Let’s see how ignorant people are about basic science (formerly masks at FBOs)

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PlasticCigar

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Angel Flight sent out an email today stating that many FBO staff hadn’t been wearing masks and had to be politely educated about it. Since, by definition, the Angel Flight passengers are all high risk this seems very reasonable. I’ve only been to a handful of FBOs in the last few months so I don’t have a lot of experience with it but I have definitely avoided returning to an FBO where they didn’t wear masks.

Anyone else have similar experiences?

On an unrelated note, this just became my favorite thrift store:
 

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Key West had every employee masked when I was down there last week. Haven't been into the local one but I give it 50/50 with the way it's viewed around here.
 
PlasticCigar said:
I’ve only been to a handful of FBOs in the last few months so I don’t have a lot of experience with it but I have definitely avoided returning to an FBO where they didn’t wear masks.

Anyone else have similar experiences?
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I’ve been to several across 8 or 9 different states. It’s ranged from mask and zero contact to no mask and shaking hands (neither bother me, not high risk or in contact with any that are).

If you plan on going through one on an angel flight, have you called ahead and asked them their policy/to mask up for that time period?
 
Radar Contact said:
I’ve been to several across 8 or 9 different states. It’s ranged from mask and zero contact to no mask and shaking hands (neither bother me, not high risk or in contact with any that are).

If you plan on going through one on an angel flight, have you called ahead and asked them their policy/to mask up for that time period?
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Good question! I’m a healthcare provider that regularly sees COVID-19 patients so I actually haven’t been doing any Angel Flights carrying passengers because I think the risk is too high. When I fly for work, I do call the FBOs beforehand although what the manager tells me and what the line people are doing don’t always match.

One of the nurses I work with exposed several people during her asymptomatic phase with COVID and I can’t justify putting someone at risk just to have them experience my superior piloting abilities (as opposed to someone else flying them).

My question was more regarding the email sent out by Angel Flight West today which makes me think other people are running into this situation.

I’m not going to lecture anyone, but just remember that “low risk” isn’t the same as “no risk.” Plenty of “formerly healthy” 30 year-olds are on vents with COVID. I think a good analogy is the FAA’s risk assessment matrix which points out that it’s not just the risk that matters but also the consequences. Your 310 with the beautiful new paint job is at “low risk” of losing the engine right as you rotate, but I’ll bet it’s on your mind on every takeoff because the consequences can be catastrophic.
 

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PlasticCigar said:
I’m not going to lecture anyone, but just remember that “low risk” isn’t the same as “no risk.” Plenty of “formerly healthy” 30 year-olds are on vents with COVID. I think a good analogy is the FAA’s risk assessment matrix which points out that it’s not just the risk that matters but also the consequences. Your 310 with the beautiful new paint job is at “low risk” of losing the engine right as you rotate, but I’ll bet it’s on your mind on every takeoff because the consequences can be catastrophic.
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Eloquently written. It is on my mind and mentally rehearsed prior to each takeoff.

I missed the email and thought you were getting a sense of what FBOs were doing around the country. Hope you and your co-workers stay safe and thanks for giving back with Angel Flight!
 
feel free to take your business where you choose. I would also expect that if you told them you had at-risk people coming through, they’d happily wear masks for that time.

But it sounds to me like you’re expecting everyone to apply your personal risk tolerance to their lives.
 
MauleSkinner said:
feel free to take your business where you choose. I would also expect that if you told them you had at-risk people coming through, they’d happily wear masks for that time.

But it sounds to me like you’re expecting everyone to apply your personal risk tolerance to their lives.
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In some states (such as mine) all workers must wear masks. It's not working, unless having a chin-warmer counts.
 
Kenny Phillips said:
In some states (such as mine) all workers must wear masks. It's not working, unless having a chin-warmer counts.
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We have to start at midnight tonight.

My Mom basically has to stay home because of it...she puts a mask on and her BP skyrockets and oxygen saturation plummets.
 
MauleSkinner said:
feel free to take your business where you choose. I would also expect that if you told them you had at-risk people coming through, they’d happily wear masks for that time.

