I think I got fired

Tom-D

Tom-D

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Tom-D
I started an annual on a 172 a few days ago, the discrepancy list looked like this.

1 Compression very low on #1 & #3. 20/80 & 0 /80 both exhaust leaks. Bore stop shows burned valves

2 Exhaust muffler has 2, 3" cracks at #2 #4 cylinders exhaust pipe

3 #2 blade of the prop is below minimum blade profile.

4 no entry showing the AD for the oil pump gears

5 brake pucks worn to the rivet heads and grooves in disks beyond limits

6 severe corrosion on wing spars, behind fuel tanks

7 no entry or data on fuel and oil hoses.

I e-mailed the owner and told him I was taking a few Days for me, and left my notes on the wing.

today I get a call, "I do not want you to continue with my annual".

I'm thankful, If he calls back. "I'm busy"
 
Sounds like you dodged a bullet.

I wish I had a video of our A&P the other day. A very old man drove up with a 140 on a trailer that had been ground looped. He got out, walked over and after introductions told Ron " well, I'll unhook the trailer and leave it with you."

Without skipping a beat, Ron said "the hell you will!" You gotta know Ron. He never talks that way. It was funnier than all get out...
 
Were you getting started or was that the complete inspection?

How many hours and when was it last flown?

What will they do now let it corrode? :mad2:

Some folks just don't get it. Ide be busy for a wile, and it may cost them a little extra for changing your schedule.
 
txflyer said:
Sounds like you dodged a bullet.

I wish I had a video of our A&P the other day. A very old man drove up with a 140 on a trailer that had been ground looped. He got out, walked over and after introductions told Ron " well, I'll unhook the trailer and leave it with you."

Without skipping a beat, Ron said "the hell you will!" You gotta know Ron. He never talks that way. It was funnier than all get out...
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Some days it is just too much.
 
AKBill said:
Were you getting started or was that the complete inspection?

Just getting started? not really, I spent pretty much of 1 whole day on it.

How many hours and when was it last flown?
He's been flying it regular, about 6500 TT.

What will they do now let it corrode? :mad2:

i have no idea.

Some folks just don't get it. Ide be busy for a wile, and it may cost them a little extra for changing your schedule.
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Yer right some just fly them until they junkem.
 
Maybe someone told him about what you found and he just decided to junk/part out the plane. I would imagine he was not in a very good mood after hearing that and may not have properly expressed himself?
 
So if he is insistent on you not completing the annual, what are your plans? I imagine it is still in a major state of disassembly / open up. Will you put it back together for him and just charge for your time with no log entry for the annual and no discrepancy list? Will you make some sort of log entry that effectively grounds the aircraft or let him have it back in an assumed state of airworthiness? Do you consider the aircraft to be airworthy? If not, will you either tell him that or document it?
 
I hope you're doing the annual in HIS hangar so you can just eat the time already spent and RUN away.
 
rolivi said:
I hope you're doing the annual in HIS hangar so you can just eat the time already spent and RUN away.
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Except for the "eat the time" part.
 
Sometimes getting fired is a good thing. A very good thing.

Expecting to see a 172 for parts, or maybe ferry home ad in the next week or so up in WA.
 
rolivi said:
I hope you're doing the annual in HIS hangar so you can just eat the time already spent and RUN away.
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Yes it is in his hangar, When I am told to stop work, I stop work.

No I will not bill him.
 
Henning said:
I was told to use calipers and measure it at the places indicated in the manual.
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A&Ps in the field simply call the prop shops for guidance.
 
MotoFlier said:
Maybe someone told him about what you found and he just decided to junk/part out the plane. I would imagine he was not in a very good mood after hearing that and may not have properly expressed himself?
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No one had to tell him, he can read the list I left.

The rules say when I stop any inspection I'm to make an entry When I do not have the records I can't do that.
 
That discrepancy list would be simple to correct. The plane has some deferred maintenance. Lots of planes do.
 
Tom-D said:
Yeah, its just work right?
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So you cherry pick your workload. Your choice. The list on this plane is simple to fix for a mechanic who wants the work and an owner willing to spend some money on parts and labor.
 
