Holding over PNT at 3,000'

[ApacheBob]

Today, I was under the hood, holding over PNT at 3,000'. I needed the practice.
My instructor was saying that holding pattern entries are a hot topic among instructors. Pilots are so busy trying to figure out which entry to complete that they get confused.
It seems like a tear-drop entry works almost any time that a direct entry is a no-go. Is this what you are hearing?
ApacheBob

 

[tonycondon]

thats usually what i teach Bob. I agree with your instructors feelings on hold entries. A whole lot of thinking to do a pretty simple thing.

 

[poadeleted20]

If you're arriving from a significant angle off on the protected side, trying a teardrop can land you way on the unprotected side before you complete the inbound turn, especially if there's a wind blowing across the pattern toward the unprotected side. Enough to put you out of the protected airspace? Probably not at 90 knots, but maybe yes at 150-200.

If you're going to do this, you have to be very careful to monitor the CDI needle, and if you don't see it flop sides (i.e., show that you got to the protected side) before you start the inbound turn, you have to turn the other way (i.e., essentially turn it into a parallel entry). Otherwise, you'll be making what amounts to a parallel entry on the wrong side, and if conditions are adverse, you could spill out of the protected space.

For that reason, I'll stick to teaching folks all three "standard" entries and encouraging them to use the most appropriate one for the arrival course.

 

[Bill]

For that reason, I'll stick to teaching folks all three "standard" entries and encouraging them to use the most appropriate one for the arrival course.

If you use the King pencil trick, it is not hard to quickly determine the entry. I also like the following:

If you have to turn left to stay in the protected area, you're doing a parallel entry. If you turn right to stay in the protected area, you're doing a teardrop entry. Left pattern opposite.

 

[JustinPinnix]

It's really not that hard to remember all three. Just visualize where you are and where the inbound leg and protected side are and use some common sense. I think people make too big of a deal about this and come up with mnemonics that are hard to remember. The one thing you absolutely must do is stay within the protected space.

But, if you were to not use one of them, I'd axe the teardrop entry for the reasons Capt. Ron lists.

 

[ghogue]

If you're arriving from a significant angle off on the protected side, trying a teardrop can land you way on the unprotected side before you complete the inbound turn, especially if there's a wind blowing across the pattern toward the unprotected side. Enough to put you out of the protected airspace? Probably not at 90 knots, but maybe yes at 150-200.

If you're going to do this, you have to be very careful to monitor the CDI needle, and if you don't see it flop sides (i.e., show that you got to the protected side) before you start the inbound turn, you have to turn the other way (i.e., essentially turn it into a parallel entry). Otherwise, you'll be making what amounts to a parallel entry on the wrong side, and if conditions are adverse, you could spill out of the protected space.

For that reason, I'll stick to teaching folks all three "standard" entries and encouraging them to use the most appropriate one for the arrival course.

Agree completely. Seems to me that when most folks state the easiest way to enter is "just turn the shortest way to the outbound", or that the standard entries are recommended and therefore not mandatory, they often do not know the correct method. I know this is not true for everyone, but in my experience, it's usually the case.

There is a reason the standard entries were developed and to me, it's just wiser to use them. I honestly do not understand why people have such a difficult time with holding entries, but it seems to span all experience levels.

 

[infotango]

The parallel entry has its advantages.
My instructor told me to picture the holding pattern on the DG.

The center of the DG is the fix, and you "draw" the pattern around the heading that you use for the pattern. You can easily see how the pattern will be in relation to your current heading, so it's pretty easy to figure out which entry will work best.
Hopefully it will help you too.

 

[spiderweb]

Today, I was under the hood, holding over PNT at 3,000'. I needed the practice.
My instructor was saying that holding pattern entries are a hot topic among instructors. Pilots are so busy trying to figure out which entry to complete that they get confused.
It seems like a tear-drop entry works almost any time that a direct entry is a no-go. Is this what you are hearing?
ApacheBob

Why would this be so?

 

[ApacheBob]

Why would this be so?

I think that holding pattern entries are a hot topic because the pattern entry takes the pilot out of a point-to-point navigation into flying-in-circles navigation.