Just Started Training, Already Concerned

PaulS said:
You have been in the service so you are not a kid but the principle still applies. This doesn't mean be disrespectful but it does mean you demand what what you need from these people and don't let them intimidate you. The first thing you need to get is the syllabus. Foggles and flying by instruments is stupid after .7 hours, knowing the syllabus will allow you to challenge that by saying something like Foggles? Why would we do that before stalls, slow flight, turns, steep turns climbs descents or whatever. I suspect the program is over enrolled and they are trying to get people into other things. That's not your problem. Work hard, do the book work, very important, chair fly, and make the instructor follow the syllabus. Try not to be nervous, it makes it more difficult, the instructor is there to keep you safe, remember that. And be sure, in a respectable way to let the instructor know that you expect him to work as hard as you to get you through, you are not quitting.
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This. Especially the bolded part.
 
Good luck to you and I really hope it gets better for you.[/QUOTE]
Bill Jennings said:
Its been a long time, but foggles, instruments, and pattern work on the 2nd flight is way way too much to ask. I think @frfly172 is correct, they must have gotten you confused with someone who needed a phase check flight.
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I would agree that there was a mix up, but for the fact that in our post flight it was mentioned several times that it was only my second flight. The instructor also filled out my logbook for me, so he saw what was logged. No mention of “oh ****, I threw way too much at you today.”
 
AggieMike88 said:
@Jesse Jetty --- city/state are you? Maybe someone can provide leads to a better school.

Would you be able/willing to travel to get this done?
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I’m in Des Moines, IA. Only 3 part 141 schools in the state that accept G.I. Bill. I’m already traveling 85 miles one way for this school. The other 2 are 135 and 178 miles away respectively. If things don’t improve, I’m willing to change schools, but it’s a last option just due to the extra cost of travel.
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabby_Gabreski
During his first year at Notre Dame, Gabreski developed an interest in flying. He took lessons in a Taylor Cub and accumulated six hours of flight time. However, his autobiography indicates, he struggled to fly smoothly and did not fly solo, having been advised by his instructor Homer Stockert that he did not "have the touch to be a pilot"
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This thread is hogwash.

Since when does the GI bill cover primary training?

And then throw in all the interesting first 2 flight mumbo jumbos.
 
It all comes down to your instructor, and a good instructor is the one biggest factor in your training.

If you don’t have a good and dependable CFI, or the school swaps them out all the time, well I hope you’re getting s really good deal on tuition
 
Ravioli said:
This thread is hogwash.

Since when does the GI bill cover primary training?

And then throw in all the interesting first 2 flight mumbo jumbos.
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I can assure you, it is not “hogwash”.

They will cover the primary training if it is part of a larger course that leads to the commercial license. It has to be at a part 141 school though. You should check the VA website, they actually provide a list of all the accepted schools.

You’ll just have to take my word as far as how the flights went. I’d be happy to shoot you a picture of my logbook to verify at least that aspect.
 
We reading the same website?

https://www.benefits.va.gov/gibill/flight_training.asp

Flight Training
VA offers flight training benefits to those who want to advance their pilot qualifications. You must have a private pilots license and valid medical certification before you start training. Payments are issued after the training is completed and the school submits your enrollment information to VA.
 
That threw me off to when I was first looking into this. I can assure you however that they are in fact paying for it. My wife actually found out that they’d cover the whole thing. I’ll post the page from my school’s admissions site that talks about it here in a moment.

If it was something I just made up, do you really think no one else, out of all the people who have commented here, would have caught it and said something?

I tried to be polite the first time, but if you’re going to comment from a place of ignorance, then you can take your commentary elsewhere.
 
Jesse Jetty said:
That threw me off to when I was first looking into this. I can assure you however that they are in fact paying for it. My wife actually found out that they’d cover the whole thing. I’ll post the page from my school’s admissions site that talks about it here in a moment.

If it was something I just made up, do you really think no one else, out of all the people who have commented here, would have caught it and said something?

