I hate my airplane sometimes

ircphoenix

ircphoenix

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ircphoenix
Gorgeous day. Cool. Zero weather. Plane battery is dead. It is only a year old. Get it started. Electronics blinking off at random. Reset master... Everything comes on... Super low volume. Com1's squelch won't turn on so it is just non stop static.

I've spent too much money in the past six months for things to not just work.

Now I get to sit and wait for the mechanic to troubleshoot.
 
ircphoenix said:
I think so. Pinkish with black port things on the top.

Recommend something different?
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If it's only one year old it may not be the battery that is the actual source of the problem.
 
GRG55 said:
If it's only one year old it may not be the battery that is the actual source of the problem.
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My diagnostic work on my aircraft kinda assumed it wasn't the 3 month old battery. Looked at FCU, starter generator, GCU and finally battery. Never buying another gill. I was told by my parts supplier the gills are made in China using recycled lead. I didn't verify his claims but sound reasonable based on the performance of last gill I bought
 
Tarheelpilot said:
My diagnostic work on my aircraft kinda assumed it wasn't the 3 month old battery. Looked at FCU, starter generator, GCU and finally battery. Never buying another gill. I was told by my parts supplier the gills are made in China using recycled lead. I didn't verify his claims but sound reasonable based on the performance of last gill I bought
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Don't know about the Made in China from recycled lead thing, but I've had 24v Gill batteries in the plane for years. Typically get 4 years out of them. I do make sure the fluid levels are always over the plates and I have a battery maintainer/charger if the plane is going to sit for more than a week or two.

Maybe the 12v batteries are Chinese?

Looked at Concorde gel last battery change but it was almost 30% more expensive than a Gill, so I stuck with the direct replacement.

OPs problem could well be the battery, but I think odds are against it since he did get the plane started, which suggests the battery will take a charge.
 
GRG55 said:
Don't know about the Made in China from recycled lead thing, but I've had 24v Gill batteries in the plane for years. Typically get 4 years out of them. I do make sure the fluid levels are always over the plates and I have a battery maintainer/charger if the plane is going to sit for more than a week or two.

Maybe the 12v batteries are Chinese?

Looked at Concorde gel last battery change but it was almost 30% more expensive than a Gill, so I stuck with the direct replacement.

OPs problem could well be the battery, but I think odds are against it since he did get the plane started, which suggests the battery will take a charge.
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Oh no. The mechanic jumped it. And my electronics started acting up. I thought I remembered reading NOT to jump an airplane battery especially since I don't have an avionics master... but what do I know. I'm not an AP IA
 
ircphoenix said:
He does indeed.

Alternator is good. Plane hasn't moved since February 15th. Master was off. It has happened to me before when the plane sat for 10 days.
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10 days sounds too short a time for a battery to discharge if the master is off...unless the plane is sitting outside in very cold weather.
 
ircphoenix said:
Oh no. The mechanic jumped it. And my electronics started acting up. I thought I remembered reading NOT to jump an airplane battery especially since I don't have an avionics master... but what do I know. I'm not an AP IA
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It sounded like from your OP that you were having issues with the avionics before the jump too. Right?
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I was just passing along my personal experiences. Not in any way trying to diagnose their plane based off an internet post.
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I've heard of complaints about Gill batteries from others, including on other threads on this forum. And can't recall anybody saying anything negative about Concorde. That's why I looked into a Concorde last time. But the extra cost was a bit more than I could swallow at the time. And Concorde says I can't use my current battery maintainer on their battery either, so that meant more money out to replace that 24v unit.
 
ircphoenix said:
Negative. The avionics issues were after the jump. Didn't try turning on the avionics before I started the plane.
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What did the ammeter say after the engine started?
 
GRG55 said:
I've heard of complaints about Gill batteries from others, including on other threads on this forum. And can't recall anybody saying anything negative about Concorde. That's why I looked into a Concorde last time. But the extra cost was a bit more than I could swallow at the time. And Concorde says I can't use my current battery maintainer on their battery either, so that meant more money out to replace that 24v unit.
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Mine is 24v as well. The concord was almost 1k more than the gill. Had to get a new battery minder too. This aircraft stuff is expensive
 
Had my Gill for three years and zero problems. Check the specific gravity each annual and water level throughout the year. Sometimes use a maintainer.

So far, I am pleased with the Gill.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Mine is 24v as well. The concord was almost 1k more than the gill. Had to get a new battery minder too. This aircraft stuff is expensive
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My 12V Concorde was only a little over $300 last fall. It replaced my first Concorde, installed 12/2010. I do not own and have never used a battery minder of any type for any vehicle (car, plane, boat, John Deere).
 
ircphoenix said:
That's an excellent question. I was so peeved with the fact that my avionics were on the fritz that I didn't pay attention. But the mechanic said it checked out so....
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If it's everything then
it's something common; power or ground. Check radios with engine off. Check the voltage regulator.
 
