Lightsquared and GPS system

[Henning]

Scott works in the industry...he has a good handle on the leasing thing.

Right, sounded like the same rules basically.

 

[ScottM]

Thanks. I'm glad to hear that it's a lease and not an ouright sale, because if it were the latter, I would say that the taxpayers were getting a raw deal.

IMHO and very personal opinion, in the NextWave case I mentioned in my post above, the tax payers did get a raw deal. NextWave did not pay for their licenses that they won in the auction, but did get to keep them and resell them. The FCC got to spend a lot of tax payer money trying, unsuccessfully, to get the licenses back from NextWave when they failed to pay. This is but one case, albeit a notorious one in the spectrum auctions.

 

[Palmpilot]

Perhaps Congress should give Federal agencies priority in bankruptcy proceedings, right behind the IRS.

 

[SCCutler]

Perhaps Congress should give Federal agencies priority in bankruptcy proceedings, right behind the IRS.

It would appear that, regardless of whether congress gave it to the government or not, they take it (see, e.g. General Motors secured bondholders, butt-reaming).

 

[Palmpilot]

It doesn't sound like that worked in the FCC's case.

 

[Henning]

IMHO and very personal opinion, in the NextWave case I mentioned in my post above, the tax payers did get a raw deal. NextWave did not pay for their licenses that they won in the auction, but did get to keep them and resell them. The FCC got to spend a lot of tax payer money trying, unsuccessfully, to get the licenses back from NextWave when they failed to pay. This is but one case, albeit a notorious one in the spectrum auctions.

I would think the FCC would have "preferred creditor" claims on the proceeds from the bankruptcy sale though. Not like they won't be able to make it up when the lease expires.

 

[Palmpilot]

How long are spectrum leases typically good for?

 

[denverpilot]

There's some other stuff that's hard to explain too that's not covered by "licensing" or "leases". Since RF crosses International borders there's a beeeejillion treaties that sometimes limit what FCC can do.

Frankly there's a lot of controversy over whether or not auctions are the "right" way to handle spectrum too. Smaller players with great ideas are often completely locked out without monster money benefactors (usually by being acquired by someone with lots of money. Beyond lots.)

LightSquared maybe falls into this category in some aspects. If you're wanting to start a satellite based biz, you're already in way over your head just to get them built and on-orbit. The heady tech 90s led to Iridium, the service that failed (can't remember their name at 2:40 AM) due to a faulty component on all of their transponders which eventually led to the well-known SPOT beacons (which use secondary transponders that were supposed to be for call control and management of a system similar to Iridium), XM and Sirius. All of which bankrupted their original business entities.

It's frakkin' expensive to launch birds. The compartmentalization is incredible because the execs know the business will have to go through at least one bankruptcy car wash of the books before it'll ever look like a profit was turned on paper. Iridium's largest customer now is the U.S. Government.

So if your largest customer is the government, how long do you think you get to keep the spectrum? (Probably as long as you've got viable on-orbit assets the government wants to use.)

XM/Sirus have given up on their music without advertisements model and many channels sound like standard FM broadcast complete with commercials, and in the recent channel lineup swaps, they started carrying actual broadcast stations from both coasts.

So the much-advertised spectrum auctions are relative new kids on the block, as far as how Spectrum gets allocated.

FCC has no (or little) jurisdiction over military spectrum too. That's handled by NTIA.

And remember that there can be Primary users as well as Secondary. Secondary users must not interfere with Primary licensees but can also use the spectrum.

Many of the early skips in the bands were due to technological reasons. Triple harmonics or double harmonics as oscillators got better. If you look at the band jumps in multi-band groups, they're almost always third-order multiples.

Many of our modern gadgets cram themselves into a tiny chunk of 2.4 GHz spectrum. That was a "grand experiment" to see if most of the rules were relaxed except for strict super-low power limits, if a low microwave band could be essentially unregulated and uncoordinated. Judging by their popularity, it appears to have worked.

Some of the "whitespace" proposals are fascinating... They propose the use of the un-used channels in the TV broadcast spectrum for low-power services to the same geographic region.

