Instructor leaving :(

CC268

CC268

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CC268
Well found out yesterday that my instructor will be gone in two weeks - he almost has his 1500 hours. I knew he would be gone in the next few months, but didn't think it would be this soon!

Anyone else have to switch instructors at some point? I guess the good thing is I am at about 18-20 hours so glad it is happening now and not at the end of my training.
 
I'm on the other side of the fence! I'm leaving in less than a month. One of my student has his checkride in a few weeks and it will most likely be my last sign off. Most of my students are pre solo. One is semi check ride prep and the other just has finish his solo cross countries then we'll be doing check ride prep. The guy I did my private with is a career CFI with about 10K hours and has a passion for teaching. For the rest of my ratings with the exception of my Commercial Multi, I stuck with a 23 year old kid fresh out of Embry Riddle who I was certain was going to leave for the airlines. He's now the Chief CFI of the flight school and gave me a job after I got my CFI with him.
 
CC268 said:
Anyone else have to switch instructors at some point? I guess the good thing is I am at about 18-20 hours so glad it is happening now and not at the end of my training.
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I had my primary instructor leave approximately at that point. As a result I ended up finishing my PPL with a grand total of 10 instructors. I basically flew with whoever was available. This situation had its downsides and upsides, but I still got my PPL at 45 hours (+1:30 checkride) sharp, the minimum time required in EASA-land.
 
Two instructors for me...the transition wasn't terrible, I made sure my new instructor knew exactly where I was training-wise before we ever went up together. After a bit of air work so he knew what I knew we were set.
 
This is why I always say find a freelance CFI/ATP, getting instruction with a hour builder can easily cost you $1k when they bail on you.

I've never left a student incomplete, it shows a lack of honor and really disgusts me, a CFI should take great pride in his students, the idea of screwing one over like this is beyond me, finish up your current students then move on, trust me any worthy airline/charter will understand and appreciate it.
 
This is normal OP's in aviaition. Hopefully you can connect with another good instructor quickly before your mad skills erode.
 
I went through 3 instructors before the school owner decide to finish me up through check ride. The other instructors kept leaving for better jobs. It's sucked
 
I went through 3 instructors during my private. I got about 8 hours with the first, then the only rental in town was sold to the 2nd instructor that wouldn't let anyone else instruct in it. Got about 20-30 more hours with the second before I got fed up with him and waited to college to finish with the 3rd instructor. I started my instrument in college and went through 3 instructors before hanging it up. Finally finished it last year, almost 15 years late.
 
I had two instructors before I got commitment from one of the owners to finish me up. He started my IFR but is passing me on to a CFII to help fill in some gaps in schedule. Not as much of a big deal as I will likely go the accelerated rite anyway. Just for signed off to take written and then will continue to build my 50 hours then off to school
 
James331 said:
This is why I always say find a freelance CFI/ATP, getting instruction with a hour builder can easily cost you $1k when they bail on you.

I've never left a student incomplete, it shows a lack of honor and really disgusts me, a CFI should take great pride in his students, the idea of screwing one over like this is beyond me, finish up your current students then move on, trust me any worthy airline/charter will understand and appreciate it.
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Most charter companies and airlines will not understand.

When I quit my instructor job I had several students that were hobbyists and only flew once every week or so. If you think I should have put my career on hold to finish all my students then I think you are delusional.
 
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I've always asked the cfi's how many hours they had knowing they'd be gone at 1500. Went through 2 instructors for my PPL, but the second instructor was really just giving some checkride prep.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Most charter companies and airlines will not understand.

We I quit my instructor job I had several students that were hobbyists and only flew once every week or so. If you think I should have put my career on hold to finish all my students then I think you are delusional.
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You must be talking the bottom feeders.

End of the day my honor isn't bought. My CPL and PPL students were held in higher regards then some regional who will take any ATP who can fog a mirror and has a pulse.

Be part of the solution, or be part of the problem.

Even now, years after their CPL I take it personally when one of my CPL students is screwed over by a operator, maybe I care too much but I held my guys to a very high standard and I take their progress as new CPLs personally.
 
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James331 said:
You must be talking the ones whom pay under 30k a year.

End of the day my honor isn't bought. My CPL and PPL students were held in higher regards then some regional who will take any ATP who can fog a mirror and has a pulse.

Be part of the solution, or be part of the problem.
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I left instruction to fly for a supplemental 121 carrier with a starting base pay in excess of 50k plus mileage and perdiem. Not some crap hole.

