers and that would be no fun at all.
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It is total time. If one is scratching and fighting for flight time for a rating, every hour counts.

Other than that, personal preference.
 
Thanks guys this is very helpful. Well I have 250 hours total time and working toward my IR and Commercial ratings so not sure if it is worth noting in my logbook. It is a lot of fun though and a great way to fly for free since my buddy paid for the rental aircraft.
 
Blueangel said:
Thanks guys this is very helpful. Well I have 250 hours total time and working toward my IR and Commercial ratings so not sure if it is worth noting in my logbook. It is a lot of fun though and a great way to fly for free since my buddy paid for the rental aircraft.
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You meant to say is cheaper since you paid for 50% of the flight, but we knew what you meant ;)
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Not necessarily. See post number 5.
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Nobody in the world would consider SIC time in a 182 as real time. Thats why you just log PIC and not worry about explaining how you were second in command in a piper cub.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
PHP:

As safety pilot you are not tied to the shared cost rule.
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I just thought that since the "safety pilot" is being compensated then he/she would be required the pro rata share. I'm sure Ron will agree with me and that's really all that matters.
 
NJP_MAN said:
I just thought that since the "safety pilot" is being compensated then he/she would be required the pro rata share. I'm sure Ron will agree with me and that's really all that matters.
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What you're saying contradicts what he has written on this subject.
 
NJP_MAN said:
Nobody in the world would consider SIC time in a 182 as real time.
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That is your opinion. I don't agree with it.

Thats why you just log PIC and not worry about explaining how you were second in command in a piper cub.
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Yeah. Well, if you are flying as my safety pilot, we would have the discussion beforehand. Chances are, you are not qualified to act as PIC of my airplane. And I am sure you are not insured to act as PIC of my airplane. What I would ask you to agree to is that I am the legal PIC and will log it as such. YOU will log it as SIC or not at all. If we can't agree on that, I would find someone else. If we did agree on that and I found out you logged it as PIC, I would not ask you to be my safety pilot again.

I can't control what you ultimately do, but if you log PIC when you are not the actual PIC in this case, what you are doing is really blatantly illegal.

As Ron would say, "Caveat Aviator".
 
NJP_MAN said:
Nobody in the world would consider SIC time in a 182 as real time. Thats why you just log PIC and not worry about explaining how you were second in command in a piper cub.
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You can't log it as PIC unless you were the actual PIC as Greg outlined earlier in the thread.

Beyond that, who cares if you have SIC time as safety pilot logged in a 182 or Piper Cub? Anyone who understands logging time will understand what it is and give it whatever weight they want. But it's personal preference whether to include it or not.
 
NJP_MAN said:
Nobody in the world would consider SIC time in a 182 as real time.
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One other thing.

So illegally logged PIC is worth more than legally logged SIC?

I would like to see you float THAT one by the legal experts.

Caveat Aviator
 
Greg Bockelman said:
One other thing.

So illegally logged PIC is worth more than legally logged SIC?

I would like to see you float THAT one by the legal experts.

Caveat Aviator
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Good point. I have decided to start sitting in the back of planes and logging time as 2nd officer. I'll just watch the gages real close while the safety pilot looks outside and the PIC is looking at the flight instruments.
 
NJP_MAN said:
Good point. I have decided to start sitting in the back of planes and logging time as 2nd officer. I'll just watch the gages real close while the safety pilot looks outside and the PIC is looking at the flight instruments.
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Now you are just being silly. Do what you want to do. Just know that if you log PIC as a safety pilot you must actually BE the PIC or you are logging it illegally.
 
Rather than being obsessed with logging the safety pilot time, one could just look at it as a way to help out a friend, to learn a new aircraft or new techniques, etc., to just get up in the air, and if your friend is real nice as a way to possibly get to fly with the same friend on other fun trips where you might just get to actually fly a leg of the trip and log it without all of this pontificating.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Rather than being obsessed with logging the safety pilot time, one could just look at it as a way to help out a friend, to learn a new aircraft or new techniques, etc., to just get up in the air, and if your friend is real nice as a way to possibly get to fly with the same friend on other fun trips where you might just get to actually fly a leg of the trip and log it without all of this pontificating.
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Yeah but that is kind of beside the point. When you have someone advocating something that is blatantly illegal you can't just let it go.
 
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Walboy said:
I carefully read most of what Ron posts. I learn a lot from him and feel his contributions here are valuable. I'm sure he must have thick skin and doesn't need defending but I for one am glad he posts here.
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Same here, even though I'm not shy about disagreeing with him when I think it's warranted.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Rather than being obsessed with logging the safety pilot time, one could just look at it as a way to help out a friend, to learn a new aircraft or new techniques, etc., to just get up in the air, and if your friend is real nice as a way to possibly get to fly with the same friend on other fun trips where you might just get to actually fly a leg of the trip and log it without all of this pontificating.
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It doesn't require obsession to log things according to FAA regulations and guidance.
 
Well I won't log it then just curious what the FARs say about safety pilot time
 
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