Stewartb said:
So you cherry pick your workload.
yes I do.

Your choice.

You bet.

The list on this plane is simple to fix for a mechanic who wants the work and an owner willing to spend some money on parts and labor.
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you'll find neither in this hangar. This owner refuses to spend any money on maintenance, and believes he can fly for ever doing that.
So, I'll just distance my self from him.
 
Tom-D said:
A&Ps in the field simply call the prop shops for guidance.
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CRS has to have the manuals, we had a whole room full of them. It was pretty nice to have really, need some info? Go upstairs and read it.
 
Stewartb said:
That discrepancy list would be simple to correct. The plane has some deferred maintenance. Lots of planes do.
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It's all simple, and all time consuming. It's up to the owner to decide whether paying for that time (and materials) is worthwhile. From the sounds of the list and general condition of the plane as well as current market value of the model, it would cost less to replace with one that doesn't have that list.
 
Henning said:
It's all simple, and all time consuming. It's up to the owner to decide whether paying for that time (and materials) is worthwhile. From the sounds of the list and general condition of the plane as well as current market value of the model, it would cost less to replace with one that doesn't have that list.
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The cost of repairs will depend upon how bad the corrosion of the aft spars are. until some one pulls the fuel tanks, and makes that determination all bets are off as to economics of the repair.

To be a 30K 172, this one will need the corrosion taken care of, engine overhaul, paint glass and radios.
 
Tom-D said:
The cost of repairs will depend upon how bad the corrosion of the aft spars are. until some one pulls the fuel tanks, and makes that determination all bets are off as to economics of the repair.

To be a 30K 172, this one will need the corrosion taken care of, engine overhaul, paint glass and radios.
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You've hit $30k right there, and that's not with modern radios. You can buy a decent older 172 with a 430w for $40k.
 
Tom-D said:
No one had to tell him, he can read the list I left.

The rules say when I stop any inspection I'm to make an entry When I do not have the records I can't do that.
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This brings up a interesting question......

Suppose old Clem brings in a Deathtrap 199 and asks for a annual...

You discover MAJOR issues including stuff that will cause a inflight break up...

You call Clem and tell the old boy his plane is JUNK...

Clem screws the panels back on, lists it in Trade A Plane, some poor family comes along and buys it. They take off,,, airframe fails and they crash and burn to death......

Question #1..

Do you have a moral obligation to inform the FAA of the status of that plane.:dunno:

Question #2..

Do you have a LEGAL obligation to tell ANYONE about the issues...:dunno:

Thanks in advance for the feedback...
 
N801BH said:
This brings up a interesting question......

Suppose old Clem brings in a Deathtrap 199 and asks for a annual...

You discover MAJOR issues including stuff that will cause a inflight break up...

You call Clem and tell the old boy his plane is JUNK...

Clem screws the panels back on, lists it in Trade A Plane, some poor family comes along and buys it. They take off,,, airframe fails and they crash and burn to death......

Question #1..

Do you have a moral obligation to inform the FAA of the status of that plane.:dunno:

Question #2..

Do you have a LEGAL obligation to tell ANYONE about the issues...:dunno:

Thanks in advance for the feedback...
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Question one and two reverse legal and moral obligations to make the answer no to both. If you ask the questions all 4 ways, the only one that possibly comes out yes is the moral obligation to the buyer, and that is a personal choice, as are all moral choices.
 
Are you saying there is NO legal requirement for a FAA licensed A&P mechanic to report a KNOWN issue. :dunno::dunno::dunno:
 
He didn't do the annual. When you walk around a ramp and you see someone's brake pads are thin, do you demand their logs so you can note it?
 
UngaWunga said:
He didn't do the annual. When you walk around a ramp and you see someone's brake pads are thin, do you demand their logs so you can note it?
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I am NOT a licensed FAA A&P........

But,,, If I see a obvious problem with a plane that could / will result in an accident... I sure as hell am going to say something to somebody...:yes:
 
N801BH said:
I am NOT a licensed FAA A&P........

But,,, If I see a obvious problem with a plane that could / will result in an accident... I sure as hell am going to say something to somebody...:yes:
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Sure, as most people would. But would you demand the logs to make note of it?
 
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