I gave the school a one month notice which is appropriate for a professional position. Students that could finish within the month I finished. Those that could not were immediately transitioned to new instructors and I paralleled my schedule with their lessons to be available for brief and debrief sessions. Each student was placed with their new instructor based on their input not just dumped on the new guy with the lowest student load. I find your broad statement questioning the professional and ethical standards of any instructor that leaves a student to be offensive, narrow minded and baseless.
 
You should find it offensive, my comments were directed at folks like you.

You clear your students before you go, they are your charge, you show them the way, you don't desert them.
 
James331 said:
You should find it offensive, my comments were directed at folks like you.

You clear your students before you go, they are your charge, you show them the way, you don't desert them.
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What about a student who flies once a month?
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I left instruction to fly for a supplemental 121 carrier with a starting base pay in excess of 50k plus mileage and perdiem. Not some crap hole.
. I find your broad statement questioning the professional and ethical standards of any instructor that leaves a student to be offensive, narrow minded and baseless.
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Sounds like you go above and beyond. My instructor left after an encounter with military traffic, but stuck around for me to solo. I understood and respected his reasons. My hobby shouldn't come before another's career. Transition was a non event and didn't extend my training.
 
A once a month is a scenic flight as far as I'm concerned.

It's the dedicated students, you don't leave one of them.


Life is a business, and you're judged on how you run it.
 
James you're a little out of line here. If someone's goal is the 121 world so what. That's that persons goal, dream, whatever. Unfortunately they have to get the hours to 1500 to even get the "fog the mirror" interview. Flight instructing is one of the few ways to acquire the hours. You know as well as I do that being a CFI and trying to make a decent living and/or career doing that is near impossible. I understand some have, and some supplement CFI'g w/ another job, a wife who works, etc. In a perfect world a student would have one CFI but realty is a student these days, especially w/ airline hiring increasing, is going to have more than one CFI.

Place where I rarely instruct is fat on CFIs right now. I saw where the owner is assigning a Comm/Instr student to two CFIs. Now that's crazy, and I wouldn't accept that. But it's his business.
 
I had two also. My first left when I was at about 15 hours. The second finished me training up and is now doing my IFR. Liked both of mine, but think my second was a better match for me.
 
James331 said:
This is why I always say find a freelance CFI/ATP, getting instruction with a hour builder can easily cost you $1k when they bail on you.

I've never left a student incomplete, it shows a lack of honor and really disgusts me, a CFI should take great pride in his students, the idea of screwing one over like this is beyond me, finish up your current students then move on, trust me any worthy airline/charter will understand and appreciate it.
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When I had to switch instructors, it cost me, I dunno, maybe an extra flight for my new CFI to figure out what I knew and what I needed to learn but even that flight was still primarily teaching me something new. Students having to get new CFIs and CFIs having to take on new students who already know something (from having moved into the area or restarting training after some time) shouldn't be a big deal to either side.
 
Every instructor that has left our flight school sat down with the new instructor who was going to take over and talked about where they left off, student's strengths and weakness, progress, and what still needs to be done. It's not like we bolt without telling the student. They are in good hands. I pick the instructors that get to work with my students and pair them with who I think they'll get along with most. I've signed multiple students off that weren't mine from the beginning and they were fine and got their ticket.
 
I live in Houston TX. I have had about 9 instructors as of now. started at one school,flew with about 6 over a 10 month period. (I am picky about instructors because its my money and I want an instructor with good interpersonal skills in the cockpit. continued at a second school, and the 2 CFI's I am flying with now, I will finish with. 2 because of scheduling issues. (I will probably have my checkride in this summer) almost of the instructors at the first school were building time to join the airlines. the two where I fly with now, one has been a corporate pilot(got layed off), and the other flew for a regional airline(got layed off). both are excellent in the cockpit.
 
CC268 said:
Well found out yesterday that my instructor will be gone in two weeks - he almost has his 1500 hours. I knew he would be gone in the next few months, but didn't think it would be this soon!

Anyone else have to switch instructors at some point? I guess the good thing is I am at about 18-20 hours so glad it is happening now and not at the end of my training.
Click to expand...

I deliberately flew with several different instructors on my way to my PPL. All from the same school, so there was coordination between them. Different instructors emphasize different things, note different "bad habits" early in your training, and you learn something new from each of them.
 
James331 said:
You should find it offensive, my comments were directed at folks like you.