I tried to be polite the first time, but if you’re going to comment from a place of ignorance, then you can take your commentary elsewhere.
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Some of us are pretty gullible, and some of us are pretty grumpy.
 
Jesse Jetty said:
No. It’s Carver Aviation in Davenport and Aero America in Council Bluffs.
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The University of Dubuque program is 141 as well, but it is a college program unlike the other two you've mentioned.

Too bad you have to stay under part 141. There are a number of decent instructors around the state. What school are you working with?
 
mondtster said:
The University of Dubuque program is 141 as well, but it is a college program unlike the other two you've mentioned.

Too bad you have to stay under part 141. There are a number of decent instructors around the state. What school are you working with?
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Indian Hills Community College in Ottumwa.
 
Jesse Jetty said:
Indian Hills Community College in Ottumwa.
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That was the one place I wasn't thinking about. I don't really know anything about their pilot program but I know a few guys who went through their aviation maintenance program.
 
You have received very sound advice, especially from Bob about insisting on handing you the 141 syllabus. Let me lay out a plan for you.
1. Stay on schedule. Do your book work and take the tests. Do your flight sim time (if any). Do not give them a reason on the books to simply let you go.
2. Get in two more training flights to see how it goes.
If you are still unhappy at that point then go to the College Dean (make an appointment) and discuss your issues with the training. (They supply the students and their money to the flight school)
If after that you still have issues inform the college and the flight school in writing, stating that you will file a formal complaint with the Fed Gov Veterans Affairs (whatever department is in charge of your program) and with the Attorney General of the USA if the issues are not satisfactorily handled within 7 business days.
Give time for that to be replied to.
If still having issues then it is time to go to the Federal Government (they are supplying ALL the money) and file a formal complaint. Send a copy of the formal complaint to the College and to the Flight School.
 
Jesse Jetty said:
That threw me off to when I was first looking into this. I can assure you however that they are in fact paying for it. My wife actually found out that they’d cover the whole thing. I’ll post the page from my school’s admissions site that talks about it here in a moment.

If it was something I just made up, do you really think no one else, out of all the people who have commented here, would have caught it and said something?

I tried to be polite the first time, but if you’re going to comment from a place of ignorance, then you can take your commentary elsewhere.
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I had to fund my PPC first, then I could use the GI Bill for the rest. This was under the Vietnam area GI Bill. You may be under a different program that includes your PPC perhaps.
 
mscard88 said:
I had to fund my PPC first, then I could use the GI Bill for the rest. This was under the Vietnam area GI Bill. You may be under a different program that includes your PPC perhaps.
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Yes, I’m under the post 9/11 GI Bill that they passed back in 06.
 
PaulS said:
You Vietnam vets got crap. Thanks for your service.
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It got me all my Certificates and Ratings, and a portion of the BS degree. I have no complaints. I wasn’t a VN Vet however, just to be clear. I was in the service during the VN era, which entitled anyone to the GI Bill.
 
mscard88 said:
It got me all my Certificates and Ratings, and a portion of the BS degree. I have no complaints. I wasn’t a VN Vet however, just to be clear. I was in the service during the VN era, which entitled anyone to the GI Bill.
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I know a couple guys who were over there, they don't complain and don't talk much about it. But I remember walking through the Boston Common, must have been in the late 60's early 70s and thinking it was not the way to treat or talk about soldiers at war. I was just a kid then.
 
PaulS said:
I know a couple guys who were over there, they don't complain and don't talk much about it. But I remember walking through the Boston Common, must have been in the late 60's early 70s and thinking it was not the way to treat or talk about soldiers at war. I was just a kid then.
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Yeah, back then most of us didn’t wear the uniform off base. Wasn’t worth the heartache. Different parts of the country treated military differently, if you catch my drift. Heck my Dad is a WW2 Marine and Korean War Air Force vet and he didn’t like wearing his uniform off base!
 
mscard88 said:
Yeah, back then most of us didn’t wear the uniform off base.
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Even in 1980 it was suggested to us to not wear uniforms off the base.