And really really high spectrum is starting to become feasible economically. An acquaintance has the world's distance records for a bunch of stuff well above 100 GHz. Jokingly known as "Dr. Milimeterwave" by friends, Brian does some wild work up there.

I remember him joking once that he skipped a band because it was at one of the resonant harmonics of the O2 molecule. All a transmitter at that frequency would do is heat up the air in front of the antenna, similar to how microwave ovens around 2.4 GHz heat water molecules. I think that was somewhere just above 200 GHz if I remember correctly. Very cool applied Physics.

 

[Palmpilot]

Fascinating stuff. Thanks for the info!

 

[Henning]

I remember him joking once that he skipped a band because it was at one of the resonant harmonics of the O2 molecule. All a transmitter at that frequency would do is heat up the air in front of the antenna, similar to how microwave ovens around 2.4 GHz heat water molecules. I think that was somewhere just above 200 GHz if I remember correctly. Very cool applied Physics.

Soooo... that begs the question, "How efficiently?"

 

[denverpilot]

Not very. Last I heard, the military was playing with it and the power system needed a box on a Humvee.

Quite the crowd-control thing if they ever got it working... point antenna array at ring-leader, incapacitated. Ouch. Nasty. Rest of crowd disperses...

 

[Henning]

Not very. Last I heard, the military was playing with it and the power system needed a box on a Humvee.

Quite the crowd-control thing if they ever got it working... point antenna array at ring-leader, incapacitated. Ouch. Nasty. Rest of crowd disperses...

Ohhh! That's the heat gun weapon? The one that makes you feel like you're boiling?

 

[denverpilot]

Ohhh! That's the heat gun weapon? The one that makes you feel like you're boiling?

So they say... not a whole lot of info out about it. Doesn't sound particularly fun to be targeted by.

 

[ScottM]

FYI:

The House Armed Services Committee, Subcommittee on Strategic Forces will be holding a hearing tomorrow entitled “Sustaining GPS for National Security.” The hearing will take place tomorrow, September 15, 2011, at 11:30 AM in Room 2212 of the Rayburn House Office Building. FCC Chairman Genachowski is scheduled to testify. The full witness list is as follows:

· General William L. Shelton, Commander, U.S. Air Force Space Command
· Ms. Teresa M. Takai , Chief Information Officer, U.S. Department of Defense
· The Honorable Julius Genachowski, Chairman, Federal Communications Commission
· Mr. Karl Nebbia, Associate Administrator, Office of Spectrum Management, National Telecommunications and Information Administration, U.S. Department of Commerce
· Mr. Anthony J. Russo, National Coordination Office, Space-Based Positioning, Navigation and Training, National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration

http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/2011/9/sustaining-gps-for-national-security

And yes, this is about Lightsquared.

 

[poadeleted20]

FYI:

The House Armed Services Committee, Subcommittee on Strategic Forces will be holding a hearing tomorrow entitled “Sustaining GPS for National Security.” The hearing will take place tomorrow, September 15, 2011, at 11:30 AM in Room 2212 of the Rayburn House Office Building. FCC Chairman Genachowski is scheduled to testify. The full witness list is as follows:

· General William L. Shelton, Commander, U.S. Air Force Space Command
· Ms. Teresa M. Takai , Chief Information Officer, U.S. Department of Defense
· The Honorable Julius Genachowski, Chairman, Federal Communications Commission
· Mr. Karl Nebbia, Associate Administrator, Office of Spectrum Management, National Telecommunications and Information Administration, U.S. Department of Commerce
· Mr. Anthony J. Russo, National Coordination Office, Space-Based Positioning, Navigation and Training, National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration

http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/2011/9/sustaining-gps-for-national-security

And yes, this is about Lightsquared.

What I'm not seeing is anyone from the FAA. Where's Randy when we need him?

 

[COFlyBoy]

What I'm not seeing is anyone from the FAA. Where's Randy when we need him?

Gen Shelton is a four star. I'm not sure he really needs much backup.

The General's is going to say that Lightsquared is going to mess up a bunch of stuff, then the commissioner of the FCC is going to try to refute that. I don't think the FCC is going to leave this meeting looking good.

