Local news story on the "pilot shortage"

I am skeptical. I gradated from the Ohio State Univ a couple winters ago in Aviation Management and having all my pilot certificates prior to that. The industry has not been kind and there are no CFI jobs to be had around Ohio.

David
 
I've been seeing media reports of pilot shortages for the last decade and a half.
 
What they should have called it is: "There's a pilot shortage for people willing to work for $16K a year and still have to pay for their own type ratings and still have to fork out over $100K to get an ATP". That's the only shortage there is. There is no shortage of direct entry captains, or FO's at legacy airlines that actually pay a living wage.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
There is no such thing as a direct entry captain at a legacy airline.
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Maybe not in the US, but abroad it happens. Emirates has done it and I think many of the Chinese ones do it.
 
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Airline executives, concerned about an imminent world shortage of pilots, are taking steps that will place younger and less experienced fliers in command of airliners.

The shortage, most apparent in other countries, is still a few years away in the United States, aviation experts say. But it has already caused a flurry of hiring by American carriers unseen in recent years that points to the coming scarcity.

''Ten years from now every airline in the country will have 30-year-old captains,'' said Capt. Vern Laursen, vice president for crew training at Trans World Airlines. Causes of the Threat

The reasons for the threat of a scarcity are numerous: the boom in the civil aviation industry; a soaring retirement rate among an aging corps of pilots, whom the Government requires to leave the job at 60; a decline in the number of new students taking up flying, partly a result of costs of basic training that have risen with liability insurance rates, and a lack of growth in the airlines' customary supply of aviators from the military, which has raised pay in an effort to remain more competitive with the carriers.

As a result of all these factors, the pool of experienced American fliers is drying up. ''The whole industry's pretty well employed right now,'' said Ed Muir of the International Air Service Company, which recruits crews for airlines. ''It used to be, a large percentage of pilots were unemployed.''

The employment boom is such that one-eighth of the 56,000 pilots flying large jets for United States airlines were hired last year. And these airlines expect to hire 32,000 more pilots in the next 10 years, says Future Aviation Professionals of America, a career information service based in Atlanta. Debate Over Safety

While the notion of 30-year-old captains may sound alarming to a public that has long equated gray hair in the cockpit with safety -two-thirds of major airlines' pilots are over 45 - most executives and other aviation experts contend that a new generation of young pilots is not necessarily a safety threat. Some even argue that younger, less-experienced pilots may be safer than their predecessors, because they will have learned fewer bad habits.

These experts caution, however, that the trend toward less experienced pilots means that the new aviators must be trained better from the first day. Others assert that even the best training is not always an adequate substitute for years of experience in the most demanding cockpit situations, particularly those requiring mastery of an emergency that could lead to an accident.

''If they've got enough training that they are a walking book of knowledge on that airplane, that can make up for experience,'' said Donald D. Engen, former head of the Federal Aviation Administration. ''But when push comes to shove, when everything turns to worms, experience is what really counts.''

The pilot hiring boom now under way is sending a number of ripples throughout the aviation industry, including these:

* Age, vision, height and weight restrictions that once kept many would-be pilots from the cockpits of major airlines have been loosened. Further, until three years ago most big airlines hired only college graduates; now one newly hired pilot in 10 has no college degree.

* Training programs are expanding, and students with little experience, especially women and members of minority groups, are being recruited to seek careers as pilots.

* The use of flight simulators and other computerized training devices is booming, with civilian and military pilots spending more and more of their training time on the ground. Some experts say this trend has gone too far, but officials of training programs are ecstatic at the chance to run rapidly through a series of exercises that would be dangerous in an airplane and that can be tailored to individual pilots' weaknesses. Paid Training a Trend

Paying nonpilots to learn how to fly has not caught on yet in the United States, but it is growing overseas, with carriers like Japan Air Lines, Lufthansa and Swissair training new fliers from classroom to cockpit. These carriers' experience may point the way for airlines in the United States.

In October, China Airlines, of Taiwan, sent 11 flight attendants and 13 other workers to the first class of a new flight school in Grand Forks, N.D., run by Northwest Airlines and the University of North Dakota. Gulf Air, of Bahrain, is sending eight more students this month. The airlines are paying the $67,000 cost for each student.

