How Do Airplane Brokers Work

Geico266

Geico266

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Geico
I've been looking for a new plane. New mission, new plane. I have tried to contact 2 brokers to ask questions about specific planes they have listed. I get no replies. :dunno:

The planes are not on their lot like a car, so do they list the plane and the owner shows it?

How do I get answers to questions about the plane? Contact the owner directly?

Best techniques for negotiation a price?
 
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Usually the broker will not put you in touch with the buyer,until he determines if you are a buyer or tire kicker. The broker will usually get any answers to your questions from the seller. The broker will want to be involved in the negotiations on price. Remember he is trying to protect his commission.
 
Geico266 said:
I've been looking for a new plane. New mission, new plane. I have tried to contact 2 brokers to ask questions about specific planes they have listed. I get no replies. :dunno:

The planes are not on their lot like a car, so do they list the plane and the owner shows it?

How do I get answers to questions about the plane? Contact the owner directly?

Best techniques for negotiation a price?
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Id contact the owner, most brokers I've dealt with are.. well... kinda lacking.

You can always run the N number and intellus the phone number if the broker wont play ball.

http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNum_Inquiry.aspx
http://www.intelius.com/

How to negotiate price?! That's like asking me how to ask a girl out, by the time you have been on the earth long enough that you have the money to buy a plane you should know how to negotiate a price :D
 
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frfly172 said:
Usually the broker will not put you in touch with the buyer,until he determines if you are a buyer or tire kicker. The broker will usually get any answers to your questions from the seller. The broker will want to be involved in the negotiations on price. Remember he is trying to protect his commission.
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They're also trying to sell planes that they probably have zero emotional attachment to. I tried to buy from broker(s). It seems the planes they had were overpriced and the owners had given up and the brokers job was to try to talk the owner down to earth.

There's a guy on BT who seems to know how to move mid-to-high end bo's and barons well.
 
How did you contact them ? By phone or via the useless 'contact me' button on the various websites ?

Most brokers are not so much 'brokers' as they are commissioned salespeople. Some of them actually broker deals in the sense of them having folks on the buying and selling side of the deal, this can result in chain-deals with several aircraft changing hands in the same transaction.

Some crooked actors in the business. Others are not really serious, they have a bread job with the airlines and only represent their clients planes in the time between trips.
 
ChitDisturber said:
Id contact the owner, most brokers I've dealt with are.. well... kinda lacking.

You can always run the N number and intellus the phone number if the broker wont play ball.

http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNum_Inquiry.aspx
http://www.intelius.com/

How to negotiate price?! That's like asking me how to ask a girl out, by the time you have been on the earth long enough that you have the money to buy a plane you should know how to negotiate a price :D
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This is what I'm finding. They are as worthless as a screen door on a RV-10. :lol:

I am going to contact the seller directly and call out the " dealers" .

Funny how sellers will call a buyer a " tire kicker" after they explain the damage history. :lol:
 
I'm sure most brokers assume everyone is a tirekicker until they get the second call - few tire kickers pick up the phone twice. . . . so they ignore the first call always.

Several rules:

Deposits are not necessary until you have an agreement - and then - never to the broker - the money goes to escrow with clear instructions

Written contracts- always.

Never trust anyone.
 
This is what I dont get. Every cal is a potential sale, the problem is these lazy losers dont have a multiple listing service to look for other planes that the buyer might want if the plane they called about doesn't work.

List the plane and hope it sells. Most listings appear to be from sellers who really Don!t care to sell. Pretty sad in todays internet world.
 
Contacting the owner may not get you far. They hired a broker so they don't have to deal with the tire kickers, at times the owner is an estate anyway.
 
weilke said:
Contacting the owner may not get you far. They hired a broker so they don't have to deal with the tire kickers, at times the owner is an estate anyway.
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This is what I don't get. They list the plane, but it stays with the owner. If I want to look at the plane the owner has to show it to me. All they do is slow down the process. :dunno:
 
Geico266 said:
This is what I don't get. They list the plane, but it stays with the owner. If I want to look at the plane the owner has to show it to me. All they do is slow down the process. :dunno:
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No, they shield the owner from the 99 tire-kicker calls and emails before there is one actual serious lead.
Some brokers house the aircraft for the seller to move the process along.

Did you call the brokers in question (I mean on a phone, the kind you speak into) ? The conversion rate from the 'contact seller' button on the trade sites is so low that I can understand why some brokers dont waste time on answering them.

Selling through a broker is not for everyone. I do know that if you have a nice Bo or Baron and you list it with Carolina Aircraft sales or Neal Schwartz, it'll be sold in a month and all you have to do is to fedex someone a hangar key and wait for the wire transfer to come in. For some people, that is worth taking a couple of percentage points off the price for the brokers fee and ferry cost, for some it isn't. The folks who use a broker tend to have better things to do than to answer the 25th email asking for pdfs of the logs from day one just to be never heard from again after you send them out.
 
weilke said:
No, they shield the owner from the 99 tire-kicker calls and emails before there is one actual serious lead.
Click to expand...

But of those 99 tire kickers betcha 10 would have been buyers if the broker was more useful.
 
I've never bought an airplane through a broker. I had Kansas Aircraft sell my Malibu and I will do it again on the next sale. I didn't want the " what's your bottom dollar calls".
 
I have purchased all my airplanes from dealers ,usually with trades involved. When the dealer owns it either new or used they have incentive. Have worked a few brokers on clean deals and when you start to negotiate price they loose interest. Made an offer to a broker who had a maintenance shop ,the broker wouldn't even make the offer to the owner.after viewing the airplane promised 7k in work to the broker.Owner ended up taking less for the airplane than my offer and still got stuck for the repairs.
 
As a full-time broker/dealer, I can agree that every call is a potential sale. We answer our phones and emails promptly, unless we're flying :). When we broker someone's plane, we always encourage the owner to reposition the plane on our ramp or in our hangar for better exposure and to allow us to efficiently show the plane. Many sellers, however, are still flying their plane on a regular basis and need easier access to it. Thus, we are at their mercy to show the plane. There is no right/wrong way to do it; each buyer or seller is unique so we have to stay flexible.

There is a MLS of sorts for aircraft, but it will only find about 1/3 of the planes on the market because of the FSBO or the small brokers that don't pay to have their listings found.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
They work just like a used car dealer.
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Not really. For the most part they sell planes they dont hold title to. A used aircraft dealer cares about the price the deal happens at, the aircraft broker only cares that the deal happens (and that he gets his commission).
 
Geico266 said:
This is what I don't get. They list the plane, but it stays with the owner. If I want to look at the plane the owner has to show it to me. All they do is slow down the process. :dunno:
Click to expand...

I am in this situation. I am putting together a partnership. I have made contact with some brokers that appear good, but others are rude and unprofessional. There will be one happy broker, and others who may eventually realize the adage "too little too late". I am not impressed with the buying process so far. Guess no one is interested in a sale of something north of $100k
 
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