 

[denverpilot]

The General's is going to say that Lightsquared is going to mess up a bunch of stuff, then the commissioner of the FCC is going to try to refute that. I don't think the FCC is going to leave this meeting looking good.

Except that in back rooms, certain Senators will be ****ed that they're not going to get their cut of the FCC spectrum auction/licensing fees paid by Lightsquared. The FCC guy will be refuting it to try to win over those Senators not already able to get at the FCC money when it hits the General Fund.

There's way more going on behind the scenes here than meets the eye. The General is rightly ****ed. The Senators are going to *act* surprised, but privately know they just lost their gravy train scheme they were hoping would work out.

FCC should *not* be in the business of leasing spectrum, period. It creates a huge conflict of interest with their primary mission as a Regulator.

 

[TripleZ]

^^^^ Leasing the spectrum is just another "Tax" on the population. I agree, it conflicts with regulating.

I can't believe this has gone this far. Sure, give the company a chance to fix the problem. But once they say "Nope, that's the best we can do....... its your problem", they need to be shut down.

There's no way they can let this company antiquate millions of GPS devices already out in consumer hands.

 

[Henning]

^^^^ Leasing the spectrum is just another "Tax" on the population. I agree, it conflicts with regulating.

I can't believe this has gone this far. Sure, give the company a chance to fix the problem. But once they say "Nope, that's the best we can do....... its your problem", they need to be shut down.

There's no way they can let this company antiquate millions of GPS devices already out in consumer hands.

????? Do you think if the tax didn't exist that the service would be cheaper?

Who pockets all the proceeds from this? Where does the money end up? Does it end up in the American economy or board room pockets?

 

[bbchien]

What I'm not seeing is anyone from the FAA. Where's Randy when we need him?

See my sigline over on the red board....yours truly (politically active), a pilot.

 

[Gary F]

The four-star Air Force general who oversees U.S. Space Command walked into a highly secured room on Capitol Hill a week ago to give a classified briefing to lawmakers and staff, and dropped a surprise. Pressed by members, Gen. William Shelton said the White House tried to pressure him to change his testimony to make it more favorable to a company tied to a large Democratic donor.

Now the Pentagon has been raising concerns about a new wireless project by a satellite broadband company in Virginia called LightSquared, whose majority owner is an investment fund run by Democratic donor Philip Falcone.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...e-pressure-general-shelton-to-help-donor.html

 

[poadeleted21]

The four-star Air Force general who oversees U.S. Space Command walked into a highly secured room on Capitol Hill a week ago to give a classified briefing to lawmakers and staff, and dropped a surprise. Pressed by members, Gen. William Shelton said the White House tried to pressure him to change his testimony to make it more favorable to a company tied to a large Democratic donor.

Now the Pentagon has been raising concerns about a new wireless project by a satellite broadband company in Virginia called LightSquared, whose majority owner is an investment fund run by Democratic donor Philip Falcone.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...e-pressure-general-shelton-to-help-donor.html

I have this feeling that this is going to get VERY nasty before it's resolved...

 

[poadeleted21]

FYI:

The House Armed Services Committee, Subcommittee on Strategic Forces will be holding a hearing tomorrow entitled “Sustaining GPS for National Security.” The hearing will take place tomorrow, September 15, 2011, at 11:30 AM in Room 2212 of the Rayburn House Office Building. FCC Chairman Genachowski is scheduled to testify. The full witness list is as follows:

· General William L. Shelton, Commander, U.S. Air Force Space Command
· Ms. Teresa M. Takai , Chief Information Officer, U.S. Department of Defense
· The Honorable Julius Genachowski, Chairman, Federal Communications Commission
· Mr. Karl Nebbia, Associate Administrator, Office of Spectrum Management, National Telecommunications and Information Administration, U.S. Department of Commerce
· Mr. Anthony J. Russo, National Coordination Office, Space-Based Positioning, Navigation and Training, National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration

http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/2011/9/sustaining-gps-for-national-security

And yes, this is about Lightsquared.

There is now a video of the meeting on that link over an hour but the first few minutes are interesting...

EDIT. I've been listening to the video in the background, VERY VERY Interesting

 

[Tom-D]

I'm wondering if you get a deed when you buy the white house?

