LiveATC -- Clearance Practice

AggieMike88

AggieMike88

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The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
Frequently discussed is practicing clearance copying by listening to LiveATC.

What airport feeds are suggested that have active Clearance Deliveries and don't get cut off by the scanner changing to the Tower or Ground frequency?

I've tried finding a few on my own, but the airport I select either isn't doing much IFR business (channel is silent) or the feed is off line.
 
Don't forget that there are also archives. Somewhere I used to have a program that would compress out the "silence" out of an MP3 file. I'll have to see if I can find that.

The following airports have dedicated CD feeds at liveatc:

JFK, ATL, BOS, PHL (though it's multiplexed with 121.5 which shouldn't be too bad), SFO
 
Problem with practicing copying clearances using someone else's clearance is you have no idea what they filed and you can't ask for clarification. It makes it a lot easier to copy a clearance when you have some idea of what you're gonna get. My students practice copying clearances by filing IFR on every flight, even local training flights.
 
Mike, try going to youtube and search for "Clearance Delivery." I saw some examples there. I have just started casually dabbling into some IFR texts, but probably won't even attempt the written for a year or so.
 
JFK has a clearance only channel. "KJFK Clearance Delivery"

That will hone your scratch pad skills to a razor sharp point. :)
 
And once I'm fluent in Brooklynese, everywhere else in th world will be simple.
 
AggieMike88 said:
And once I'm fluent in Brooklynese, everywhere else in th world will be simple.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that wouldn't help me much either!

I have been trying to do the same lately myself. I have had the best luck with my handheld at the local airport I fly out of every week for work. Just show up a little early and listen to the ground controller, seems to be helpful.
 
As stated, the ones listed are the ones I was able to find in LIVEATC that have a CD that's not mixed in with the tower, ground, or other frequencies (other than PHL's odd pairing of CD and 121.5).

The problem with most of the bigger airports (can't find any small fields with a dedicated CD feed) is that the airlines don't use CD and the smaller fry tend to all get the same clearance such as:

NAVION 5327K Cleared to Podunk Airport via Capital Nine HANEY Squawk 4321 (if they do it right or)

NAVION 5327K Cleared to Podunk Airport via Capital Nine, Radar Vectors HANEY then as filed Climb and maintain 3000 Expect 9000 TEN minutes after departure, departure frequency 126.65, squawk 4321
(I've never understood Dulles Clearance's use of the CAPITOL SID and then repeating all the information that is on it).
 
Use phl Philadelphia clearance. It's a us airways hub and it doesnt have the data link system so you hear a ton, specially during there peak push times. Or at least they didn't have the data link system this spring when I was doing it. Best airport I found for practicing copying clearance.
 
I've never found copying the clearance to be all that difficult. The only thing that is challenging at times is when there's a route that has fixes in it you don't know how to spell. The rest should be pretty easy.

Fox example, the above (I'll use the redundant clearance) I just write as:

CAPITAL 9 HANEY 30E90 126.65 4321

The rest is pretty much redundant verbiage (for example, it's always expect higher ten minutes after departure in my experience. If it ever was some other time, I'd write +5 or whatever).
 
I teach and use the CRAFT technique (clearance limit, route, altitude, frequency, transponder), and generally prefill what I need. For example, if I filed IFR from VKX to OFP at 4,000, I might start my CRAFT with:

C-- VKX. -I already know where I'll be cleared to
R-- - leave plenty of room for the routing
A-- ____, 10--> 40 -I already know what I filed for, which is usually expected in 10 min
F-- 119.85 - I often can figure out the freq; just mark thru if something else
T-- ______

HFR -the controller will always say "hold for release" until we're ready to go


So when the controller says:

November 182 victor is cleared to Hanover county airport via radar vectors Brooke, victor 155 coatt direct, climb and maintain two thousand, expect four thousand one zero minutes after departure, squawk four six zero tree, departure frequency one one niner point eight five, hold for release.

...all I have to do is fill in

R-- rv BRV V155 COATT
A-- 20,
T--4603

...and read back. Pretty easy. If the controller gives you a long clearance and says something you don't understand, just write an underline in the routing and keep going. You can always ask him to repeat or spell the fix you missed.
 
Actually, the routing at IAD was so down pat we didn't even copy it. I'd just put the departure frequency in #2 and the transponder code in the transponder.

I used to write out the CRAFT as Brad does but frankly given that I've never been given a clearance limit other than the airport I've filed to, and the rest are in an obivous order, I tend to just write it out as a single line (Unless I've got one of these 20 hop routes from BOS -> DC) where I need to break it along lines.
 
Since we're drifting (again) to the various methods and shorthand for copying clearance, I'll toss this baby ruth into the pool.

Check the various sources for your possible routings, especially where longer and more complicated ones might occur (such as busy SoCal airspaces). Fltplan.com is one source as is the A/FD in the preferred routings section.

Now you have a means of pre-writing your "script" with the preferred route into your C-R-A-F-T frame work. If you get something different, then write that out. But if you get what you're expecting, you're ahead of the curve a bit.

Point is, do a bit of homework and it might save some grief and controller repeats.
 
I still remember my IFR XC in my instrument training. There was no preferred route in the database so I just filed to the nearest VOR in the right direction (CJR-GVE) and then airways down to my destination. This was reasonable enough that the computers accepted it. Of course calling for my clearance I got a completely different route (I had not learned yet that nearly all CJR departures go to CSN first). Of course, having been based at IAD for years I was used to copying all the clearance other than the route and this route wasn't that involved.

Then as soon as I contacted departure after takeoff they told me they had a new route for me. My instructor is smiling as this is just the kind of instructional activity that makes for good training. I get things cleaned up and tell them I'm ready to copy. The new route sounds amazingly familiar, it's exactly what I filed for originally.

The route is the hard part. Get good at copying that and everything else is a breeze. You can expect a routing change from time to time (or you might get one on a IFR popup you will file if you live in the metro areas of the coasts...
 
Copying clearances ain't that big of a deal, just know somewhat to expect, don't worry about dumb acronyms and whatnot, and just use short hand.
 
Do you know what to say when they read 5 items and you copy and only get the first three?
 
CD: Did you copy that.
27K: Not all of it.
CD: What part didn't you get?
27K: The part after Navion 5327K is cleared to the Culpeper airport.
 
coloradobluesky said:
Do you know what to say when they read 5 items and you copy and only get the first three?
Click to expand...

"N123 cleared to Sicily airport via Odysseus3 departure, homer transition V69 Silla Intersection, V666 charybdis VOR, did not copy remaining route, squawk..."

The controller will then repeat the route after Charybdis VOR.
 
AggieMike88 said:
And once I'm fluent in Brooklynese, everywhere else in th world will be simple.
Click to expand...

TRocket said:
Yeah, that wouldn't help me much either!....
Click to expand...

Why not? Ju speaka da English right? Ok, then any clearance delivery should work for you. I highly doubt there will be any "Country Bumpkin Clearance Delivery" channels anytime soon so y'all ull just have ta make dew!

nyak nyak!
 
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