Capt. Y. L. Lee, director of training for China Airlines, said his carrier's students would spend 18 months in training in North Dakota and four more in Taiwan before going to work on 45-minute flights around the island.

Worried that a shortage is near, United and Eastern as well as Northwest have struck deals with universities or colleges to help run aviation programs aimed at producing professional pilots. The F.A.A. and Northwest split the cost of a new $6 million aerospace center on the North Dakota campus.
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This article was written in 1989.

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/11/us/pilots-scarce-airlines-see-30-year-olds-as-captains.html
 
flhrci said:
I am skeptical. I gradated from the Ohio State Univ a couple winters ago in Aviation Management and having all my pilot certificates prior to that. The industry has not been kind and there are no CFI jobs to be had around Ohio.

David
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The FBO I rent from in Dayton has hired a couple new instructors in the past year or so. Maybe Columbus is saturated?
 
I just saw a posting on another forum for an Ohio CFI job. Make your own job. You can offer your CFI skills as a contractor.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
 
There is a shortage at the regional level now and pass rates are dropping for new hires. The bottom is being reached and hopefully it turns to a positive.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
 
desertav8r said:
I just saw a posting on another forum for an Ohio CFI job. Make your own job. You can offer your CFI skills as a contractor.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
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I am already a contractor in my flying club but there has been no interest for the last year. One instructor seems to get all the business. Have not given up though.

David
 
Yeah its tough sometimes. The shortage isn't at the CFI level. It's those with the ATP minimums. So many CFIs will be staying longer.
 
kgruber said:
There has NEVER been a pilot shortage in the US.
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My old Chief Pilot was a new hire at Eastern Airlines in the mid 60's. He was hired with a Private Pilot license Single Engine Land.

He did his Commercial Multi and Instrument Checkride in a DC-9 simulator.

:dunno:
 
RotorAndWing said:
My old Chief Pilot was a new hire at Eastern Airlines in the mid 60's. He was hired with a Private Pilot license Single Engine Land.

He did his Commercial Multi and Instrument Checkride in a DC-9 simulator.

:dunno:
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Well, the Viet Nam War was sucking up all the available qualified pilots so in that regard there was a shortage of qualified AVAILABLE pilots.

In the current environment there is a shortage of qualified pilots that are willing to work for the entry level wages that are being offered. Also, under the current environment, the job just isn't what it used to be, therefore a less enticing career choice for many.
 
RotorAndWing said:
My old Chief Pilot was a new hire at Eastern Airlines in the mid 60's. He was hired with a Private Pilot license Single Engine Land.

He did his Commercial Multi and Instrument Checkride in a DC-9 simulator.

:dunno:
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That's interesting.
 
flhrci said:
I am skeptical. I gradated from the Ohio State Univ a couple winters ago in Aviation Management and having all my pilot certificates prior to that. The industry has not been kind and there are no CFI jobs to be had around Ohio.

David
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Soooooo.......maybe ......go someplace else ???????
 
Art VanDelay said:
Soooooo.......maybe ......go someplace else ???????
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I would if I didn't have to do a lot of stuff for my 72 year old Mom to keep her in the house. My brother has all but disappeared and won't help. So, wish that was an option.

David
 
flhrci said:
I would if I didn't have to do a lot of stuff for my 72 year old Mom to keep her in the house. My brother has all but disappeared and won't help. So, wish that was an option.

David
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We must do what we must do. Good on you for taking care of your mother. I am my mother's legal guardian (she's my ward, just like Batman and Robin). I didn't need or want the responsibility, but realized the other day that I was the only one in the family who could have shouldered the burden.
 
flhrci said:
I would if I didn't have to do a lot of stuff for my 72 year old Mom to keep her in the house. My brother has all but disappeared and won't help. So, wish that was an option.

David
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I wish you well in your efforts.

I don't regret the work I had to do to take of my parents, I wish I could have done more.
 
flhrci said:
I would if I didn't have to do a lot of stuff for my 72 year old Mom to keep her in the house. My brother has all but disappeared and won't help. So, wish that was an option.