 

[denverpilot]

I hear the FCC Chairman "affronted" the Committee and didn't show up?

 

[poadeleted21]

I hear the FCC Chairman "affronted" the Committee and didn't show up?

He did or didn't... now I'm confused. Some were pretty hot. One went so far as to say someones "wheels were greased" LS offered to "design and manufacture" filters, have a new plan but it still interferes with cell phones and "precision" GPSes. Enjoy the fireworks!

 

[TMetzinger]

It was interesting listening. And it's clear to me now that the root of the problem is the FCC decision to allow LightSquared to use Space-based spectrum on a terrestrial network.

 

[TripleZ]

It was interesting listening. And it's clear to me know that the root of the problem is the FCC decision to allow LightSquared to use Space-based spectrum on a terrestrial network.

Yup.

I can understand the decision by the FCC to allow the first continuation. "Ok, yeah.... you have interference problems, see if you can fix them before throwing away millions of $."

But for LS to turn around and just blame existing tech....... yeah, its time to kill the deal. Some of the comments from the meeting were interesting, and err..... harsh, but on point.

Someones got to loose their job now, this debacle has really gone on too long.

 

[poadeleted21]

Yup.

I can understand the decision by the FCC to allow the first continuation. "Ok, yeah.... you have interference problems, see if you can fix them before throwing away millions of $."

But for LS to turn around and just blame existing tech....... yeah, its time to kill the deal. Some of the comments from the meeting were interesting, and err..... harsh, but on point.

Someones got to loose their job now, this debacle has really gone on too long.

Just shelf it, pull any permits and licenses and come back when you have a better idea. And, next time don't sign any waivers. Either that or they are going to need to line a few more peoples pockets!

 

[denverpilot]

Follow the money. Bought and paid for...

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...s-suggestion-of-influence-peddling-disgusting

 

[ScottM]

Follow the money. Bought and paid for...

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...s-suggestion-of-influence-peddling-disgusting

I followed the money and found this out:

Falcone has contributed $50,500 to Democrats since 2007. He’s also contributed $85,500 to Republicans since 2007.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...c-connections/2011/09/19/gIQAphrCgK_blog.html

So what is that supposed to tell us other than Falcone hedges his bets and has only given the Democrats about 60% of what he has given to Republicans?

 

[Gary]

So what is that supposed to tell us other than Falcone hedges his bets and has only given the Democrats about 60% of what he has given to Republicans?

I dunno... maybe, money talks, bulls**t walks??

Gary

 

[TMetzinger]

That says that Falcone gives away a small amount of money to both parties.

How much did Lightspeed pay to the US for their spectrum in the first place?

I'm not sure this is about bribery as much as it is about the situation making the Government look like idiots.

What the FCC did in giving permission to use satellite spectrum on a high powered terrestrial network reminds me of this:

http://youtu.be/dQ_pKqiB5Rg

 

[EdFred]

I followed the money and found this out:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...c-connections/2011/09/19/gIQAphrCgK_blog.html

So what is that supposed to tell us other than Falcone hedges his bets and has only given the Democrats about 60% of what he has given to Republicans?

Just cause it's in the paper doesn't make it correct. Facts?

 

[Rndmtrvlr]

So what is that supposed to tell us other than Falcone hedges his bets and has only given the Democrats about 60% of what he has given to Republicans?

I'm not really a "basher" of either side, but a couple of points in this article did make my eyebrows twitch. Slightly.

When asked by a ranking member of the Senate Judiciary Committee for the documents outlining the decision process, "The FCC Chairman Julius Genachowski has responded to Grassley, saying his committee doesn’t oversee the FCC and that according to congressional rules, the agency does not respond to such requests."

And when Falcone was asked to provide emails between the company and the FCC, Falcone said, "Well, I wouldn’t go down that path,” he said. “I don’t know if it’s necessary. … See, everybody is missing the point here.”

Sounds a little like misdirection to me. If there really is nothing to hide, why not just show the documents and emails?

 

[denverpilot]

Agreed. And my posting of the article was not pointed at Democrats at all.

BOTH sides and the entire FCC Commissioner's Board are bought and paid for. The percentages don't matter.

I said "follow the money" not "Partisan jerk".