You clear your students before you go, they are your charge, you show them the way, you don't desert them.
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Good grief. You're teaching them to fly, not marrying them!! I'm certainly not going to blame a young flight instructor for grabbing the brass ring when it comes around. Most regionals today pay a lot better than most CFI gigs, plus it's the next rung up on the professional pilot career ladder.
 
Easy way to solve the problem is with one small change to 61.51
 
GRG55 said:
I deliberately flew with several different instructors on my way to my PPL. All from the same school, so there was coordination between them. Different instructors emphasize different things, note different "bad habits" early in your training, and you learn something new from each of them.
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This is the main advantage that I had from flying with so many instructors (incl. active airline FOs) for my PPL training. They pointed out different bad habits of me. Also, their conduct in the cockpit was slightly different, so I could see where some difference can be tolerated, but I could also see things that were done exactly the same way by 9 or 10 out of 10 instructors. I concluded that those are the thing that really should be done that way.
And as in your case, they were from the same school, following the same syllabus. Each lesson was also well documented and they trusted completion signatures (and of course verbal confirmation) from their colleagues, so I did not have to redo anything.
 
Do you promise to take this student, to instruct and train, 'till temporary airmen certificate do you part?

I do.

:)
 
Personally I found an independent instructor that is not hour building and instructing is his business because he likes it. It's great to develop a relationship with a CFII that is/will be around for years to come. He nows my shortcomings and what to push on during checkups. I often schedule time with him when I feel rusty in some area of my flying.

Sent from my SM-T320 using Tapatalk
 
GRG55 said:
I deliberately flew with several different instructors on my way to my PPL. All from the same school, so there was coordination between them. Different instructors emphasize different things, note different "bad habits" early in your training, and you learn something new from each of them.
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My instructor deliberately had me fly with other 2 other instructors at the same school before my check ride to make sure we all were on the same page. I learned something important with both of them and flew multiple times with each. Also got used to someone else in the right seat. I think it helped me greatly for becoming a better pilot.
 
James331 said:
You should find it offensive, my comments were directed at folks like you.

You clear your students before you go, they are your charge, you show them the way, you don't desert them.
Click to expand...


You have no right to judge me James. You don't know me. I didn't desert anyone. Just because I wasn't there to be the endorsing instructor at the end does not constitute desertion. I have never left a student in a situation that was detrimental to their training or bottom line. You're being obtuse.

If that's the way you want to do it then fine but that doesn't mean how I handled it was wrong. I bet you would be lots of fun to share a flight deck with on a 4 day. Thankfully avoid lists with scheduling and ignore lists on the internet were created for self righteous, judgmental and ignorant people like you. No need to reply. I won't see it.
 
For me it was likely a good experience having multiple CFI (I think I have flown with four different ones). My primary CFI's had very different approaches to flying. The first one was a very by the numbers guy, very by the book. He would be the instructor saying the pattern should be flown exactly this way, your speed should be this at this point, your RPM's should be set here. For some people that is an ideal instructor, and likely what the commercial people want. He was a great pilot, one of those people who truly did finish their PPL at 40 hours and soloed at like 8.

My second instructor (and current CFI) is all about having the pilot safe and comfortable. He is willing to except that 1700 RPM's on downwind may work better than 1500 RPM's for some people. You may fly your pattern a little bigger or a little tighter (yes still within glide distance). So he is not strict to the books, and seems like fosters a little more get a feeling for the plane as long as your are safe that is OK.
 
Jns_V said:
This is the main advantage that I had from flying with so many instructors (incl. active airline FOs) for my PPL training. They pointed out different bad habits of me. Also, their conduct in the cockpit was slightly different, so I could see where some difference can be tolerated, but I could also see things that were done exactly the same way by 9 or 10 out of 10 instructors. I concluded that those are the thing that really should be done that way.
And as in your case, they were from the same school, following the same syllabus. Each lesson was also well documented and they trusted completion signatures (and of course verbal confirmation) from their colleagues, so I did not have to redo anything.
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Everyone learns differently. For me, just like improving my tennis game, the best way to become a better pilot is for me to fly with as many different pilots/instructors that have more and varied experience than I have. I logged some hours with a corporate pilot jet-jockey friend who has a ton of piston twin time in his past - best focussed instruction on the Aztec I got (and one of these days I am going to make the long trek to Kansas and have Ted teach me some things in the Aztec I don't already know). But not the only twin instructor I used, and I learned something valuable from each of them. Also fortunate to have a younger brother who is an ex-military Hornet pilot and now flies B787s. Among other things, years ago he brought a level of discipline and precision to my checklist and radio usage that stuck & still brings comments from other pilots who fly with me now. Even for a private pilot it can (should?) be a life-long learning process to keep upping the game.
 