But it sounds to me like you’re expecting everyone to apply your personal risk tolerance to their lives.
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Actually, it’s not about me and my risk tolerance. Wearing masks when indoors around other people is mandatory in both California and Arizona and other than staying at home is the single most effective intervention we have to reduce the spread of the virus. Period. At this point it is a well established fact and not open for debate and not the point of my question. The question was regarding other people’s experiences and how to best mitigate the risk of bringing people to a place which may or may not be safe for them due to noncompliance with local health regulators.

As I mentioned before, I have “taken my business elsewhere” because of this unsafe behavior but, as I also mentioned before, calling ahead of time doesn’t necessarily guarantee what will happen when you get there.

Thank you for your thoughtful and helpful input.
 
MauleSkinner said:
We have to start at midnight tonight.

My Mom basically has to stay home because of it...she puts a mask on and her BP skyrockets and oxygen saturation plummets.
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Please record a video of this and submit it as a case report to the New England Journal of Medicine because this is a truly unique experience. I have put masks on HUNDREDS of people and monitored the oxygen saturation of ALL of them and have not seen ONE drop more than 2% (which is a normal variability you would see regardless of the mask). Please don’t use this as a forum to spread false information.
 
PlasticCigar said:
Please record a video of this and submit it as a case report to the New England Journal of Medicine because this is a truly unique experience. I have put masks on HUNDREDS of people and monitored the oxygen saturation of ALL of them and have not seen ONE drop more than 2% (which is a normal variability you would see regardless of the mask). Please don’t use this as a forum to spread false information.
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Please don’t use this as a forum to claim that there are no differences between individuals. If you want it submitted, contact her doctor, as he’s the one who saw it.
 
MauleSkinner said:
Please don’t use this as a forum to claim that there are no differences between individuals. If you want it submitted, contact her doctor, as he’s the one who saw it.
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I think you know that there is no reasonable way for me to do that and I’m not going to go back and forth with you about what your family member’s doctor may or may not have seen.

I have seen plenty of people claim a unique physiology but have seen few examples in real life and decades of caring for patients. I’ve certainly met plenty of people who say they don’t like the masks and they “can’t breathe” with them but usually when I point out that their heart rate is 62, respiratory rate is 14, and oxygen saturation is 100% with a perfect waveform they admit that they don’t like it but they’re actually breathing just fine. I’ve had two people since this started absolutely refuse to wear a mask after I explain to them the reasons for doing so. One was drunk and the other was psychotic.

Someone who’s “oxygen saturation plummets” with a paper thin surgical mask really is a “medical miracle” and should be written up as a case report in all seriousness. Yes there is individual variability, but most of us (objectively) really aren’t as special as we (subjectively) think we are.
 
PlasticCigar said:
Someone who’s “oxygen saturation plummets” with a paper thin surgical mask really is a “medical miracle” and should be written up as a case report in all seriousness. Yes there is individual variability, but most of us (objectively) really aren’t as special as we (subjectively) think we are.
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Well, there you go...assuming facts not in evidence.
 
Million Air ADS is requiring mask but so is the county of Dallas that they are in, Million Air will provide you with one. Our governor just required mask for almost every county in Texas. I have a trip to Oregon this weekend and that state is requiring mask. I am for wearing mask.
 
Instead of pushing your beliefs on other people, why don’t you stay home and let the rest of us get on with our lives? I’ve been to a few FBO’s lately and some employees wear them, some don’t. I don’t come walking in the door in full Karen mode and demand people put them on. It should be up to the individual what their risk tolerance is.
 
MauleSkinner said:
I agree...masks are worthless.
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I am not sure why the hostility. Common sense, and overall present opinion is that Masks should be warn in public. If that is not something you agree with and or want to abide by it's best to stay away from people.
I also agree that the people that do not want / cannot tolerate masks is more of attitude than reality.
I do hope that some people's attitude changes and they listen to people that are educated and know better, before we get to the point of no return.
Maintain Physical distance Wear a mask and stop getting other people sick is the best attitude.
 
Masks reduce the chance of spreading illness to others, rather than reducing the chance by much of the wearer catching it. It's obvious by the responses on this thread to see who cares about others, and who is all about "me me me".

The "medical miracle" who is falsely claiming that they medically can't wear a mask clearly shouldn't be out in public during a pandemic of a major respiratory virus anyway if their respiratory system is such a wreck.