There's a far bigger picture here than the Party BS the media wants to wave around and the public thinks is important. (It's not.)

Donate more than many working folks make in a year, you get to bypass the system... unless you just happen to **** off an even bigger special interest group (Garmin $$$) and the Military.

Was there a single FCC RF engineer who reviewed the original license?! Did (s)he try to stop it?

Are those of us who pay taxes allowed to know?

Three years or more hence, we'll see who's sitting on the Lightsquared Board of Directors, raking in the cash. Or "consulting" on their payroll from their Bermuda beach house.

 

[gprellwitz]

How much did LightSquared pay to the US for their spectrum in the first place?

FTFY. Lightspeed are the good guys. LightSquared is who you meant. But you knew that.

 

[ScottM]

Agreed. And my posting of the article was not pointed at Democrats at all.

BOTH sides and the entire FCC Commissioner's Board are bought and paid for. The percentages don't matter.

That was the point I was making after I followed your request to follow the DNC money. My point was that the media is forgetting this and pointing to the pittance that this guy has given to both parties as some sort of evil omen. When in fact it is pretty much business ass usual.

There's a far bigger picture here than the Party BS the media wants to wave around and the public thinks is important. (It's not.)

Exactly.

Was there a single FCC RF engineer who reviewed the original license?!

Yes

Did (s)he try to stop it?

Are those of us who pay taxes allowed to know?

It is inside baseball and I would be prudent to just say, the information is out there for you. You seem to know your way around the FCC, so you should know where to look. I really am too close to this to say much in a public forum.

 

[ScottM]

FYI and FWIW

http://www.mwjournal.com/News/article.asp?HH_ID=AR_11409

Tahoe RF Announces Industry's First GPS RFIC that Substantially Mitigates Interference from LightSquared L-Band LTE Signals
Tahoe RF Semiconductor Inc. announces the industry’s first integrated dual channel (L1 & L2) GPS RFIC that substantially mitigates interference from LightSquared and 4G L-Band LTE signals and other high level jamming environments.

Tahoe RF’s TRFS15011 integrates two independent receive paths with 12 bit analog-to-digital converters, providing complete conversion of GPS signals from RF to digital data. The IC also has integrated Fractional-N RF Synthesizers with a high performance VCO. The receive paths can be configured for high linearity operation by setting the ADC resolution to 12 bits, or for low power operation by setting the ADC resolution to 3 bits. The RFIC configuration is digitally controlled through a bi-directional SPI.

The TRFS15011 is the most flexible and robust GPS receiver on the market. The integrated circuit has the ability to process L1 and L2 received signal data in the presence of a >60 dBc jammer and easily integrates into a complete system platform solution.

“GPS frequency bands are under attack, and it is necessary for our industry to recognize that this threat is real, and prepare accordingly. The new normal is for GPS systems to operate in presence of high power interferers. Tahoe RF has developed the industry’s first GPS RFIC receiver that addresses this critical issue. Tahoe RF is seeking to work with a few selected companies to develop custom IC solutions that protect their investments and develop significant competitive advantages.” said Irshad Rasheed, CEO/President of Tahoe RF.

Microwave Journal will be featuring this product in the November supplement on Mobile Communications.

 

[TMetzinger]

“GPS frequency bands are under attack, and it is necessary for our industry to recognize that this threat is real, and prepare accordingly. The new normal is for GPS systems to operate in presence of high power interferers. Tahoe RF has developed the industry’s first GPS RFIC receiver that addresses this critical issue. Tahoe RF is seeking to work with a few selected companies to develop custom IC solutions that protect their investments and develop significant competitive advantages.” said Irshad Rasheed, CEO/President of Tahoe RF.

Microwave Journal will be featuring this product in the November supplement on Mobile Communications.

YARRRRRRR! Them Lightsquared pirates be scurvy dogs.....

But don't fret, me hearties! We know that the gov't will pay tribute to the pirates, but we've got a solution! First, people can pay the Gov't to prevent the problem in the first place... Then, when the rascals take the booty and don't do the job, the people can pay US for something that works anyway...

Yoho Yoho, a pirate's life for me.


Seriously, good for the company for the product. Shame on the society that makes it necessary.