MAKG1 said:
Or there is a parasitic drain.
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Cessna sometimes has an issue with that. It's in the external power supply circuit, and involves the diode there. That diode can partially short (it loses its high reverse resistance) and allow a drain that takes days to happen, and lots of time to track down unless you're familiar with it.
 
Went through Either 4 or 5 Gill batteries in 4 years. Sit for two weeks dead battery. Disconnected battery after last flight during which all systems. Checked good. Sat for two weeks, DEAD BATTERY. Gill said there must be a problem with my aircraft even though the battery was disconnected. Installed a Concord, almost 5 years later have had zero problems !!!!!. I would not install another Gill battery in even a riding mower !!!!. Get a Concorde extended cranking amps battery. Higher cost and worth it !!!!!!!!.
 
denverpilot said:
How exactly was it "jumped"?
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I've done my old, pre-Concorde battery using regular cables and a friend's car. Worked fine, except the battery was worn out and needed to be replaced. Got a Concorde in 2010, haven't jumped her since then.
 
Hank S said:
I've done my old, pre-Concorde battery using regular cables and a friend's car. Worked fine, except the battery was worn out and needed to be replaced. Got a Concorde in 2010, haven't jumped her since then.
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Understood, but I was asking the OP because the method of jump could be related to the suspected damage caused to the radios. I've met mechanics who couldn't spell Ohm and shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a power cart. Also met ones who knew what they were doing. How that happens, considering the training required, I have no idea... but I was curious exactly how his mechanic did the "jump".
 
No avionics master on a cherokee? what year is this thing?
 
denverpilot said:
Understood, but I was asking the OP because the method of jump could be related to the suspected damage caused to the radios. I've met mechanics who couldn't spell Ohm and shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a power cart. Also met ones who knew what they were doing. How that happens, considering the training required, I have no idea... but I was curious exactly how his mechanic did the "jump".
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Jumper pack. Hooked directly to the battery under the back seat.

hindsight2020 said:
No avionics master on a cherokee? what year is this thing?
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A decade and a half older than I am.
 
"Jumping" dead batteries in the plane is a time-honored, and usually successful way to get them started. Then flying them gets you charged back up. Yay!

But as a warning, I believe most modern maintenance manuals call for removal of a dead battery for charging.

I think the fear is that once started, the previously dead battery will charge at a prodigious rate, both taxing the plane's charging system and possibly further damaging the battery with a too-high charge rate. Batteries have even been known to explode.

I know, I know...many have done it for years or decades to no ill effect. I've done it more than once.

A good practice for a plane that must dispatch reliably is to have a second, good battery on a trifle charger as a standby - then you're just a quick battery swap away from getting back in the air.

As a further note, modern lithium iron batteries can be rendered useless if allowed to drop below a certain voltage. I don't know the full implications of "jump starting" one of those.
 
ircphoenix said:
Gorgeous day. Cool. Zero weather. Plane battery is dead. It is only a year old. Get it started. Electronics blinking off at random. Reset master... Everything comes on... Super low volume. Com1's squelch won't turn on so it is just non stop static.

I've spent too much money in the past six months for things to not just work.

Now I get to sit and wait for the mechanic to troubleshoot.
Click to expand...
Man, IRC, you sure got the short end of the Cherokee stick...if I recall, you and I got our current planes right about the same time. Not rubbing salt in your wounds, but mine has been a gem....so far, that is. I'm sure my turn will come (everyone gets a turn with these old airplanes at one time or another). Hope things get better for you. Seems like you've repaired enough that there shouldn't be too much more to fix!
 
I will pile on the acccolades for the Concorde over gill battery. Went through two on my Yankee before I switched to Concorde. No problems since.
 
ircphoenix said:
He does indeed.

Alternator is good. Plane hasn't moved since February 15th. Master was off. It has happened to me before when the plane sat for 10 days.
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I don't know if this is A&P kosher stuff but, the easiest way to see if there is a draw somewhere on the batter while all the switches are off is to disconnect the negative lead and touch it back to the battery. If there's an arc/spark or what ever, you have an amperage draw somewhere.

Also...did you ever get a quote to see how much an Avionics master would cost?
 
midcap said:
I don't know if this is A&P kosher stuff but, the easiest way to see if there is a draw somewhere on the batter while all the switches are off is to disconnect the negative lead and touch it back to the battery. If there's an arc/spark or what ever, you have an amperage draw somewhere.

Also...did you ever get a quote to see how much an Avionics master would cost?
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I did not.

AP pulled the battery. It'll take a charge but won't keep one. Concorde battery goes in on Monday.
 
tawood said:
Man, IRC, you sure got the short end of the Cherokee stick...if I recall, you and I got our current planes right about the same time. Not rubbing salt in your wounds, but mine has been a gem....so far, that is. I'm sure my turn will come (everyone gets a turn with these old airplanes at one time or another). Hope things get better for you. Seems like you've repaired enough that there shouldn't be too much more to fix!
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When she flies she flies wonderfully.

But it is always one more thing. First day off I had in good weather for the last two months and... kaput.
 
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