I have no patience for the selfish, hysterical idiots rejecting masks. They share a major part of the blame for the total and abject failure of the US to manage this, and the ongoing restrictions that the rest of the population have to put up with. Other more mature nations have this almost behind them, because they have a much smaller segment of the population with such a kindergarten mentality.
 
You know who else is at risk of "catching" covid? Anyone who dies or goes near a hospital. I know of at least 5 cases around here where they just marked down covid, even though they didnt have it or even test for it. Cut on your hand...yep, you got covid ( never tested). Died of natural causes, yep, you got covid (autopsy showed negative) fell and broke an arm, yup covid.

Wearing these cloth or cheap masks everyone in public is wearing for this virus is like trying to keep mosquitos out of your house by putting up chain link fencing for screen doors. Im pretty sure this whole mask thing is just a test run to see how compliant citizens will be.
 
Katamarino said:
Masks reduce the chance of spreading illness to others, rather than reducing the chance by much of the wearer catching it. It's obvious by the responses on this thread to see who cares about others, and who is all about "me me me".

The "medical miracle" who is falsely claiming that they medically can't wear a mask clearly shouldn't be out in public during a pandemic of a major respiratory virus anyway if their respiratory system is such a wreck.

I have no patience for the selfish, hysterical idiots rejecting masks. They share a major part of the blame for the total and abject failure of the US to manage this, and the ongoing restrictions that the rest of the population have to put up with. Other more mature nations have this almost behind them, because they have a much smaller segment of the population with such a kindergarten mentality.
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So, I guess then that you are done with the US?
 
Katamarino said:
I have no patience for the selfish, hysterical idiots rejecting masks. They share a major part of the blame for the total and abject failure of the US to manage this, and the ongoing restrictions that the rest of the population have to put up with. Other more mature nations have this almost behind them, because they have a much smaller segment of the population with such a kindergarten mentality.
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I think you meant to say China, not the US.
 
I know I shouldn't, but...

If an anti body test will show up positive if a person has had a common cold (same family of viruses, people), should we all be wearing masks for that? There's a yearly, sometimes continuous worldwide pandemic of that. People get pneumonia and die from that. Also, most people recover from that. Same as COVID. Same as flu. Same as chicken pox. Same as lots and lots of other sickness. Is COVID serious and do people die from it? Yep! Should we all freak out and restrict people and judge their intelligence based on it? Somehow, it doesn't help anything to call people selfish or immature when in an argument. Maybe it is true, but it is also just an emotional response that doesn't advance anyone's cause.

To be fair to the kindergarteners, though, the "Me" attitude is actually more descriptive of high schoolers. :D

Also, Happy 4th of July a couple days early! I, for one, am proud of my country, even though she's made plenty of mistakes in the past and will make more in the future. No place is perfect, but I am not expecting that down here, and if you're expecting it, you'll be sorely disappointed no matter where you look!
 
bluesideup said:
I am not sure why the hostility. Common sense, and overall present opinion is that Masks should be warn in public. If that is not something you agree with and or want to abide by it's best to stay away from people.
I also agree that the people that do not want / cannot tolerate masks is more of attitude than reality.
I do hope that some people's attitude changes and they listen to people that are educated and know better, before we get to the point of no return.
Maintain Physical distance Wear a mask and stop getting other people sick is the best attitude.
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The hostility is because the OP chooses to basically call me a liar because of his/her assumptions about what I posted rather than the facts I presented.

Unlike the OP, I am considerate of those who do not agree with me. I do not demand that people will not wear masks, and I keep extra distance from people who are wearing them.
 
Groundpounder said:
I think you meant to say China, not the US.
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No, it's the USA with the problem now. China has, for the most part, gotten it behind them.
And the USA had plenty of warning. We knew back in January. I knew back in January, when my friends and colleagues told me about infections in early January. I knew it was bad when they cancelled their Spring Festival- that's the same as cancelling Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years for us.

If I knew something bad was going on there, I know the CIA, NSA, and whoever else also knew it was bad. I've attached some screen shots since some people have said I was less than truthful about seeing indications the virus was bad there. I've heard it from more than one person.

Quite frankly, National Command Authority dropped the ball badly.

IScreenshot_20200504-182245_WeChat.jpg Screenshot_20200517-180958_WeChat.jpg
 
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