Then in 1983, more specifically October '83, that all changed. I missed the parades because I was in the hospital, but when I was released I wanted civilian clothing. The nerd captain wearing the giant BCDs on his face told me things are different now. The public will like you because you are in uniform.

And he was right. Really screwed me up for a while.
 
I'm a new student. My CFI hasn't pushed me at all. We started with straight and level. Then added some turns. Then climbing and descending. Then climbing and descending turns. Etc. I'm following the Gleim 141 syllabus.
It took me at least 5-6 hours to start understanding what's going on. I'm still over whelmed it's just manageable now. I'm around 12 hours in. Worked on emergency scenarios, steep turns. I'm still having trouble with the radio. I almost went onto the grass taxiing on Friday. I'm having trouble with the pedals. Which I find weird because I run a skid steer no problem. I finally got the stalls down. Felt like forever but that's because I expect everything to come to me quickly. Lol... Landings are interesting. This week and next week I'm going to get at least 1.
I have been flying twice a week for a little more than an hour each time.
That's awesome that the GI bill is paying. I can only suggest you talk to your instructor. Unless you are terrified and frozen up there I don't see how he can say this isn't for you. He doesn't sound very nice or professional.
Good luck with everything. Keep posting.
 
Laxdad12 said:
I'm a new student. My CFI hasn't pushed me at all. We started with straight and level. Then added some turns. Then climbing and descending. Then climbing and descending turns. Etc. I'm following the Gleim 141 syllabus.
It took me at least 5-6 hours to start understanding what's going on. I'm still over whelmed it's just manageable now. I'm around 12 hours in. Worked on emergency scenarios, steep turns. I'm still having trouble with the radio. I almost went onto the grass taxiing on Friday. I'm having trouble with the pedals. Which I find weird because I run a skid steer no problem. I finally got the stalls down. Felt like forever but that's because I expect everything to come to me quickly. Lol... Landings are interesting. This week and next week I'm going to get at least 1.
I have been flying twice a week for a little more than an hour each time.
That's awesome that the GI bill is paying. I can only suggest you talk to your instructor. Unless you are terrified and frozen up there I don't see how he can say this isn't for you. He doesn't sound very nice or professional.
Good luck with everything. Keep posting.
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I fly out of a Class D and radios were overwhelming from day 1. I started listening to liveatc.com and when I drove I would talk my way through it. Vons Tower, Volt at parking to Grand Ave North with Juliet. Grand Ave, Volt holding short North Exit for a right traffic.

You sound like an idiot but it really helped me on my radios.

And do not be afraid to ask tower/atc to repeat or correct them. We have Runway 26L and 26R. I was doing pattern work an touch and goes off 26L and I was cleared by the tower to land with the option 26R. I simply asked tower to confirm 26R for the option and they said no 26L. My instructor was impressed, he was already reaching for the button but I was on it.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
I fly out of a Class D and radios were overwhelming from day 1. I started listening to liveatc.com and when I drove I would talk my way through it. Vons Tower, Volt at parking to Grand Ave North with Juliet. Grand Ave, Volt holding short North Exit for a right traffic.
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Interesting approach. I learned at Class C. So, what helped me the most is to remember to say 0. Who you're calling (Albuquerque Ground / Albuquerque Approach), 1. Who you are (Cherokee N7342J), 2. Where you are (On the Cutter ramp / 20 miles south of the field), 3. What you want (taxi for takeoff / landing at International). This 4-step process works great. Sometimes you need to throw in things, like "with information Delta" or "at 1 0 thousand 5 hundred", but generally it's these 4.
 
