How do you properly purchase an already built kit plane?

[ISaidRightTurns]

After looking at planes to fit my mission for awhile (2 or 4 people, fast with long legs) and asking for advice on a previous thread, I've started looking into kit planes. Particularly the Lancair 360 or the RV-8. The performance for the price is unbelievable. So, what's the draw back? Will some A/Ps shy away from maintenance and inspections? How do you do a proper pre-buy?

Any advice from experience appreciated.

 

[yakdriver]

For anything Vans go to vansairforce.com. There are several experienced guys that could do a pre buy for you. If you are a low time pilot any of the Vans airplanes are easy to fly and you can get insurance at a reasonable price. I fly a friend's Lancair 360 and that is a whole different animal. It is really fast 220kts on around 9gph but is very slippery and has light almost twitchy controls. A check out with a very competent instructor would be required if you are low time. Most A&Ps won't have a problem with a well built homebuilt. Don

 

[FORANE]

I own a Lancair 235/320 and a RV-9A; both purchased built.

The vans forum is a great resource for contacts or anything RV related. Understand though there are those on that forum who pray at the altar RV. From some individuals there you will get a decidedly steadfast one sided opinion and question of limitations of the RV line are sometimes met with disdain.

I recommend you decide what you mission will be and what trade offs you are willing to accept before deciding on a particular plane. Get a recommendation for a A&P beforehand - it need not be an IA. I have had good and bad experiences with A&P's in the past. Get experienced eyes to help with the pre-purchase. Get experienced transition training. I cannot stress this enough, especially for the Lancair.

 

[LDJones]

As mentioned, the on-line forums are great for learning about them, recognizing the inherent biases in each. On purchase, a prebuy by a resident expert is essential. Once owned, most A&Ps can come up to speed pretty quickly on a particular airframe.

 

[JHW]

if you are buying one built from a well-known, established kit manufacturer (and both these are) then it's basically the same proposition as buying a factory-built plane. Whether it's an RV, glasair, beechcraft, or piper, each type has its own peculiarities that you will want to focus on during your inspection. In each case if you aren't familiar with the type, get some help from someone who is.

You will find that the only people who will advise you how "risky" a homebuilt plane is, are people who have never built or owned one.

 

[poadeleted20]

So, what's the draw back?

The drawback is that it's virtually impossible to fully inspect everything which a builder might have done wrong without disassembling the aircraft.

Will some A/Ps shy away from maintenance and inspections?

Yes because they don't want the liability, but most will do the work if they are familiar with the type.

How do you do a proper pre-buy?

The first step is to find out who built the plane and see what their reputation as a builder is. An aircraft built in one of the kit manufacturer sponsored "completion center" may also be a better risk than one built by someone with no prior experience alone in his/her hangar. You also want to find a mechanic very familiar with that type to do the actual pre-purchase inspection.

Any advice from experience appreciated.

Your local EAA chapter is an excellent source of advice in a case like this, as is the type club or other type-specific on-line group.

 

[Velocity173]

I own a Velocity and a Glasair. Doing a prebuy on them isn't much different than a certified. Yeah, you're hoping the builder built the aircraft properly but you what, if it's been flying for years, I think it's a given it was built right. Most, like mine, are built to higher strengths than certified. A 50 yr old metal aircraft or a 20 yr old composite? I'll take the later.

Haven't found any A&Ps who wouldn't work on my aircraft. Lets face it, most expenses come from the engine. Well, they both use Lycomings just like certified. I have my mech comply with any ADs or kit SBs just like any certified. I'd say if anything you'll see A&Ps who prefer to work on EABs because of their simplicity. They have a fraction of the number of parts as their certified brothers.

Drawbacks? 1) Room for one. There's no magic wand that EABs use to overcome drag. It's not rocket science that a Lancair is doing 200 kts on the same engine that propels a C-172 to only 125 kts. When you combine a low frontal area and low CD, you end up with very little drag. The drawback is lack of room. If you can deal with that, fine. 2) Handling. You'll see some are quite squirrely. I know in the past Lancairs used to have a bad rap because of it's handling. That had some pitch sensitivity issues and lateral stability because the tail was too small. Never flown one but I imagine it handlings like my Glasair. You need to appreciate the fact your wing is designed for speed and not lift. You come in hot (80kts) on final and flare is no more than a slight nose up. Don't want to do some big flare like you would in a Cessna. At high AOA these airfoils lose lift quick! 3) Builder quality. If the price looks too good to be true, it's probably because it is. Most likely an aircraft that's older with less than stellar build quality. Not necessarily a dangerous aircraft but not the fit and finish of other newer aircraft. Years ago you saw a lot of interiors that had furniture quality materials, automotive wiring, analog instruments and rattle can paint jobs. Today most are "plug and play." You can buy an entire panel or interior and the paint jobs are showroom quality.

 

[Jimmy cooper]

Same way you buy any airplane. Find someone very familiar with it, preferably a good builder and have them go over it carefully.

 

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

You can't inspect every rivet buried inside the wing. But, based on my (and others) observations, where homebuilts tend to fall short is in the fuel and electrical systems - not the basic structure. A competent A&P should be able to examine those systems and evaluate them compared to standard aircraft practice. (Note: there are some components such as fuel lines where a substitution of SAE grade hose is an upgrade) I wouldn't hurt to have your own A&P look at the airplane before purchase to avoid any YGTBFSM moments at the first condition inspection.

Personally, I did not have a problem with finding someone do my condition inspections and transponder checks.

 

[yakdriver]

The Vans shines in the inspection department because you can see almost every rivet in the airplane. Also the fuel system is well proven and uses standard aluminum tubing and AN fittings. The problem with composite airplanes is you can't see how the layups have been done. Most Lancairs and Glassairs seem to be on the heavy side as most builders think a little more resin makes things stronger. That is wrong as too much resin can actually weaken the structure. The RV 8 has lots of room for both pilot and passenger. The side by side 6,7,9 are about the width of a 172 and comfortable for two with plenty of baggage space. The Lancair 360 is tight but again comfortable once you get settled in. It doesn't have much room for baggage. Don