My first flight instructor moved on before I solo'd. My second flight instructor had a family issue come up. The second instructor recommended a third that was not the right person for me. I am sure he was knowledgeable but, he was just annoying to be around and I was doing this as a hobby. So I found a third who had a lot of students but, I made myself flexible to meet his schedule. Due to scheduling i ended up with a couple of other random instructors to finish up. It definitely took me longer to complete my training because of this and it was a little frustrating at times. Since I was doing this as simply a hobby with no aviation related career aspirations, it wasn't that big of a deal. Additionally, I believe flying with so many different people taught me more than just flying with one. I also learned that there are a lot areas of interpretation in the aviation world even though many like to preach that there is only one right way. I understand the benefits of sticking with one instructor so in my case, it was simply making lemonade out of lemons.
 
Lol that escalated quickly - anyways good to see the different stories/view points. I think the second instructor I will end up with is quite a bit more meticulous/by the books kind of guy - so it might not be a bad thing to have some more "strict" training on the second half of my training.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
You have no right to judge me James. You don't know me. I didn't desert anyone. Just because I wasn't there to be the endorsing instructor at the end does not constitute desertion. I have never left a student in a situation that was detrimental to their training or bottom line. You're being obtuse.

If that's the way you want to do it then fine but that doesn't mean how I handled it was wrong. I bet you would be lots of fun to share a flight deck with on a 4 day. Thankfully avoid lists with scheduling and ignore lists on the internet were created for self righteous, judgmental and ignorant people like you. No need to reply. I won't see it.
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lol you know that what I said is somewhat true otherwise it wouldn't have effected your ego soo much that you couldn't mentally bear to see what I write.

As far as "the flight deck" goes, I'm a pretty chill guy, I do what I say I'm going to do and believe in honor and loyalty. That said building hours on others dime and ditching them the second you get a better offer is jacked up. Yeah the flying once a month types, whatever, but the commuted students who are logging a good chunk of time with you, you should atleast get their rating knocked out, we're talking a month or so, tell the students and let them step it up too. Trust me a regional will wait, they don't have many other options and if they don't get you wanting to get your guys wrapped up you probably don't want to work for them anyways.
 
James331 said:
lol you know that what I said is somewhat true otherwise it wouldn't have effected your ego soo much that you couldn't mentally bear to see what I write.

As far as "the flight deck" goes, I'm a pretty chill guy, I do what I say I'm going to do and believe in honor and loyalty. That said building hours on others dime and ditching them the second you get a better offer is jacked up. Yeah the flying once a month types, whatever, but the commuted students who are logging a good chunk of time with you, you should atleast get their rating knocked out, we're talking a month or so, tell the students and let them step it up too. Trust me a regional will wait, they don't have many other options and if they don't get you wanting to get your guys wrapped up you probably don't want to work for them anyways.
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Seniority is everything in the airlines. Another month delay can make a big difference. Young CFIs moving on is a simple fact of life in this industry and it has been for a very long time. No need to get all moralistic about it. Based on your previous posts, no one who hasn't earned a Gold Seal shouldn't be considered for an instructor anyway, so he's just doing future students a favor by moving on. :rolleyes:
 
I understand where James is coming from. It's ideal to finish up a student, if you can. When I got hired at the airlines, I was able to finish up everyone but 2 or 3, and they didn't have any trouble going with another CFI and finish. One of them is at Amer Airlines and flies F16s in the ANG. But realty is most CFIs, especially younger ones, are building time so they can move on to a career, and most CFI jobs are not a career. I also understand it's frustrating for a student to have to change CFIs, especially if it's more than once. But as long as the previous CFI smoothly transitions the student to the next CFI there should not be a problem. It really doesn't take a new CFI long to see where a student is at in his/her flying.
 
CC268 said:
Well found out yesterday that my instructor will be gone in two weeks - he almost has his 1500 hours. I knew he would be gone in the next few months, but didn't think it would be this soon!

Anyone else have to switch instructors at some point? I guess the good thing is I am at about 18-20 hours so glad it is happening now and not at the end of my training.
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It happens a lot more than you think. (been there, twice)
It sucks if you clicked very well with the CFI and now have to find another good one. But look at it also from the perspective as learning from different masters: you get to learn different tricks.
Not all hope is lost. :) Shrug it off and get back in the air.
Wishing you good luck in finding another CFI you are compatible with. Now go fly!! :)
 
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