zaitcev said:
Interesting approach. I learned at Class C. So, what helped me the most is to remember to say 0. Who you're calling (Albuquerque Ground / Albuquerque Approach), 1. Who you are (Cherokee N7342J), 2. Where you are (On the Cutter ramp / 20 miles south of the field), 3. What you want (taxi for takeoff / landing at International). This 4-step process works great. Sometimes you need to throw in things, like "with information Delta" or "at 1 0 thousand 5 hundred", but generally it's these 4.
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youre a software engineer, amiright?
 
if u are not comfortable with your instructor, get another, nothing worse than bad cockpit vibes when a student learning,

once you're going out alone, if over your head at any time, or even to set up a heads up on the same page deal with atc, or wherever appropriate,

do not hesitate announcing 'student pilot'

i got inbound instructions one time & had no clue what atc was talking about, then one had a chat with me after landing, as soon as i got out & clued me in to not hesitate with the gamechanger magic words

they can easily end up giving u sudden instructions, even in the pattern, that could be over your head

like ur on base for final, then u get instructions to extend & pull a 270 for final
 
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I go back up tomorrow morning. I’m scheduled with the first (good) instructor. We’ll see how it goes. I’m going to talk to him about my experience last week.
 
Jesse Jetty said:
I go back up tomorrow morning. I’m scheduled with the first (good) instructor. We’ll see how it goes. I’m going to talk to him about my experience last week.
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Curious as to what he has to say about what you tell him.
 
Jesse Jetty said:
No choice on instructor. We get whoever is working that day. I’m not sure what they syllabus said, he didn’t let me read it. I do know he seemed irritated because he’d wanted to work on slow flight and put what he called foggles on me but we didn’t get to it because of my issues.
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You should find a different school
 
another dude with trainee, status quo issues
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_Hartmann
Hartmann's time as a trainee pilot did not always go smoothly. On 31 March 1942, during a gunnery training flight, he ignored regulations and performed some aerobatics in his Bf 109 over the Zerbst airfield. His punishment was a week of confinement to quarters with the loss of ⅔ of his pay in fines.

<snip>

obsessed by the idea of scoring his first success, opened full throttle and became separated from Roßmann. He engaged an enemy fighter, but failed to score any hits and nearly collided with it instead. He then ran for cover in low cloud, and his mission subsequently ended with a crash landing after his aircraft ran out of fuel. Hartmann had violated almost every rule of air-to-air combat,

<snip>

Adolf Hitler's military headquarters near Rastenburg, to receive the coveted award from Hitler personally. On arrival, he was asked to surrender his side arm — a security measure caused by the aftermath of the failed assassination attempt on 20 July 1944. Hartmann refused and threatened to decline the Diamonds if he were not trusted to carry his pistol. After consulting Oberst Nicolaus von Below, Hitler's Luftwaffe adjutant, Hartmann was allowed to keep his side arm and accepted the Diamonds.[

<snip>

At the end of the war, Erich Hartmann disobeyed General Hans Seidemann's order to Hartmann and Hermann Graf to fly to the British sector to avoid capture by Soviet forces. Hartmann later explained:

I must say that during the war I never disobeyed an order, but when General Seidemann ordered Graf and me to fly to the British sector and surrender to avoid the Soviets, with the rest of the wing to surrender to the Soviets, I could not leave my men. That would have been bad leadership.[47]

<snip>

Hartmann's outspoken criticism proved unpopular with his superiors. General Werner Panitzki, successor to General Josef Kammhuber as the Inspector of the Air Force, said, "Erich is a good pilot, but not a good officer."
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plus more...
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/t...tory-nazi-germanys-greatest-fighter-ace-23125
 
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Jesse Jetty said:
I go back up tomorrow morning. I’m scheduled with the first (good) instructor. We’ll see how it goes. I’m going to talk to him about my experience last week.
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Good luck tomorrow . I got liveatc.com, I also feel like an idiot on my way to work talking to an imaginary
Atc. Lol..
 
Tarheelpilot said:
You should find a different school
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This is not easy under Part 141. Many hoops to jump through before the time logged at school #1 transfers to the #2 school program.

Bob
 
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