David
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David, you have my utmost respect, as well as others here that shoulder the responsibility of taking care of elderly parents. Family is more important than any aviation job, or any job for that matter. Aviation jobs come and go, but when family is gone from this earthly life, they are gone. Money can come from other sources besides aviation.
 
Zeldman said:
David, you have my utmost respect, as well as others here that shoulder the responsibility of taking care of elderly parents. Family is more important than any aviation job, or any job for that matter. Aviation jobs come and go, but when family is gone from this earthly life, they are gone. Money can come from other sources besides aviation.
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Indeed. But you say that like it's self-evident. To the sea of aviation junkies, it isn't. Hence the impossibility of a pilot shortage in the aggregate. It's pretty sad really.
 
the only reason you have a shortage of anything is when that thing is too cheap - with labor you have a shortage because the role does not pay well enough - or is too dangerous -
 
comanchepilot said:
the only reason you have a shortage of anything is when that thing is too cheap - with labor you have a shortage because the role does not pay well enough - or is too dangerous -
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Exactly. There's no shortage at any of the jobs that are worth a crap, and I doubt there ever will be.
 
comanchepilot said:
the only reason you have a shortage of anything is when that thing is too cheap - with labor you have a shortage because the role does not pay well enough - or is too dangerous -
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Agree...

Being a CFI is my Saturday morning golf game thankfully... :yesnod:

I feel sorry for all of the young folks that show up at airports all over America every day.. eating PB&Js to earn 1500 hours..

They struggle for 2 years making marginal $ as a CFI to make even worse $ as a regional first officer... :mad2:
 
SinkorSwim said:
I feel sorry for all of the young folks that show up at airports all over America every day.. eating PB&Js to earn 1500 hours..

They struggle for 2 years making marginal $ as a CFI to make even worse $ as a regional first officer... :mad2:
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Worse yet, after going through all that their airline goes bankrupt and they have to do through it all over again, but his time with a family and mortgage.
 
There will never, never, ever, be a shortage of qualified applicants at the major airlines or quality corporate jobs such as Exxon/Mobil, Union Pacific, Johnson and Johnson, Valero Energy, flying G-5/Global Express level equipment.

At the regional level, some argument does exist that a qualified applicant shortage may occur. Some argument but not much.

I would never recommend aviation as a profession these days. As a hobby, yes. But paying XXXX thousands to get your ratings to chase some airline job ? Negative.

Good Luck
 
SinkorSwim said:
Agree...

Being a CFI is my Saturday morning golf game thankfully... :yesnod:

I feel sorry for all of the young folks that show up at airports all over America every day.. eating PB&Js to earn 1500 hours..

They struggle for 2 years making marginal $ as a CFI to make even worse $ as a regional first officer... :mad2:
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why do you feel sorry for them ? They CHOSE to live in squalor while training themselves for a future poverty level job.
 
B350ATP said:
There will never, never, ever, be a shortage of qualified applicants at the major airlines or quality corporate jobs such as Exxon/Mobil, Union Pacific, Johnson and Johnson, Valero Energy, flying G-5/Global Express level equipment.

At the regional level, some argument does exist that a qualified applicant shortage may occur. Some argument but not much.

I would never recommend aviation as a profession these days. As a hobby, yes. But paying XXXX thousands to get your ratings to chase some airline job ? Negative.

Good Luck
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Friend of mine interviewed for a corporate job flying a Beech 350. Required 5000 total time, type, 1000 in type, college degree, etc. while not flying the pilot is expected to have "other duties" (cleaning aircraft, hangar, errand boy for owner) . All of this for $45k/yr.

My friend declined, but the job was filled within 24 hours.
 
RotorAndWing said:
Friend of mine interviewed for a corporate job flying a Beech 350. Required 5000 total time, type, 1000 in type, college degree, etc. while not flying the pilot is expected to have "other duties" (cleaning aircraft, hangar, errand boy for owner) . All of this for $45k/yr.

My friend declined, but the job was filled within 24 hours.
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As so would I.
 
My first corporate job as captain of a PT135 King Air A90 paid $40/ day.

That included the days that I wrote the multi-pilot 135 manual from scratch, before word processors.
 
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